First Great Western announces extra capacity across network

[whole diary]

[John R]

Agree, you can spot them a mile off, the carpets even feel softer on the feet. A more subtle difference (at least whilst the interiors look so new) is the additional luggage space instead of a toilet. Appreciate there were technical reasons why a toilet wasn't possible, but maybe a sign of things to come?

A rather critical report on Meridian Tonight of the impact of the extra capacity, the web version of which somewhat amusingly refers to First South Western.

[IndustryInsider]

A rather critical report on Meridian Tonight of the impact of the extra capacity, the web version of which somewhat amusingly refers to First South Western.

Have you got a link to the online article?

[Chris from Nailsea]

It's at http://www.itv.com/news/meridian/story/2012-09-24/misery-monday-for-rail-commuters/ 

[Louis94]

It's at http://www.itv.com/news/meridian/story/2012-09-24/misery-monday-for-rail-commuters/ 

8am train ay? Don't seem to be able to find that one!

If people continue to travel on the same train, of course they wont notice any difference! Time they went outside of their own comfort zone and use a different service!

[IndustryInsider]

You'd need 45000 extra seats a day to get everyone a seat from Reading to London in the peaks, not 4500!  Waiting for the next train really isn't worth it as it's usually just as bad - pretty much all of the fast departures from Reading to Paddington between 07:00 and 08:30 have people standing on them, and it just takes a delay or cancellation to one of them and you have scenes like those portrayed in the article when several hundred are waiting for the next train by the time it arrives.

There are occasions where passengers don't help themselves though, for example I watched the 18:50 PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains)-OXF^» (Oxford - next trains) depart Paddington last week.  The back of the train was jam packed full of standees, so much so that you could hardly see that there was a buffet counter somewhere in amongst them.  Go forward as far a coaches A and B though and there were literally dozens of seats available.  Perhaps FGW^▸ (First Great Western) should do more to let people know that is the case?  I certainly think that would be one benefit to swapping round the location of First Class as loadings in Standard Class would be more even.

[Super Guard]

There are occasions where passengers don't help themselves though, for example I watched the 18:50 PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains)-OXF^» (Oxford - next trains) depart Paddington last week.  The back of the train was jam packed full of standees, so much so that you could hardly see that there was a buffet counter somewhere in amongst them.  Go forward as far a coaches A and B though and there were literally dozens of seats available.  Perhaps FGW^▸ (First Great Western) should do more to let people know that is the case?  I certainly think that would be one benefit to swapping round the location of First Class as loadings in Standard Class would be more even.

There have been seats on the 08.08 from Reading to Paddington on a Friday many a time - even if I walk through the vestibules where people are crammed and tell them what seats are still free (even 2 together), I get thanked for the info, but they still will not move.

I guess having FC^‡(resolve) at the front would mean with the TM^‡(resolve) dispatching in the van at the rear, would lead to a free-for-all in FC until Reading...

[johoare]

I've actually not seen any extra carriages on any rush hours trains from Maidenhead that I have travelled on.. I did ask via Facebook and FGW^▸ (First Great Western) on there (thanks Jo and Olllie) also weren't able to get someone to give them that information.. It does make me wonder where the extra carriages are... I am pretty sure they aren't on Maidenhead Rush hour trains... But I can't tell for sure..

[IndustryInsider]

I've actually not seen any extra carriages on any rush hours trains from Maidenhead that I have travelled on.. I did ask via Facebook and FGW^▸ (First Great Western) on there (thanks Jo and Olllie) also weren't able to get someone to give them that information.. It does make me wonder where the extra carriages are... I am pretty sure they aren't on Maidenhead Rush hour trains... But I can't tell for sure..

Easy way to tell.  If coach 'F' is standard class with a small buffet counter at one end, then that train would, until recently, have only had 5 standard carriages, but will now have 6.

If coach 'F' is half 1st Class and half buffet, then it is a set that hasn't been lengthened.

[IndustryInsider]

I've actually not seen any extra carriages on any rush hours trains from Maidenhead that I have travelled on.. I did ask via Facebook and FGW^▸ (First Great Western) on there (thanks Jo and Olllie) also weren't able to get someone to give them that information.. It does make me wonder where the extra carriages are... I am pretty sure they aren't on Maidenhead Rush hour trains... But I can't tell for sure..

Just to follow up on my post from last night, I did a bit of research regarding seating increases on the Maidenhead to Paddington route this morning, compared with a morning early last December before any of the additional carriages and trains had arrived.  It includes all services timed to arrive at Paddington between 06:30 and 10:30.  As far as I know both mornings were free of disruption and short formations.  I know Maidenhead commuters are mostly interested in the fast services, but I've also included the slow services as well in a separate table as they are critical at stations further down the line.

Fast services (those that take 30 minutes or less):
06:10dep 06:36arr  Now: 5   Was: 3  (Now a Class 180, so actual seating remains roughly the same)
06:31dep 06:54arr  Now: 5   Was: 4
06:43dep 07:08arr  Now: 8   Was: 8   (Now a HST^▸ (High Speed Train) with 5x Standard Class - same amount)
07:03dep 07:29arr  Now: 6   Was: 5
07:08dep 07:30arr  Now: 8   Was: 7   (Now a HST with 6x Standard Class - increase of 1)
07:18dep 07:43arr  Now: 5   Was: 3
07:31dep 07:57arr  Now: 5   Was: 5
08:00dep 08:26arr  Now: 8   Was: 8   (Now a HST with 6x Standard Class - increase of 1)
08:04dep 08:28arr  Now: 4   Was: 3
08:34dep 08:58arr  Now: 5   Was: 3   (Now a Class 180, so actual seating remains roughly the same)
09:03dep 09:27arr  Now: 3   Was: 3

So, on the fast trains that's an increase in the total number of carriages by 10 from 52 to 62.  If you remove the extra Class 180 carriages as they don't add anything to the capacity (although they do to the general comfort!) then it's an increase of 6 carriages, which I estimate equates to a total of 530 extra seats each morning peak.

Slow services:
05:53dep 06:31arr  Now: 2   Was: 2
05:58dep 06:46arr  Now: 3   Was: 3
06:21dep 07:09arr  Now: 3   Was: 3
06:29dep 07:17arr  Now: 3   Was: 3
06:46dep 07:32arr  Now: 4   Was: 3
06:53dep 07:44arr  Now: 6   Was: 3
07:13dep 07:49arr  Now: 5   Was: 3
07:17dep 08:04arr  Now: 6   Was: 3
07:24dep 08:16arr  Now: 5   Was: 5
07:41dep 08:21arr  Now: 5   Was: 5
07:45dep 08:32arr  Now: 6   Was: 6
07:49dep 08:36arr  Now: 5   Was: 5   (Used to depart at 07:54 and arrive at 08:47)
08:11dep 08:48arr  Now: 5   Was: 3   (Now a Class 180, so actual seating remains roughly the same)
08:26dep 09:16arr  Now: 5   Was: 4
08:41dep 09:21arr  Now: 3   Was: 3
08:45dep 09:35arr  Now: 3   Was: 3
09:17dep 10:03arr  Now: 5   Was: 3
09:35dep 10:18arr  Now: 4   Was: 3

On the slow trains that's an increase in the total number of carriages by 15 from 63 to 78.  If you remove the extra Class 180 carriages as they don't add anything to the capacity then it's an increase of 13 carriages, which I estimate equates to a total of 1100 extra seats each morning peak.

So, a total of over 1600 seats each weekday morning from Maidenhead to Paddington, including two extra Standard Class carriages spread over the three HST operated services - just shows the scale of the capacity problem if regular commuters still perceive no difference!

[johoare]

Thank you so much for that information IndustryInsider.. One of the reasons I asked was I was driving past Maidenhead station a few days ago and saw the 8.34am pulling in as 3 carriages (which it has been for a couple of years since they took the extra carriages away from it).. Thish made me begin to wonder.. It sounds like that isn't what it is supposed to be however so hopefully a one off..

Another reason I asked is because I've been on a couple of different evening (fast) turbos in the last week or so which are still 3 carriages and were very full..

Is it really cheeky to ask for similar statistics for the evening rush hour?

That aside it is so good to have that list as it helps me (and would help other people if FGW^▸ (First Great Western) could somehow publish it) decide what to do in the case of disruption or just when the odd train is cancelled knowing which ones have more carriages..Or even on a day to day basis..

Thanks again 

[John R]

That aside it is so good to have that list as it helps me (and would help other people if FGW^▸ (First Great Western) could somehow publish it) decide what to do in the case of disruption or just when the odd train is cancelled knowing which ones have more carriages..Or even on a day to day basis..

Thanks again 

Some operators (I can't remember which) put posters up at stations that give the number of carriages on peak workings, and I believe may even give a prediction of how full they are likely to be to help passengers make an informed choice as to which service to catch. Very useful.

[johoare]

Yeah I have seen that somewhere.. I'm pretty sure one place was SWT^▸ (South West Trains) at Basingstoke (or Kingston maybe).. Very useful...

[grahame]

Some operators (I can't remember which) put posters up at stations that give the number of carriages on peak workings, and I believe may even give a prediction of how full they are likely to be to help passengers make an informed choice as to which service to catch. Very useful.

FGW^▸ (First Great Western) do it for summer Saturday afternoon services out of Weymouth, for example ...

So, a total of over 1600 seats each weekday morning from Maidenhead to Paddington, including two extra Standard Class carriages spread over the three HST^▸ (High Speed Train) operated services - just shows the scale of the capacity problem if regular commuters still perceive no difference!

But with a caution that it's not 1600 extra seats for people from Maidenhead.   If each train calls at 8 stations on its way into Paddington, that's an average of just 200 extra seats per station.  You list 29 services, so that becomes just 7 extra seats for Maidenhead passengers per train ... hardly surprising that it may feel like a drop in the ocean 

[IndustryInsider]

Thank you so much for that information IndustryInsider.. One of the reasons I asked was I was driving past Maidenhead station a few days ago and saw the 8.34am pulling in as 3 carriages (which it has been for a couple of years since they took the extra carriages away from it).. Thish made me begin to wonder.. It sounds like that isn't what it is supposed to be however so hopefully a one off..

Another reason I asked is because I've been on a couple of different evening (fast) turbos in the last week or so which are still 3 carriages and were very full..

Is it really cheeky to ask for similar statistics for the evening rush hour?

That aside it is so good to have that list as it helps me (and would help other people if FGW^▸ (First Great Western) could somehow publish it) decide what to do in the case of disruption or just when the odd train is cancelled knowing which ones have more carriages..Or even on a day to day basis..

No problem.  I'll do an evening rush-hour one when I have time (probably Friday).  If I was head of FGW's marketing machine, I'd make damn sure there were plenty of posters up at stations like Maidenhead telling people just how much extra has been added since this time last year, as perceptions might change then- especially given these trains have been gradually strengthened over the months, so it hasn't been as noticeable as it might have been.  However you put it, and I take Graham's point about not all those seats being for Maidenhead commuters, having 28 more carriages on trains heading towards London in a 4-hour period is worth crowing about!

Regarding the 08:34 departure, two fatalities involving 180 units rendered them a unit short for a few days due to repairs, which would explain why that was only a 3-car Turbo for a few days.  Back to four daily 180 diagrams at the moment.

[paul7575]

Yeah I have seen that somewhere.. I'm pretty sure one place was SWT^▸ (South West Trains) at Basingstoke (or Kingston maybe).. Very useful...

London Midland seem to have quite a thorough approach to this, they have a specific web page 'Finding a seat', which includes all the individual station train length/expected capacity posters (for those stations in scope). 

The same web page includes an updated list of short formations for that particular evening, updated at 4 pm:

http://www.londonmidland.com/your-journey/finding-a-seat/

The posters SWT have at stations such as Basingstoke are in a very similar format IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly).

Paul