MKIII coaches. Convert spare Buffets to Trailer Standards?

[whole diary]

[JayMac]

How much work and cost to strip out the spare MkIII buffets and replace with seating?

[Timmer]

How much work and cost to strip out the spare MkIII buffets and replace with seating?

I imagine one of the major challenges would be putting in windows where there are currently no or small windows in the buffet area without compromising the body work.

[JayMac]

Ah... didn't consider the windows.

Would be difficult if there was any integral strengthening immediately below the 'slit' windows. Otherwise, then cutting a larger window frame shouldn't be too problematical I'd've thought.

Having said that, I'm no engineer, and I guess if it is an easy conversion then FGW^▸ (First Great Western) would've considered it for the micro buffets instead of converting Trailer Standards.

[paul7575]

I suppose replacing buffet style windows is just a case of throwing enough money at it. 

The pictures here show three new windows where the buffet used to be, in the recent Gatwick Express Class 442 conversions.  Significant as they are basically Mk3 body shells, and as the sequence shows they had already had extra large windows cut in during a previous overhaul.  As well as extra windows being installed, you can see that the original double slam doors into the luggage area were filled in to be replaced by windows.

http://www.southernelectric.org.uk/features/442/442ext02.html

Paul

[super tm]

The current franchise was bid to include removing the buffet cars.  There is quite a saving in lease costs.  Unless the government comes up with some more money to convert the old buffet cars - which seems very unlikely in the current economic climate - then they will not bo converted.

[JayMac]

Ok, what about stripping the BT10 bogies off of the spare MKIII Buffets and using them on the Iarnr^d ^ireann MKIIIs? Could then be used as a feasability testbed for converting existing MKIIIs to plug doors.

Again, I guess it's money and the political will. But there is enough spare MKIII stock out there that could, with a little will, be pressed into service.

[smokey]

The Irish MKIII stock have a generator van, is it the same as the British HST^▸ (High Speed Train (Inter City class 43 125 units)) fleet of 415volts AC^▸ (Alternating Current, or can mean Air Conditioning, depending on context. The second meaning is often used in a railway context and more generally) 3ph?

[eightf48544]

Rumour has it that Chiltern have snapped up the IE Mark 3s so looks like FGW^▸ (First Great Western) have missed the boat. Apparently they are also looking to fit power doors to their existing stock including W&S^▸ (Wrexham and Shropshire (Open Access Operator)) coaches.

Chiltern are apparently busy looking for secure accommodation for them.

Does anyone know if you can just change the wheelsets or does the bogie need modifying?
 

[Electric train]

Rumour has it that Chiltern have snapped up the IE Mark 3s so looks like FGW^▸ (First Great Western) have missed the boat. Apparently they are also looking to fit power doors to their existing stock including W&S^▸ (Wrexham and Shropshire (Open Access Operator)) coaches.
Chiltern are apparently busy looking for secure accommodation for them.
Does anyone know if you can just change the wheelsets or does the bogie need modifying?

Not so much missed the boat First only have a few years left with the GW^» (Great Western - used as an abbreviation for the area / lines under the Great Western franchise, as opposed to FGW which includes "First", the company operating them too. For tickets - about) franchise (2015 I believe) whereas Chiltern a lot longer left on its franchise so can justify the business case to acquire more rolling stock and spend money on modifying 30 year old stock

[anthony215]

Rumour has it that Chiltern have snapped up the IE Mark 3s so looks like FGW^▸ (First Great Western) have missed the boat. Apparently they are also looking to fit power doors to their existing stock including W&S^▸ (Wrexham and Shropshire (Open Access Operator)) coaches.

Chiltern are apparently busy looking for secure accommodation for them.

Does anyone know if you can just change the wheelsets or does the bogie need modifying?
 

How many MK3's  were in use in Ireland anyway?, surely there may be some left over for FGW or other operators.

Cant really see Chiltern needing all of them unless there is only a small fleet of MK3's in ireland

[matt473]

Not so much missed the boat First only have a few years left with the GW^» (Great Western - used as an abbreviation for the area / lines under the Great Western franchise, as opposed to FGW which includes "First", the company operating them too. For tickets - about) franchise (2015 I believe) whereas Chiltern a lot longer left on its franchise so can justify the business case to acquire more rolling stock and spend money on modifying 30 year old stock

Maybe they as well as many others have missed the boat. Was it not the fact that First owned some hst's that helped them ot win the Great Western franchise so osning extra stock to increase capacity could be the deal maker when it's re-letting he franchise time

[woody]

How many MK3's  were in use in Ireland anyway?, surely there may be some left over for FGW^▸ (First Great Western) or other operators.

Cant really see Chiltern needing all of them unless there is only a small fleet of MK3's in ireland

There are about 82 Irish Mk3s for sale I believe.

Edited to fix quote. bnm

[Tim]

Not sure that this is directly applicable.  But many years ago GNER^▸ (Great North Eastern Railways) looked at trying to convert ex-Mark III sleeper stock to seating.  They gave up because cutting new windows would have caused structural problems.

[Timmer]

Not sure that this is directly applicable.  But many years ago GNER^▸ (Great North Eastern Railways) looked at trying to convert ex-Mark III sleeper stock to seating.  They gave up because cutting new windows would have caused structural problems.

Yep the GNER plan to convert sleeper carriages was in my thinking when I mentioned about the challenge of cutting larger windows where there are small windows at one end of the buffet.

[ChrisB]

The answer I got back from my contact at Chiltern basically states that yes, they've been looking at acquiring Mark III stock from a variety of sources, but can't confirm on the IE ones specifically - So I guess they're still currently available.

It is confirmed that the IE stock has powered doors already fitted.....