Can you collect tickets purchased on-line on the train

[whole diary]

[JayMac]

My system, you load tickets onto the Smartcard. Buy online, on the phone, at a TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) or at a ticket office. Touch the reader at the start of the journey and again at the end to use the ticket and pass through barriers quickly. Guards check with a tap. If the ticket is not valid then it beeps.

No pay and go - apart from selected areas.

And those of us that regularly use split ticketing.....?

[ChrisB]

And why not just carry a paper ticket which you can dispose of at the end of the journey, rather than have to look after & remember a smartcard every time you want to travel.

Think before posting, Sir, not afterwards....

[eightf48544]

Yep that's the way to go btline preloaded tickets and/or reservations for longer journies. PAYG^▸ (Pay as you go)  or season for journies in local tarrifff zone .

[Btline]

Split tickets? Um, you buy the split tickets, you load the tickets onto the card by tapping in, tap to get through any barriers, tap on guard's reader. What difference does it make?

I'm sure people in London don't mind carrying Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) cards around. I certainly remember mine when I go. I'm sure that hiking prices of all paper tickets (as in London) would get people to switch and remember their cards! As for remembering, many people keep it in their wallet/handbag anyway. One day, your ITSO card may be integrated with your debit card. I have thought before I posted.

And I'm actually a Lord, not a Sir...

[JayMac]

Split tickets? Um, you buy the split tickets, you load the tickets onto the card by tapping in, tap to get through any barriers, tap on guard's reader. What difference does it make?

And if you don't meet a guard en route with your split tickets? (who would have to have all possible splits programmed into his hand held reader - with a 'live' link to the central database to ensure you weren't maxed fared when you tap out at your final destination) So, max cash fare (what would that be?) when you tap out at your destination? Or a system that has every possible 'split fare' on the rail network programmed in? I'd love to meet the guys who are tasked with programming in all those permutations! And if your legitimate split doesn't register? What then? A tortuous process claiming back the difference from Customer Services?

[Btline]

The same applies with split tickets if you don't need a guard.

Maximum cash fares don't apply if it's not pay and go. Just like you don't have to register a credit card when you buy a paper ticket in case you go further than the destination or sit in First Class. if you fare dodge, you are given a penalty fare, or you're prosecuted. The same would apply with a smart card.

It's a simple concept. Instead of having multiple tickets and reservations, everything is stored on a Smartcard. Instead of inserting a ticket into barriers, you "touch out". Instead of picking up tickets at a TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) or ticket office (or having them mailed) you pick them up by "touching in".

Revenue protection is easier. If the ticket is invalid, if it's peak time and you have an off peak ticket, or if you're on the wrong train, the guard is alerted. If you have a railcard, the guard can be alerted so he can check. You can't use a ticket more than once, as it is logged that the ticket has been used. Plus bus? Easy - just touch your card on the reader when you get on the bus, and the reader will bleep to say it's valid.

You can be a season holder in Bristol area and make a day trip to London without having an extra bit of paper.

It works in London already, the only difference is that you can also use the card for pay and go journeys within the zones.

[JayMac]

Sorry, Btline, but you've yet to explain how split ticketing would work with a smart card.

[inspector_blakey]

It's a simple concept.

Slightly debatable, given the number of column inches it has taken you to explain the system

It works in London already, the only difference is that you can also use the card for pay and go journeys within the zones.

Again, debatable - Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) has still not been fully "rolled out" (that phrase brings me out in a rash...) on all London suburban services yet, has it? And even if it has, that's a relatively small, densely populated urban area with fairly straightforward, often zonal ticketing, no seat reservations etc etc. In the US SEPTA has been muttering about trying to introduce smartcard ticketing on Philadelphia's regional rail system - a fairly straightforward system of routes radiating out from three main stations in central Philly. They still haven't figured out a way to do it. Last I heard was some hare-brained scheme to make it free to travel into the city but charge a double fare for travelling out, which also involved conductors re-scanning everyone's smart card after every fare zone boundary. Utter lunacy.

On a facile level it may seem attractively simple to say 'everything should be done using smartcards' but the way I see it the only advantage what you propose offers over paper tickets is the facility to purchase an advance ticket and have it immediately available, rather than collecting at a TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine)/ticket office. For the sake of that, you have to equip every traveller in the country with a smartcard, every guard with a reader, every station with a reader, get a weapons-grade group of computer programmers to factor in every conceivable combination of split fares/alternative routes/breaks of journey, all at massive expense. There's no way it's going to happen this side of La-La Land. Ever.

[paul7575]

Again, debatable - Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) has still not been fully "rolled out" (that phrase brings me out in a rash...) on all London suburban services yet, has it?

2nd Jan 2010 was when full NR^» (Network Rail - home page) coverage was achieved in the travelcard zones, and also just outside the zones at Watford Jn and Grays.

Paul

[JayMac]

2nd Jan 2010 was when full NR^» (Network Rail - home page) coverage was achieved in the travelcard zones, and also just outside the zones at Watford Jn and Grays.

Paul

And wanting to top up your Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) at a SWT^▸ (South West Trains) station within the zones....?

Despite assurances from SWT and TfL^» (Transport for London - about) that Oyster would be fully available from SWT locations from May 2011, it is still the case that you can't top up, buy or load an Oyster PAYG^▸ (Pay as you go) card at most SWT stations within the zones.

[Btline]

Sorry, Btline, but you've yet to explain how split ticketing would work with a smart card.

Yes I have. No different to normal tickets.

Split tickets? Um, you buy the split tickets, you load the tickets onto the card by tapping in, tap to get through any barriers, tap on guard's reader. What difference does it make?

Regarding London, all TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) within the London zones now accept Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) Pay and Go. So not debatable! Besides, we're not talking about pay and go.

[JayMac]

Sorry, Btline, but you've yet to explain how split ticketing would work with a smart card.

Yes I have. No different to normal tickets.

You've explained how it works? Sorry, did I miss that? What do I need to do with my smart card when splitting at Didcot Parkway on a day trip with walk up tickets to London from Bristol?

[paul7575]

Despite assurances from SWT^▸ (South West Trains) and TfL^» (Transport for London - about) that Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) would be fully available from SWT locations from May 2011, it is still the case that you can't top up, buy or load an Oyster PAYG^▸ (Pay as you go) card at most SWT stations within the zones.

I know that, but I think the point was whether it had been rolled out to all NR^» (Network Rail - home page) [train] services, rather than retail facilities.

Paul

[Btline]

Sorry, Btline, but you've yet to explain how split ticketing would work with a smart card.

Yes I have. No different to normal tickets.

You've explained how it works? Sorry, did I miss that? What do I need to do with my smart card when splitting at Didcot Parkway on a day trip with walk up tickets to London from Bristol?

You buy the tickets.
You touch in at the barriers at Bristol to load the tickets.
You touch out at Paddington to get through the barriers.
If you're ticket checked, you touch your card on the reader. As ticket(s) is/are valid, there is a green light and the guard walks on.

Somebody shoot me. (cue: proably a lot of offers... )

[inspector_blakey]

Well, you have rather tied yourself to a stake and pinned a paper target to your chest...