Suggestions for later services on the Cotswolds Line

[whole diary]

[IndustryInsider]

Yes, there'll be a couple of up trains sat at Charlbury waiting time until the revised timetable kicks in.  Better than being sat at Ascott!





Edit note:  At the request of a couple of members, these particular posts have been split off from the 'Cotswold Line Redoubling' topic, to form a new topic here.  Chris. 

[CLPGMS]

One of the two trains which I assume to be the ones referred to by "IndustryInsider" will still have to wait at Charlbury after the new timetable starts on 12th September - the 1514 HDF-PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains).  This is booked to arrive at 1701 but not to depart until 1711.  The other, the 1728 WOF-PAD, has its wait transferred elsewhere.  Although it will depart Charlbury 10 minutes earlier than now at 1837 and will call additionally at Hanborough (1844), it then takes a massive 20 minutes to get to Oxford instead of the usual 10.  This is because it will have to wait outside Oxford station for the departure of the 1901 local service.  The CLPG^» (Cotswold Line Promotion Group - about) did suggest switching the two departures, so that the Cotswold Line train could form a fast 1901 departure from Oxford and that the local could follow it at 1907.  This would result in both trains departing at regular pattern times.  It would also remove about half of the 16 minute wait that the current 1901 has at Didcot Parkway. Unfortunately, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) decided that this alteration would cause problems later in the journey beyond Didcot.

[IndustryInsider]

Yes, shame that.  Perhaps it can be tweaked for the December timetable?  At least the other occurrence of the day when the stopper precedes the fast at 17:31/38 is being swapped round.

[animationmilo]

They have a 21:51 Hereford to London Paddington, Do you think they would ever consider like a 22:30 London Paddington to Hereford?

[bobm]

Never say never but I would have thought unlikely as a direct service over the Cotswold line.  There's a 21:48 from Paddington as far as Worcester. Meanwhile you can reach Hereford by leaving Paddington at 22:45 and changing at Newport.

[dzug]

Is the Worcester Hereford line open 24x7? If not it would surely be closed by the time such a train got to it.

[ChrisB]

THere#'s more of a call for a later train as far as WOS^» (Worcester Shrub Hill - next trains) from PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) - 2148 is stupidly early.

[Steve Bray]

Even in the summer 1998 timetable, the last train was the 2148. I wonder how many 'last trains' have remained unchanged for such a long period? I would have thought that with changes in travel patterns, a slightly later 'last' departure might prove popular. But with the proposed new HST^▸ (High Speed Train) starting in the morning from Charlbury in December, maybe there could be a late evening Oxford service extended through to Charlbury?

As for the 2151 from Hereford to Paddington, this is a 'fresh air' train. Apart from providing a useful late evening service from Worcester to Pershore and Evesham, I don't believe there is any demand for a service so late.

[ChrisB]

Even in the summer 1998 timetable, the last train was the 2148. I wonder how many 'last trains' have remained unchanged for such a long period?

Times of last trains are often spwecified in franchises.

I would have thought that with changes in travel patterns, a slightly later 'last' departure might prove popular. But with the proposed new HST^▸ (High Speed Train) starting in the morning from Charlbury in December, maybe there could be a late evening Oxford service extended through to Charlbury?

It doesn't stable at Charlbury! THe new Charlbury starter must come through ecs from Oxford, I guess, as it currently starts in Oxford - or might be the first down from PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) in the morning?

As for the 2151 from Hereford to Paddington, this is a 'fresh air' train. Apart from providing a useful late evening service from Worcester to Pershore and Evesham, I don't believe there is any demand for a service so late.

Oi! I'm a regular user of that train. Huntindon Hall in Worcester is a great night out!

[Richard Fairhurst]

Though it would be better if it ran on Saturdays, engineering permitting - a weekday evening out in Worcester is less useful.

Agreed that a late evening train on the eastern part of the line would be very useful. Maybe extend one of the Oxfords (22.49 or 23.20 from Paddington) to Charlbury or beyond? "How do I get back from London after the last train has gone?" is a fairly common question in Charlbury so there's clearly some demand for it.

[IanL]

Definitely a demand for a 2320 departure from Paddington to go to Worcester. The amount I spend on taxis after getting back to Oxford from London by train or Heathrow by bus, to have to take an expensive taxi for the last 15miles. Often see a string of taxis returning to Oxford from Charlbury.

[IndustryInsider]

THe new Charlbury starter must come through ecs from Oxford, I guess, as it currently starts in Oxford - or might be the first down from PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) in the morning?

It currently runs ECS^▸ (Empty Coaching Stock) (practically) as the 05:17 Paddington to Oxford, so I would expect that to still be the case with it just carrying on to Charlbury.

As for late trains back to Worcester, I wouldn't say 21:48 was stupidly early - by comparison if you're heading off to Cheltenham/Gloucester then the latest service there is only slightly later at 22:15 (with a change onto a Sprinter at Swindon).  I also don't see a demand for a service at 23:20 all the way to Worcester - but to Charlbury and as far as Moreton there may be a few takers.  What might be might be desirable from a customer service standpoint to either shift the evening departures from Paddington slightly from 19:22/20:20/21:48 to 19:22/20:20/21:20/22:20 so as to give an extra train, a clockface hourly service and a 30-minute later departure time of the last train from London, or to perhaps have the current 22:49 Turbo from Paddington to Oxford extend through to Moreton-In-Marsh then return ECS to Oxford?  Neither of these options are going to be money spinners though!

[ChrisB]

Whioch is exactly why we need to get these specified into the next draft of the ITT^▸ (Invitation to Tender) for the new franchise!

[IndustryInsider]

Yes, indeed.  A good opportunity to try to get something written into the specification from 2013.

[ChrisB]

As for late trains back to Worcester, I wouldn't say 21:48 was stupidly early - by comparison if you're heading off to Cheltenham/Gloucester then the latest service there is only slightly later at 22:15 (with a change onto a Sprinter at Swindon).  I also don't see a demand for a service at 23:20 all the way to Worcester - but to Charlbury and as far as Moreton there may be a few takers. 

Anywhere about as far as Moreton would see London as the nearest city with decent amount of theatre / shows going on. By the time you make it back to PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains), 2248 would be al;most too early, so a 2318 or thereabouts would be about right. There must be an Oxford service around then, so just extend that to Moreton. It could either run to WOS^» (Worcester Shrub Hill - next trains) for stabling (in which case it might as well run in service) or run ECS^▸ (Empty Coaching Stock) to Oxford - whichever suited the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company).

The South Cotswolds beyond Swindon are almost too far from the smoke to attract regular theatre goers?.....and Swindon does have a late train anyhow.