Crossrail/Elizabeth Line. From construction to operation - ongoing discussion

[whole diary]

[broadgage]

What a ridiculous statement to make.  The seating layout will be specified in the ITT^▸ (Invitation to Tender), not chosen by Bombardier.

Paul

No agree  but TFL^▸ (Transport for London) will have alot to say about the ITT and they have been going for longitudinal seats in both the 378 and the new S stock etc.

As pointed out, the train builder does not choose the seating layout.

BUT experience of other new trains suggests that the seating layout chosen will be a backward step.
Either longitudinal with mainly standing space, or at best high density bus style with minimal legroom.

[ChrisB]

S-Stock layout - long distance, Maidenhead to Abbey Wood....

[anthony215]

The thameslink order looks to be getting delayed now:

http://www.railnews.co.uk/news/general/2011/09/13-now-dft-faces-legal-challenge.html

This is going to cause a knock on effect for Northern and FGW^▸ (First Great Western)

Maybe they should have just given the contract to Hitachi to build at their new uk plant. Are we going to see a challnge to IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) now?

[paul7575]

That article is most definitely NOT announcing a delay - and AFAICT^▸ (as far as I can tell) the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) is not yet 'facing a legal challenge'.  The article is discussing what might happen if a trade union does happen to succeed in its call for a judicial review. That is by no means a foregone conclusion.
 
I suggest you read the article again properly...

Paul

[anthony215]

Yes i just posted the link after seing it posted on uk railforums and others.

Sorry about that.

Personallyy i think Bombardier should just accept it and move on as they said they were planning on laying workers off even if they had won the order. Hopefully Bombardier will get their house in order for  the crossrail bid.

[Btline]

Hopefully Bombardier will get their house in order for  the crossrail bid.

They need to up their game. The LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise) 172s were ordered in November 2007 and won't be fully delivered 4 years later. They were also allegedly plagued with problems during testing. I also think FCC^▸ (First Capital Connect)'s trains were delivered late and had teething problems. Shame, because I actually prefer their designs to Desiros.

Yes to British jobs for British workers, but we still need reliable trains for both Thameslink and Crossrail on time!

[IndustryInsider]

The tunnel portals for the Royal Oak end of the Crossrail tunnel are pretty much complete.  Here is a picture I took this morning showing the work completed, with the slope down to the portal entrances which are just before Royal Oak LUL^▸ (London Underground Ltd) station which can be seen in the distance.

[paul7575]

I've been wondering about the various new Crossrail junctions, but instead of spending hours searching through Crossrail's drawings I thought I'd just ask here.

There is definitely a new flyover at Airport Jn, so that both the main and reliefs have grade separation there.

There is definitely a new diveunder at Acton Yard, so that the up relief doesn't conflict with freight movements to/from the relief lines.

But, surely there has to be a further junction where the up relief line into Paddington crosses the down line from the Crossrail tunnels - is this to be grade separated?   Also, on current plans there is still the Westbourne Park turnback facility - for 14 tph.  Will that be between the running lines, or will it be on one side?

Loads of scope for flat junction conflicts along there, have they actually covered all the options?

Paul
 

[Electric train]

I've been wondering about the various new Crossrail junctions, but instead of spending hours searching through Crossrail's drawings I thought I'd just ask here.

There is definitely a new flyover at Airport Jn, so that both the main and reliefs have grade separation there.

There is definitely a new diveunder at Acton Yard, so that the up relief doesn't conflict with freight movements to/from the relief lines.

But, surely there has to be a further junction where the up relief line into Paddington crosses the down line from the Crossrail tunnels - is this to be grade separated?   Also, on current plans there is still the Westbourne Park turnback facility - for 14 tph.  Will that be between the running lines, or will it be on one side?

Loads of scope for flat junction conflicts along there, have they actually covered all the options?

Paul
 

As Crossrail will be the (virtually) sole user of the Relief Lines Crossrail trains will run straight into the tunnels from the Reliefs at Westbourne Park so no conflict as all other services will run on the Mains Lines 1 to 4 at Padd

[paul7575]

But whatever GW^▸ (Great Western) stopping service remains, and that's 6tph in the peaks according to Crossrail's current website,  it will still have to do a flat crossing to get past the Crossrail down lines somewhere west of Westbourne Park surely?

Paul

[Electric train]

But whatever GW^▸ (Great Western) stopping service remains, and that's 6tph in the peaks according to Crossrail's current website,  it will still have to do a flat crossing to get past the Crossrail down lines somewhere west of Westbourne Park surely?

Paul

What stopping services?  If the West terminal remains at Maidenhead there will be Padd Slough Maidenhead stoppers only, if Crossrail terminates at Reading then the Maidenhead stop will go, the Greenfords will terminate in a new Bay at West Ealing all no Crossrail services will use Lines 1 to 4

[paul7575]

What stopping services?  If the West terminal remains at Maidenhead there will be Padd Slough Maidenhead stoppers only, if Crossrail terminates at Reading then the Maidenhead stop will go, the Greenfords will terminate in a new Bay at West Ealing all no Crossrail services will use Lines 1 to 4

I'm suggesting GW^▸ (Great Western) stopping services having to transfer from the reliefs to lines 1-4 to get into Paddington.

These:
 
Morning peak Crossrail services to Central London:
4 trains per hour from Heathrow Airport;
4 trains per hour from Maidenhead; and
2 trains per hour from West Drayton
 
Other operators services:
2 trains per hour from Reading calling at Twyford, Maidenhead, Slough, Hayes & Harlington and Ealing Broadway to Paddington;
2 trains per hour from Reading calling at Twyford, Maidenhead, Taplow, Burnham and terminating at Slough;
1 through train from Henley on Thames to Paddington; and
1 through train from Bourne End to Paddington

http://www.crossrail.co.uk/route/western-section/   (scroll down)

I have found a reasonable track diagram now - which presumably agrees with your earlier explanation?  But could be of academic interest eventually with all these proposals in the London and SE RUS^▸ (Route Utilisation Strategy) for additional Heathrow services, and a WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line) connection.  Also, it does show the Westbourne Park reversing sidings between the Crossrail lines as I expected.

http://www.rail-reg.gov.uk/upload/pdf/s18-xrail-appx2_single_line_GW.pdf

Paul

[eightf48544]

2 trains per hour from Reading calling at Twyford, Maidenhead, Taplow, Burnham and terminating at Slough;

Well that wrecks the Westbound service from Taplow it means to get anywhere West and North West one will have to change at both Maidenhead and Reading instead of just Reading.

Also the only services to London will be all stations!

Lets hope common sense prevails and Crossrail goes to Reading and they don't waste money on turnback sidings at Maidenhead. Hopefully the wires will up to Reading and we'll have had 319s in service long before the first Crossrail train pops it's head out of the tunnel.

[paul7575]

2 trains per hour from Reading calling at Twyford, Maidenhead, Taplow, Burnham and terminating at Slough;

Well that wrecks the Westbound service from Taplow it means to get anywhere West and North West one will have to change at both Maidenhead and Reading instead of just Reading.

I only struck that line through because it doesn't go into Paddington, not because it isn't running...

Paul

[eightf48544]

Sorry misunderstood, but it's still daft DaFT^» (Department for Transport - critical sounding abbreviation I discourage - about) policy terminating Crossrail at Maidenhead