Chiltern 172s and related Evergreen 3 enhancements

[whole diary]

[ChrisB]

Well, I'm only telling you what the Chiltern Engineering team are (still) telling me.

And the fact that the layout at the London end....there's no direct connection from the down line to the through line - you go via the up line.

[paul7575]

And the fact that the layout at the London end....there's no direct connection from the down line to the through line - you go via the up line.

We could definitely do with the detailed drawings like those posted for the Aynho Jn area.  But it seems highly unlikely to me that they'd go to the trouble of fitting that middle signal (of the three on the gantry) if it couldn't be reached from the south.

Paul

[ChrisB]

I've got the drawings for the whole line, but I tried a scan & it was too large to post here.

[IndustryInsider]

Nope, don't agree.

This Photo clearly shows just signal heads on that gantry - that'll be for the platform lines. THere would be a third up there if the UP through was reversible (and it wouldn't be called the 'Up through line' either.

An interesting one as, I'd agree with Paul, the gantry is clearly fitted with three signal heads which at a guess would do the movements he describes.  But you'd have thought the Chiltern Engineering team would know what was happening...

[paul7575]

An interesting one as, I'd agree with Paul, the gantry is clearly fitted with three signal heads which at a guess would do the movements he describes.  But you'd have thought the Chiltern Engineering team would know what was happening...

Well you'd certainly expect them to know all about the moves necessary to run their intended timetable... 

'Pat O'Neill', posting in uk.railway a few days ago and quoting from the relevant Yellow Peril, reckons the lines are definitely

"Down Main - Down direction
Up Main- Bi-directional
Up Princes Risborough Loop- Bi-directional"

[ChrisB]

Can you post a link to the ukr thread please? Ta!

[paul7575]

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.railway/browse_frm/thread/7eaa416348545c06/ace345e3ab94bf5e?hl=en&q=uk.railway:+princes+risborough

Only the three posts though.

'Jack Taylor' and I have also noted the new gantry mounted signals in the other thread started on Jun 2nd, about the Evergreen 3 drawings in Modern Rail:

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.railway/browse_frm/thread/c2a35a1d7d052530?hl=en&scoring=d&q=uk.railway%3A+diagrams+of+the+track+layouts+for+evergreen+3&

Not completely sure about those google links, I normally use a newsreader...

[ChrisB]

Thanks - I'll make yet more enquiries....and will see Network Rail Directors tomorrow morning, so will check with them too.

[Btline]

So what's the plan with Aynho's flyover? I travelled through it last week and there is no sign of them coping Northolt with a new Down Fast parallel to the Up. The work looks almost over and yet my down train had to slow right down over the junction.

Wasn't the plan to get the speed up to (or as near to) 100?

What's the plan with Neasden Junction? Havn't been that way much - trains are being diverted to Paddington. Such a problem, crowds of people arriving on the Northern platforms, no idea where they are!

Can't wait to travel on the new 6.07pm departure from Marylebone to Kidderminster - only stops seven times and takes 2 hrs 20 mins! Now there's a company that understands the need for an express! Passenger numbers will soar, and commuters and leisure travellers - no off peak restrictions - will target that train (which will be loco hauled) to come home.

Shame FGW^▸ (First Great Western) won't do something similar on the Cotswold line! Even if they did, you'd need an Anytime ticket and it would probably be a Turbo half the time. Don't they understand that marketing a 2 hour express would cause both business and leisure travellers so come back to the railway? You never know, if FGW got their act together, they would no longer cart around fresh air in their HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train)!

[paul7575]

So what's the plan with Aynho's flyover? I travelled through it last week and there is no sign of them coping Northolt with a new Down Fast parallel to the Up. The work looks almost over and yet my down train had to slow right down over the junction.

Wasn't the plan to get the speed up to (or as near to) 100?

There never was a plan for a new down line at Aynho.  The line speed increase to 85 mph (down) and 90 mph (up) is being achieved solely by renewing the junction.  We had a long debate about this in another thread, which culminated in the 'yellow peril' for the track improvements being posted by IndustryInsider, in post #54 here:  http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=8413.45

Paul

[devon_metro]

So what's the plan with Aynho's flyover? I travelled through it last week and there is no sign of them coping Northolt with a new Down Fast parallel to the Up. The work looks almost over and yet my down train had to slow right down over the junction.

Wasn't the plan to get the speed up to (or as near to) 100?

What's the plan with Neasden Junction? Havn't been that way much - trains are being diverted to Paddington. Such a problem, crowds of people arriving on the Northern platforms, no idea where they are!

Can't wait to travel on the new 6.07pm departure from Marylebone to Kidderminster - only stops seven times and takes 2 hrs 20 mins! Now there's a company that understands the need for an express! Passenger numbers will soar, and commuters and leisure travellers - no off peak restrictions - will target that train (which will be loco hauled) to come home.

Shame FGW^▸ (First Great Western) won't do something similar on the Cotswold line! Even if they did, you'd need an Anytime ticket and it would probably be a Turbo half the time. Don't they understand that marketing a 2 hour express would cause both business and leisure travellers so come back to the railway? You never know, if FGW got their act together, they would no longer cart around fresh air in their HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train)!

I doubt any trains leaving Paddington at 6.07pm are carting around any fresh air...

[Ollie]

Shame FGW^▸ (First Great Western) won't do something similar on the Cotswold line! Even if they did, you'd need an Anytime ticket and it would probably be a Turbo half the time. Don't they understand that marketing a 2 hour express would cause both business and leisure travellers so come back to the railway? You never know, if FGW got their act together, they would no longer cart around fresh air in their HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train)!

On North Cotswolds services from Paddington you can use SVR (Off Peak Return) if travelling Hanborough and beyond so no need for Anytime. (won't mention 1st class as Chiltern don't have it)
17:22, 17:50, 18:22 and 19:22 are all booked as HST.

Not sure when you last travelled on FGW but trains leave Paddington in the peak particularly busy.

[Btline]

Obviously I'm not talking about peak trains when I talk about fresh air! My point is that if passenger numbers are increased, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) will no longer cart around fresh air in their HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) the rest of the time.

Not sure what your 1st class point is... it'll just say that Chiltern 168 standard class is better than FGW 166 1st class.

The Cotswold line is always the 1st line to have HSTs pulled. I've travelled up and down a few times recently all on booked HST services. All trains turned up as Turbos. In fact, I have not seen an HST on the Cotswold for ages.

[Ollie]

My 1st class point is that in evening peak out of Paddington - First Off Peak tickets aren't valid.

[inspector_blakey]

The Cotswold line is always the 1st line to have HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) pulled.

There's a simple reason for that. When the poo is hitting the large spinning object apropos HST availability, that's the only place that FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s controllers can substitute Turbo vice HST.

Put yourself in their position: do you cancel a Bristol/Cardiff/Swansea/WoE service for want of an HST or do you step a Cotswold HST up to cover the other diagram (where it may stand a fighting chance of getting to 125 occasionally  ) and form a Cotswold service from Turbo stock. It's an obvious choice when you take a step back and look at things dispassionately. Certainly not an ideal situation, but "across the board" inconvenience is minimized by avoiding any cancellation and substituting the Turbo.

Hopefully when/if the 180s find their way back the situation may be alleviated.