Peak time travel Plymouth Newbury at off peak price - is this legit???

[whole diary]

[amiddl]

One of my problems coming back up to the Thames Valley on a Monday morning by an early train (05.30) is thats its ^100 single and I'm not prepared to pay this on a regular basis when I can travel at ^38.50 for an offpeak single on a Sunday Evening.

I've just realised that the last Gunnislake to Plymouth (18.39) misses the last Plymouth Newbury  (19.20) by 4 mins. Is this an opportunity as the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) website gives an offpeak fair of ^38.50 to travel on the 18.39 with an overnight wait at Plymouth for the 05.30.

Whats the score could I book this and join the 05.30 on a monday morning

[super tm]

Yes but you would actually have to make the journey starting at Gunnislake and spending overnight at the station  !!

[amiddl]

Do you know its almost worth it to go back to Gunnislake  and come back in the morning but I guess what you are saying is no its not ok to join at Plymouth.

[Hafren]

Newbury is at the start of the expensive part of the journey to London (a bit like Didcot/Swindon when coming from Bristol & Wales) - so if you buy a ticket to somewhere just before Newbury it might be much cheaper!

Looking at Avantix^▸ (Ticket Issuing System used on board trains)...

Plymouth to Pewsey Anytime Single: ^58.50
Pewsey to Newbury Day Single: ^7.00
Total ^65.50.

I don't know whether your train stops at Pewsey; if not, there's a smaller saving with a split at Westbury. Save another 30p if you're leaving Pewsey after 9am.

Only had a quick look so I hope I've read the details correctly!

[Mookiemoo]

Do you have to sleep at the station or would you not be justified in "booking a hotel for the night"

Because unless it's advance break of journey is allowed

[amiddl]

Do you have to sleep at the station or would you not be justified in "booking a hotel for the night"

An interesting question for those who travel early on a Monday morning from Plymouth to Thames Valley could take advantage of the ^37.00 Off Peak Fare from St Budeaux which would require one to take an 11 minute train ride on a Sunday Evening before going home and taking the train from Plymouth on the Monday Morning and saving ^63.00. That is providing you don't have to stay on Plymouth Station overnight.

[thetrout]

I can't see how they can force you to stay on Plymouth Station all night... It closes doesn't it...?!

When i've gone out to Bristol on a Friday Evening, I get to BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains) for about 4:30 AM Saturday, Station does not open until 5AM IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly)... So surely you would be kicked out anyway...?!

[inspector_blakey]

As far as I understand the rules (health warning though: i'm both very tired and a little bit under the influence, so the following may be garbage), break of journey is fine with that ticket. So if you have a ticket dated for the day before your journey from PLY^» (Plymouth - next trains)-PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains), it would be as if you had started out on the Sunday night and broken your journey at PLY overnight, were you to join that 0530 service at PYL on a Monday morning. E.g. if you wanted to travel back this Monday morning (27 Sep), you would want a ticket dated 26 Sep, then as I understand things you could quite easily have left Gunnislake on the Sunday eve and overnighted in Plymouth.

[old original]

A break of journey is permitted and you would be able to continue the next day after having a comfy night in a hotel  , but I think you'll find that the ticket restrictions the following day still apply.

[Mookiemoo]

Out of curiosity I just tried booking the same journey for next week and it allows seat reservations on the 0530!

on an off peak!

And the itinerary prints out that train as being the suitable connection

[Brucey]

Number 16 of the NRCoC^▸ (National Rail Conditions of Carriage) states

...

For the purposes of this Condition and Condition 11, you will be treated as breaking your
journey if you leave a Train Company^s or Rail Service Company^s stations after you start
your journey other than:
(i) to join a train at another station, or
(ii) to stay in overnight accommodation when you cannot reasonably
complete your journey within one day, or
(iii) to follow any instructions given by a member of a Train Company^s staff.

So presumably in these circumstances, the first train of the day is acceptable, regardless of the time restrictions.

Can anyone clarify?

[old original]

From the manual...
Break of Journey

Break of journey is allowed on the outward portion of Super Off-Peak tickets unless otherwise indicated by a restriction shown against the ticket^s validity code, and in all cases on the return portion of Super Off-Peak return tickets.

Super Off-Peak Singles and the outward portion of Super Off-Peak Returns are valid for travel on the date shown on the ticket. Where a passenger wishes to stop overnight or the journey cannot be completed within one day, break of journey for an overnight stay is allowed. Where a journey does continue into the next day, travel must resume before 1200 and any relevant time restrictions apply. No further break of journey is allowed except for the purpose of changing trains. Please note that break of journey is not permitted on some journeys, as detailed in the ticket restrictions.

Return portions of Super Off-Peak Return tickets are valid for travel until 0230 on the day following the last day of validity (i.e. one calendar month from outward journey). If a passenger is still travelling at 0230, they may stay on the train to complete that part of the journey but no further break of journey is allowed and all travel must be completed by 1200.

Note: Cross London transfers will only be accepted by London Underground on the date shown on the ticket (or last day of validity for Super Off-Peak Returns) and until 0429 the following day.


The bold italics are my emphasis...

[JayMac]

From the restrictions for GSL-NBY^» (Newbury - next trains) for a Super Off-Peak Single as detailed in NFM07:

Super Off-Peak Singles and the outward portion of Super Off-Peak Returns are valid for travel on the date shown on  the ticket. Where a passenger  wishes to stop overnight or the journey cannot be completed within one day, break of journey for an overnight stay is allowed. Where a journey continues into the next day, travel must resume before 1200 and any relevant time restrictions apply (except where regarded as an unbroken continuation of the previous days' travel where the first connection of the day may be taken). No further break of journey is allowed except for the purposes of changing trains.Please note that break of journey is not permitted on some journeys, as detailed in in the ticket restrictions.   

               

[old original]

So the question now is..
Does anybody know what takes priority.. the manual or NFM^▸ (National Fares Manual)??

[JayMac]

I've said it before...... where there is ambiguity in terms and conditions, the interpretation more favourable to the comsumer prevails. As covered by The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.