Scottish proposals branded 'Alice in Wonderland'

[whole diary]

[Timmer]

From Railnews:
http://www.railnews.co.uk/news/general/2011/11/17-scottish-proposals-branded-alice-in.html

A SET^▸ (Super Express Train (now IET)) of proposals from Transport Scotland which could see the end of through trains between England and Scotland north of the central belt as well as a ban on alcohol and a reduction in sleeper services has been branded as 'Alice in Wonderland' by furious critics. But the Scottish Government is pointing out that the proposals are only at the consultation stage.
 
Transport Scotland is starting to plan the shape of the country's rail services after the present ScotRail franchise ends in 2014. It is asking whether there should be more than one franchise, to operate different types of passenger services, and also asking for views on whether the Caledonian Sleeper services should be run separately.
 
Another suggestion is that services from England should not run north of the central belt, because Transport Scotland believes that through trains from the East Coast Main Line to Aberdeen and Inverness are abstracting revenue from ScotRail.

Anyone who has travelled on East Coast services North of Edinburgh will know just how popular they are. HST^▸ (High Speed Train) or DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) between Edinburgh- Inverness? What a tough choice...not.

[eightf48544]

Another suggestion is that services from England should not run north of the central belt, because Transport Scotland believes that through trains from the East Coast Main Line to Aberdeen and Inverness are abstracting revenue from ScotRail.

That's the numb of the issue it's not that the Scots don't want through trains and HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) North of Endinburgh it's that East Coast extracts a percentage of the takings from Inverness, Aberdeen, Dundee, Perth etc. and some minor stations such as Pitlochry.

It's all part of the "bean counters" paradise which is the modern British Railways.

I'm surprised that the Scots don't nationalise Scotrail and take over their part of Networkrail and run a proper railway.

[paul7575]

Transport Scotland can sort out any revenue issues by getting the default Orcats calculations overidden by survey data.  It's within the existing rules, any TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) can propose a different revenue share if it is based on factual evidence, the purpose of Orcats is to provide an easier automatic process, but it isn't fault free.

Paul

[Btline]

I would imagine that locals and local council/politicians would oppose the AXING of England trains. Perhaps the English should threaten to terminate all trains at Carlisle and Newcastle?

For goodness sake, we are the UNITED Kingdom - it should not feel like we're crossing borders apart from the "Welcome to Scotland" signs and Bank of Scotland money. Aberdeen is major city in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) so it it entitled to a link to its capital - London.

[paul7575]

Berwick surely?  A closer place for passengers to be DUMPED! 

Newcastle isn't on the border, funnily enough...

Paul

[Timmer]

Article by The Independent's travel writer Simon Calder on the possible future of both the Lowland and Highland sleeper services from April 2014:
http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/goodnight-to-the-sleeper-train-6265394.html

[caliwag]

Well as Scotland is, quite rightly, objecting to the British Summer time shift and all that lark, perhaps Berwick (Scotland or England...hoho Berwick Rangers, cmn the Borderers) should be where the Scotrail purchased 125s, perhaps abandoned by GC^» (Great Central Railway - link to heritage line) (now German owned), should whizz to Inversnecky and the Granite city.

[Rhydgaled]

Anyone who has travelled on East Coast services North of Edinburgh will know just how popular they are. HST^▸ (High Speed Train) or DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) between Edinburgh- Inverness? What a tough choice...not.

Until 2016, when if DafT don't come to their senses it will be a choice of 90/100mph underfloor-engined DMU or 125mph underfloor-engined DMU, assuming Transport Scotland don't ban East Coast from running north of Edinbrough.

It's all part of the "bean counters" paradise which is the modern British Railways.

I'm surprised that the Scots don't nationalise Scotrail and take over their part of Networkrail and run a proper railway.

Sadly they wouldn't be allowed to, I think a Westminster law was passed which says a franchise cannot be permenantly nationatised, they have to let out things like East Coast again. That act should be removed, a candidate for the red tape challage perhaps? The logical thing would be to have Scotrail pay for the running of the London trains north of Edinbrough as if they were part of the Scotrail franchise, and hence get all the revenue for that section too.

Interesting that DafT cling to their wild notion that privatised, fragmented, railways are good, and try to fix the bloated subsidy privatisation has caused with longer franchises. Meanwhile it seems the devolved administrations in Wales and Scotland might like that annoying law scrapped to allow them to nationalised. Scotland have fixed their livery and Wales are considering a not-for-profit company (which can't really be anything but nationalised, can it?).

[Tim]

Transport Scotland believes that through trains from the East Coast Main Line to Aberdeen and Inverness are abstracting revenue from ScotRail.

I am sure they are "abstracting revenue" (ie carrying willing passengers), but they are carrying people who would otherwise be on Scotrail which would require more subsidy from Transport Scotland.

Sounds like stupid Nationalist whinging -"how can it be right that England runs trains in Scotland?" forgetting Scotrail's nightly excursions to London and the fact that most of England's trains and buses are now run by what used to be "Grampian Regional Transport"