Euro directive could have 'disastrous' impact on rail

[whole diary]

[woody]

A FORTHCOMING European Directive may have the effect of making new diesel trains very difficult and expensive to build, the industry is being warned.
http://www.railnews.co.uk/news/general/2010/08/17-euro-directive-could-have-disastrous.html
The new rules will affect new passenger rolling stock, and also the future replacement of engines in HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) and other diesel trains. ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here) told Railnews it was 'considering the implications', and that a statement could be expected soon.

[caliwag]

Sadly link didn't work

[JayMac]

I've taken the liberty of editing the OP^▸ (Original Poster / topic starter). Just an 'l' missing from the end of the link!

Should be working fine now. 

[devon_metro]

Anything to do with Europe controlling us is somewhat disasterous 



...back to the Daily Mail...

[paul7575]

This isn't a new directive AFAICS^▸ (As Far As I Can See);  it's been on the horizon for a few years, part of the gradual upgrading of emissions requirements.

It's why various re-engining projects, such as putting MTUs^▸ (Motor Traction Unit) in the HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) had a finite cut off date.

If the last 6 power cars to be done (those with GC^» (Great Central Railway - link to heritage line)) had not been taken in hand before 31 Dec 2010 I think they'd have been out of time, even though they had the replacement engines allocated.

However AIUI^▸ (as I understand it) engines in a defined spares pool can continue to be overhauled for repair stock, but no new engines can be introduced from a manufacturer.

Paul

[Henry]

 Look's like we're going back to steam then !!!!!!!!!!!!

[smokey]

What size engines are we on about here?

Whilst Freight loco,s Class 66 etc have big power units, HST^▸ (High Speed Train), power units are still big, but does this include the unit fleet size of engine's Class 14X, 15X, 16X,  just wondering because units have engine's the same sort of size as a bus.

[inspector_blakey]

...and certain bus operators (I'm thinking the Oxford Bus Company, for example) have been enthusiastically replacing their fleets over the last few years with vehicles that meet the Euro 4 and 5* emissions standards, so clearly the technology in that sort of engine is proven, available and not prohibitively expensive.

[Tim]

Yes the new engines are feasible, but they do require a redesign of certain things which edges the price up slightly.  The comparison with buses isn't completely accurate because buses sell by the thousand so the cost of new designs is diluted across many more vehicles than in the rail industry and everything on rails is more expensive anyway. 

These new rules do of course improve the economic case for electrification slightly.

[Brusselier]

This isn't a new directive AFAICS^▸ (As Far As I Can See);  it's been on the horizon for a few years, part of the gradual upgrading of emissions requirements.

looking at the European Commission website, the original directive dates from 1997 (97/68/EC), with various ammendments in 2002, 2004 and 2006. There is proposal for a further ammendment

http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/sectors/mechanical/files/nrmm/comm_native_com_2010_0362_1_proposition_de_directive_en.pdf

4. AMENDMENTS
The proposal foresees the following amendments to Directive 97/68/EC:

• <cut non rail stuff>
• An inclusion of engines used for the propulsion of railcars and locomotives in the
  flexibility scheme providing the possibility for the OEM to place on the market a limited
  number of engines under the flexibility scheme.
• These measures will expire on 31 December 2013.

As to what the flexibility scheme is, I've no idea. but considering it usually takes 2 years to get a directive through, and then 12 months for the national governments to transpose it into national law, I don't quite see the point of a 31/12/2013 expiry date!

[Tim]

Presumably if it hasn't been achived by the expiry date they will have an answer to the feasability question 

[andrewr]

This isn't new, but it is posing a lot of challenges for the engine manufacturers, because the solutions either sap power or require more space. There's been a vast amount of research and development, but nobody, as far as I'm aware, has resolved that. At the last InnoTrans show Cummins reckoned it could go a long way with better in cylinder combustion but I've not heard how it's progressed since - hopefully when I head to Berlin in late September for this year's show there should be some developments.

I can't help but think, though, that the legislation's missing the point a little - wouldn't it be better to accept current emissions standards on rail and do more to encourage people to leave their cars at home? Wouldn't that generate fewer emissions overall, or am I making the usual mistake and applying logic to this?

Andy

[hornbeam]

I agree. It^s a problem faced by the bus industry, generally engines are now less efficient and cost more to maintain. This of course gets passed onto the customer, making public transport more expensive. You would think that they would concentrate their efforts on getting more people on public transport and more freight on the rails.