Given that these franchises are now management contracts that are micromanaged by DfT, how many of these things are actually in GWR's power to change?

1) I suggest that increasing staff is probably subject to DfT approval, and even then would take many months.
2) Yes as far as I can see this is down to GWR
3) I am not sure where they are going to get these from at certain times.  The bus/coach industry is cut-throat and a company that has vehicles and drivers sat around is likely to go out of business very quickly. 
4) Again DfT have demanded that they reduce the number of trains in service to cut costs.  That is why the HSTs have largely gone and other so called surplus stock. 

 
Following up on a-driver's comments on the transfer of some of the class 387s, I am afraid this seemed inevitable. The fleet was procured when it was anticipated not only that electrification would get to Oxford, but also would extend to the Windsor, Marlow, Henley and Basingstoke branches. The Elizabeth Line has also absorbed quite a proportion of GWR stopping train traffic east of Reading.

The result has been that services west of Reading that 10 years ago were run by 3 car Turbos now run often with very lightly loaded 387s. Some have (of course) already been reallocated to Heathrow Express duties, but the rolling stock shortage across GWR territory extends to all non-electrified Thames Valley services too (remember the 769s?).

The contrast with the glacial progress in introducing the 185s further west is striking. If all that I have learned as a member of this forum over the years, this bears the fingerprints of DfT. Will GBR, when it eventually takes over do better (or be allowed to)?

 

I'm often less than impressed with decisions operators make during disruption, but I genuinely don't think that minimising repayment claims figures highly, other than as a by-product of the underlying "how can we best sort out this mess?", for which there are various meanings of the word "best".  Where the cost more directly affects the response is likely to be in areas such as arranging alternative transport (bus, taxi etc), for which there are probably guidelines on severity/timescale of disruption etc and someone will need to authorise it.  Staff overtime may be another area, though working time limits will restrict that anyway.

 

GWR were instructed to release the 387's by the DfT.  As Oxford wasn't electrified the DfT calculated that GWR had a surplus of 387's


There was I believe, a points failure at Didcot with no access from Reading to Oxford.  Trains used Foxhall Jn which requires a reversal and free platforms at Didcot.


Multiple failures at Didcot, Maidenhead and Ladbroke Grove simply means a constantly changing situation and an overstretched controller juggling resources and attempting to perform miracles!

Decision are never made to benefit the company.  The controllers sole intention is trying to keep things moving with what you've, some days whatever decision you make minutes later something else happens that scuppers that plan. 

 
A miserable couple of days relying on the UK train service.

I’ll start elsewhere and then bring it back to GWR towards the end.

I needed to go to Cambridge on Thursday (actually a day early than needed but the extortionate day return price meant going a day before was 1/2 the price).

My Thames Valley stopper gave up at Reading - no reason given, just an announcement from the Driver pulling into Reading. Not to worry - hustled across to platform 10/11 to catch a fast 5 car IEP at 12:34, pausing briefly to notice the number of delayed services on the list. Hmmm - glad I went now as later on could be a mess.

Arrived at King Cross at the start of a major meltdown - the next 3 Cambridge Great Northern train all delayed/cancelled. RTT actually showed all running. Message on the boards said due to a signal failure journeys north of Cambridge would be delayed and subject to cancellation.

Hmmm - but surely running to Cambridge should be fine? Jumped onto OTT and started looking at the maps and it was clear the issue was at the Kings Cross/Cambridge box boundary - south of Cambridge, hence no trains. Gate line staff were pretty hopeless, basically telling people to wait. Jumped onto National Rail where they said fault would not be fixed until 10:00 pm

I started sharing this with other stranded customers - amazingly much to the clear annoyance of the Great Northern staff.

Back onto RTT/OTT - and worked out that if I jumped on the Victoria line to Tottenham Hale I could catch a slow all station stopper from Liverpool Street to Cambridge. Yes it was going to take forever - but I should get there.

Apart from a protracted discussion with Great Anglia gate line staff who had to be convinced that this was a valid route for my ticket I arrived at Cambridge at 5pm (to a scene of armageddon as hundreds stood in the longest queues for taxis to Royston from which trains to Kings X were running.

In total my 2:15 scheduled journey took 5 1/2 hours.

Friday was the return trip - leaving Cambridge at 1:00pm on a GWR liveried  Class 387, albeit with logo removed. I actually spotted 3 more on this trip - I was unaware GWR were transferring these to other operators. Even the WiFi onboard was GWR, so it must be a recent movement.

Kudos to Network Rail who had repaired the signalling interface problem and it’s was a smooth, fast 45 trip to Kings Cross and then onto Paddington.

Arriving at 2:30pm the Thames Valley Didcot stopped was cancelled - alongside several others. Again, back onto RTT and I could see the train actually scheduled to start from Reading.

So why were GWR announcements saying to wait for the next train in 30 minutes.

Jumped into a 10 car IEP bound for Penzance and actually found a seat ! Things were looking up and a smooth ride to Reading took place. This where the GWR customer experience really bottomed out.

I arrived to see the train I was trying to catch showing for Platform 12. Five minutes after the supposed departure  this changed to Delayed - which a s everyone knows is GWR speak for a coin-toss as to whether the train will depart or not.

Some disgruntled customers started merging to for a group to get a taxi to Pangborne - as the previous train has been cancelled.

Time ticked by the the next service was due - but it too fell to the dreaded Delayed banner. I started talking to some friendly GWR staff who like me were glued to their OTT like app trying to work out what the hell was going on.

We finally got an announcement - as they officially Cancelled the first train I was going for - to say there was an issue as Reading Traincare meaning units could not be released. By now the next service has appeared and was showing as Delayed.

To summarise - for at least 2 hours GWR had failed to run 4 local services to Didcot.

Finally, around 4pm Class 387’s started emerging from Reading Traincare.

Excellent news, or so I thought - surely at least one of these units would service the crowd of hundred customers on Platform 12 and send a train to Didcot. (By this time I have seen a service at Slough, in bound).

But No! GWR sent all these units (I witnessed at least 3) towards London.

At 4:30 I board the Class 387 - the one that arrived from Slough. This was a sauna as the aircon on-board was not working and people arriving fell out of the train gasping for air, and issuing us dire warnings.

So here is my ire (in no particular order)

Why oh why didn’t GWR send a unit to Didcot once they had overcome the Traincare issues?  Is it because those poor customers who had been stranded at Reading for 2 hours were already a lost cause in terms of repayment claims - so to minimise the damage to the GWR coffers it was better to send units to London?

Why at Paddington did they not tell customers that the cancelled train would start at Reading (OK - it did not in the end but did they know that at that point in time?)

Why do customer service facing staff have no better (and in some cases less) information that Joe Public? If I wasn’t aware of RTT or OTT I would be completely at the whim of the train companies

Why are GWR 387s being released elsewhere when they can’t hold/recover the timetable together with the stock they have.

… I could go on.

I have watched and read much on the coming of Great British Railways - and have been neutral about the pros and cons. Privatisation has brought investment to the railway (alongside large shareholder payouts) but this investment has done nothing to allow the railways to continue to operate on days when it is stressed. So what is the point? Maybe public ownership will correct some my experiences - but maybe not.

But most importantly I want a railway that puts customers FIRST and the banishment of operational decisions that benefit no one except the train operating company themselves.

I’ve written this 24 hours after arriving home - giving at lease my blood pressure time to fall, if not the actual temperature. My original draft was far far more spicey.

 

In the short term only.

The problem is, GWR have too many depots in some areas fighting over too little work which is why they’ve had to take route knowledge away.
A driver for example can do 4 hours (I think) continuous driving,  a well run company would strive to get close to that getting the most productivity out of a driver. 

In the good old days!
Driver 1 would drive A to E and take would take, for argument sake, 4 hours.  Then a break, and then 4 hours back E to A.

What you have now is something like:
Driver 1 goes A to B, then 30 minute break, then drives B to A, 30 minute break etc etc
Driver 2 does the B to C, 30 minute break, then drives C to B etc
Driver 3 does C to D etc
Driver 4 does D to E etc
As you see, half their day could see them sitting around doing nowt.  When there’s service disruption, all 4 drivers are in the wrong place which leaves trains stranded or perhaps Driver 2 doesn’t work their Sunday and the whole service is cancelled.

 
Thanks Chris - I should have guessed there was an HS2-related discussion ongoing somewhere.

 
Scotsman specials running as scheduled today, Saturday 12th July 2025.

Tomorrow would normally have been a standard WSR running day but they are instead running Flying Scotsman services for those who missed out on Friday. All affected passengers were given the option of the travelling on Sunday or a full refund.

 

Fewer routes to learn saves time in route learning and route refresh days. So instead of taking 50 days to route learn it takes 30 and a driver is productive for those extra 20 days.

 

It doesn’t, that’s why it’s baffling decision.

Removing route knowledge from crew increases the number of crew you actually need to run the service.   

 
Of course neither line was blocked - quite the opposite.  There were no trains available to run on them - so they were totally clear. 

 
How does taking routes off traincrew save money?

 

Yes, I’m aware. I had routes taken off me too. I believe only the LTV depots didn’t lose routes in May.

 

They’ve taken routes off several depots….. and immediately felt the consequences!  Staff questioned this with management at the time and they were told this was a “decision based on the needs of the businsss”.   

That level of decision making is what cost First Group the TPE franchise.

 

Interestingly the banner headline on GWR seems to imply multiple failings on GWRs part.

1) failed to have enough serviceable staff
2) failed to update journey planners in timely way
3) failed to hire in replacement buses (or coaches, or charter train)
4) what trains they run will be busy because not lengthening them

And what do they mean by "Your comfort and safety are our priority.  Please check live updates...."   is that PR speak for we can't be bothered to get you there.

https://www.gwr.com/sunday-disruption

 


Yes, but guards only, and there are only a few of them down there. Taking Weymouth (and Gloucester) off Bristol drivers and Melksham off Gloucester drivers certainly raised a few eyebrows in May.

 
And:
https://x.com/chimewhistle/status/1943983000024142016?s=61
Anyone able to explain the benefits of GWR doing this from a PASSENGER point of view? So far since the summer timetable change in May, the Heart of Wessex line reliability has gone down with trains either starting or terminating at Westbury.

See: https://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=30417.msg363068
and https://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=30356.0

 

No

 
From Twitter/X
(https://x.com/chimewhistle/status/1943976506255921278?s=61&t=VlafMC5gF9tidw36b1Y8JQ)

Is there still a GWR crew depot at Weymouth?

 
UPDATE: Both lines are now open.

 

Indeed - but the word "should" can cover a whole host of evils.  They "should" have enough staff in the right place, at the right time, with the right route knowledge and other training, and enough working trains, to provide a full service in all but the most exceptional circumstances.

 
Being the last train of the day AND knowing there will be day trippers from Weymouth, onward travel from Westbury should be made available?

 

The lines may have been open but certainly around 1900 when I arrived trying to reach West Drayton, nothing was running on the relief lines with TfL having given up completely. Only reported delay was west of Reading, and nothing had been mentioned in the banner on the NRE app or I'd have taken a very different route from my starting point of Alton having already had to detour thanks to two successive GWR cancellations on the line from Gatwick.  The information booth seemed to know less than I could work out from the departure screens and kept telling people to ask gateline staff; I'd expected the booth would at least have a feed of the signal diagram showing actual locations, train running info etc.  Eventually got on an eastbound IET which I'm sure was shown as calling additionally at Slough to get me closer, but ran non-stop to Paddington. By that time Lizzie trains were running west to Heathrow via Hayes so took that option followed by a bus. Fortunately I was in no hurry and the trains had working air conditioning.

 

Our risk assessment has been NOT to market day trips from Melksham to Weymouth at present due to the significant risk of people having a severely upset trip in one or both directions.  The other part of the risk assessment related to how bad the effect of the risk would be.   The next train from Westbury to Melksham as I understand it is 34 hours later;  robust passengers who know what they are doing could travel on to Bath and catch the 23:20 bus into Melksham at midnight.  And in theory there will be/ would be station staff around to help with onward transport, which in the evening sometimes involves a wait of 90 minutes.

I wish our decision had not been vindicated. And a corollary question is to ask what to do - as a community where we want to use the train -  about this state of affairs. 

 

But don't forget, as we are repeatedly told, apparently there is no shortage of staff 

 
Gosh, never mind tomorrow, not much of a service today.

 
16:23 Westbury to Swindon due 17:05
16:23 Westbury to Swindon due 17:05 will be cancelled.
This is due to a shortage of train crew

17:35 Swindon to Westbury due 18:18
17:35 Swindon to Westbury due 18:18 will be cancelled.
This is due to a shortage of train crew.

18:35 Westbury to Swindon due 19:17
18:35 Westbury to Swindon due 19:17 will be cancelled.
This is due to a shortage of train crew.

19:38 Weymouth to Swindon due 22:00
19:38 Weymouth to Swindon due 22:00 will be terminated at Westbury.
It will no longer call at Trowbridge, Melksham, Chippenham and Swindon.
This is due to a shortage of train crew.

19:44 Swindon to Westbury due 20:29
19:44 Swindon to Westbury due 20:29 will be cancelled.
This is due to a shortage of train crew.

22:12 Swindon to Westbury due 22:55
22:12 Swindon to Westbury due 22:55 will be cancelled.
This is due to a shortage of train crew.

 
Friday July 11

The late running continued into the evening, though little was reported on JourneyCheck.

1P24 09:56 Great Malvern to London Paddington (12:23) : delayed approaching Paddington, arrived +24
1P26 10:59 Great Malvern to London Paddington (13:25) : held Oxford (+14), arrived +27.
1P30 13:16 Worcester Shrub Hill to London Paddington (15:22) : departed +10, held Didcot (+24), arrived +25.
1P04 13:18 Hereford to London Paddington (16:24) : held Reading (+20), arrived +20.
1P05 15:18 Hereford to Paddington (18:29) : departed +56, arrived Oxford +76 and cancelled thereafter.
1P38 16:32 Great Malvern to London Paddington (19:29) : departed +29, held Norton, saved 16-minute stand at Moreton, arrived +34.
1P39 17:26 Worcester Foregate Street to London Paddington (19:52) : held Norton (+26), saved 10 at Moreton, held on Didcot avoiding line (+25), arrived +29.
1P40 18:02 Worcester Foregate Street to London Paddington (20:29) : held Norton (+22), Charlbury (+41), arrived +53.
2E16 18:51 Evesham to Oxford : held Charlbury (+35), arrived +31.
1P42 19:02 Great Malvern to London Paddington (21:26) : started from Shrub Hill, held Charlbury (+15), arrived +27.
1P44 19:45 Great Malvern to London Paddington (22:24) : started from Shrub Hill (+21), saved 8 at Charlbury, arrived +12.
1P46 20:56 Worcester Foregate Street to London Paddington (23:29) : started from Worcester Shrub Hill.

1W01 09:52 London Paddington to Hereford (12:46) : delayed before Oxford (+18), arrived +23.
1W21 10:53 London Paddington to Worcester Shrub Hill (13:01) : delayed before Oxford (+16), arrived +17.
1W02 11:52 London Paddington to Hereford (14:44) : held Oxford (+16), Great Malvern (+31), Ledbury (+53), arrived +66.
1W27 13:50 London Paddington to Great Malvern (16:15) : departed +19, arrived +28.
1W29 14:53 London Paddington to Worcester Foregate Street (17:04) : delayed before Oxford (+11), arrived +16.
1W30 15:23 London Paddington to Worcester Foregate Street (17:47) : held Evesham (+14), arrived Shrub Hill +13, Foregate Street +7.
1W31 15:52 London Paddington to Great Malvern (18:26) : departed +11, held Evesham (+27), arrived +27.
2E14 17:04 Didcot Parkway to Evesham (18:23) : arrived +16.
1W33 16:58 London Paddington to Great Malvern (19:25) : delayed before Didcot, held on avoiding line (+77), arrived Worcester Shrub Hill +77 and cancelled thereafter.
1W03 17:34 London Paddington to Hereford (20:25) : delayed before Reading (+25), +49 at Oxford, held Wolvercote (+56), arrived +70.
1W34 17:57 London Paddington to Worcester Foregate Street (20:11) : delayed before Didcot, Oxford +31, held Wolvercote (+40), arrived Shrub Hill +58 and cancelled thereafter.
1W36 18:57 London Paddington to Great Malvern (21:18) : cancelled throughout.
1W41 20:52 London Paddington to Great Malvern (23:13) : departed +43, arrived +34.

 
I’ll take a guess at air con (or air cooling) failures on an already extremely stretched fleet. 

 
Less 150s seem to be available. There are up to 5 turbos now operating on the Devon Metro.

Maybe all the 150s elsewhere being scrapped need cannibalising.