Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)

[whole diary]

[TonyK]

This thread is a mess!  FlyBMI and now FlyBE ... I will see if I can tidy up subject lines!

I might have just done that while you were posting, grahame! I have split the developing conversation about FlyBe from the thread relating to the collapse of Flybmi.

To avoid any further confusion:

FlyBe was the descendant airline of Jersey European Airways, and was based in Exeter. It was renamed British European in 2000, then FlyBe in 2002. It was sold to Connect Airways, a consortium backed by Virgin Atlantic and Stobart Aviation, in February 2019. It entered administration on 4 March 2020.

Flybmi was the descendant airline of British Midland International, and was legally known as British Midland Regional Ltd. It was purchased from Lufthansa iwho owned British Midland International, of which Flybmi was a subsidiary, in 2012. In 2015, it became part of a new group, Airline Investments Ltd, along with Loganair. It entered administration on 16 February 2019.

[grahame]

This thread is a mess!  FlyBMI and now FlyBE ... I will see if I can tidy up subject lines!

I might have just done that while you were posting, grahame!

You have done, thanks!

[broadgage]

Whilst I am sorry for those thrown out of work, and those whose travel plans have been disrupted, taking the wider view the failure of another airline is good news for the environment.
If we are serious about the climate emergency, we need to fly less and not more. Air travel is very carbon intensive and likely to remain so.

Hopefully some people will now fly less, making use of rail instead, or even staying in one place.

Some of the routes formerly operated by Flybe will presumably be taken over by competitors, but others may close permanently. Those who flew infrequently may have to accept the extra time taken by rail.
Those who flew frequently might have to review their location and business affairs so as to reduce the need for such frequent long distance travel.

Despite my misgivings about some recent changes, I am pro-rail. The rail industry does IMO^▸ (in my opinion) need to improve its long distance offerings, not just in terms of journey quality, but also in terms of what through services are available.
Time perhaps to consider a return of sleeper services between say the southwest and the north or Scotland.

Rail services involving changing are inherently less popular than through services.
A through train from say Plymouth to say York would be far more attractive than changing in London.

[grahame]

Why is it that information system break down when you most need them?

https://www.southamptonairport.com/departures-arrivals/ :

Departures & arrivals
Arrival and departure information is currently unavailable

[TonyK]

Why is it that information system break down when you most need them?

https://www.southamptonairport.com/departures-arrivals/ :

Departures & arrivals
Arrival and departure information is currently unavailable

Back up and running, with a message about FlyBe not operating any more. There are no other flights to show. Southampton council was in the process of planning an extension to the runway to enable bigger airlines to operate, as EasyJet have said they want to start services from there. That has been put on hold, and there aren't many other operators of turboprop aircraft who could take over from Flybe.

[Oxonhutch]

Why is it that information system break down when you most need them?

I think the graph from the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) article might give a good indication of why. 90% of all flights out of Southampton are affected.

[old original]

Why is it that information system break down when you most need them?

I think the graph from the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) article might give a good indication of why. 90% of all flights out of Southampton are affected.

I see Newquay's missing. Should be between Belfast and the IOM @ 65%

[paul7575]

Why is it that information system break down when you most need them?

https://www.southamptonairport.com/departures-arrivals/ :

Departures & arrivals
Arrival and departure information is currently unavailable

Back up and running, with a message about FlyBe not operating any more. There are no other flights to show. Southampton council was in the process of planning an extension to the runway to enable bigger airlines to operate, as EasyJet have said they want to start services from there. That has been put on hold, and there aren't many other operators of turboprop aircraft who could take over from Flybe.

Looks like Loganair are stepping in starting next week, at least for Edinburgh, Glasgow, Newcastle and maybe a couple more.  I wonder if they’ll use ex-FlyBe aeroplanes?

All routes that I used when I was still working, because you could basically get almost a full working day in and avoid a hotel stay.

Paul

[LiskeardRich]

Why is it that information system break down when you most need them?

https://www.southamptonairport.com/departures-arrivals/ :

Departures & arrivals
Arrival and departure information is currently unavailable

Back up and running, with a message about FlyBe not operating any more. There are no other flights to show. Southampton council was in the process of planning an extension to the runway to enable bigger airlines to operate, as EasyJet have said they want to start services from there. That has been put on hold, and there aren't many other operators of turboprop aircraft who could take over from Flybe.

Looks like Loganair are stepping in starting next week, at least for Edinburgh, Glasgow, Newcastle and maybe a couple more.  I wonder if they’ll use ex-FlyBe aeroplanes?

All routes that I used when I was still working, because you could basically get almost a full working day in and avoid a hotel stay.

Paul

Logan have said what they will be using and the prices in an article featured on Devon live. Means nothing to me to compare if it’s ex Flybe stuff.

All first group TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) have now extended acceptance of a Flybe flight until 12 March now with further review to be made by then

[Thatcham Crossing]

Posted by: broadgage
Insert Quote
Whilst I am sorry for those thrown out of work, and those whose travel plans have been disrupted, taking the wider view the failure of another airline is good news for the environment.
If we are serious about the climate emergency, we need to fly less and not more. Air travel is very carbon intensive and likely to remain so.

Hopefully some people will now fly less, making use of rail instead, or even staying in one place.

Some of the routes formerly operated by Flybe will presumably be taken over by competitors, but others may close permanently. Those who flew infrequently may have to accept the extra time taken by rail.
Those who flew frequently might have to review their location and business affairs so as to reduce the need for such frequent long distance travel.

I really can't make up my mind whether Broadgage lives in the past or the future, but it's some kind of utopian dreamworld, whatever it is.

I was a fairly regular Flybe passenger, and am sad about what's happened. Mainly for their front-line staff, who were always great and appeared professional right to the end last night, from what I have seen and heard.

There were let down by a succession of poor senior management teams, who mostly had delusions of grandeur that cost the airline a fortune and were ultimately a big part of it's downfall.

I used Flybe mainly for trips that involve a day trip and a sea crossing (I can't "use rail instead" for those!). These journeys also can't be achieved in the required timescales by any other means of transport. I'm not prepared and don't have time to spend a total of, say, 3 days away for a few hours meeting a Customer face-to-face, which is what it would take for some of these if I used ground and sea transportation (I would also add that we do many meetings virtually, but there is sometimes no alternative but a face-to-face, for example when negotiating complex agreements).

I use rail when I can aswell, when staying on the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) mainland, including some long day trips that could be done by air. My point really is that it's a mix, and to say you should stop travelling or do it all by rail is simply just an idealogical oversimplification!

To answer on another question, I'm fairly sure that all or nearly all of Flybe's aircraft are leased, so the lessors will re-possess and then try to re-market them. They may in time find their way to other operators (anywhere globally) but those operators will need to have pilots type-rated to fly them, and I would be fairly sure that an operator like Loganair (which operates different types) won't have many, if any, that are rated to fly Flybe's Q400's, for example.

[sikejsudjek3]

The rail line from Newquay to Par isn't much of an improvement over using a horse and cart. Flybe's Dash aircraft were amongst the most environmentally friendly aircraft out there.

[ellendune]

The rail line from Newquay to Par isn't much of an improvement over using a horse and cart. Flybe's Dash aircraft were amongst the most environmentally friendly aircraft out there.

I don't think that Flybe's services was particulalrly serving Newquay, but the whole of Cornwall.  It is the speed of services generally to Cornwall that is therefore the issue not the Newquay branch. 

[Thatcham Crossing]

It is the speed of services generally to Cornwall that is therefore the issue not the Newquay branch.

....and that is why the replacement of Flybe on the PSO Newquay to London route needs to get sorted PDQ, with government assistance if possible. Anything beyond Exeter (or Plymouth at a stretch) is not doable for a day trip by rail from London and the Thames Valley.

[Celestial]

It is the speed of services generally to Cornwall that is therefore the issue not the Newquay branch.

....and that is why the replacement of Flybe on the PSO Newquay to London route needs to get sorted PDQ, with government assistance if possible. Anything beyond Exeter (or Plymouth at a stretch) is not doable for a day trip by rail from London and the Thames Valley.

3 hrs to Plymouth is not doable in a day return to/from London? I suspect the stats would show quite a lot of such journeys are undertaken.

[Celestial]

Posted by: broadgage
Insert Quote

I really can't make up my mind whether Broadgage lives in the past or the future, but it's some kind of utopian dreamworld, whatever it is.

Utopian, but at the same time scary, judging by the contingency planning that goes into place for the day the world ends.  Though at least he will have a clean backside when it does.

edited to fix quotes