Penalty fares go live in April 2010

[whole diary]

[broadgage]

That sounds rather bizarre to me.

Surely a TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) just links to the relevant bank and deducts the price of the ticket: assuming there is sufficient money in the account, it should be possible to keep buying tickets all day, if one feels so inclined ... ?

I believe that there is a limit as to the number of times a card can be used in the same day in the same ticket machine.

I suspect that this is an anti fraud measure, since otherwise a thief could use a stolen card to buy numerous tickets, and then take these tickets to the ticket office for a refund.
I have had a card refused when trying to buy a ticket for a friend after buying one for myself.

This may apply only to certain types of cards and certain locations, perhaps based on previous fraud levels.

[grahame]

I believe that there is a limit as to the number of times a card can be used in the same day in the same ticket machine.

I have had a card refused when trying to buy a ticket for a friend after buying one for myself.

Yes - I have been there too.

If you can't get a ticket because your card has been refused (through no fault of your own - you are trying to be a lucrative customer), could you be PF^▸ (Penalty Fare)'d?

[vacman]

I believe that there is a limit as to the number of times a card can be used in the same day in the same ticket machine.

I have had a card refused when trying to buy a ticket for a friend after buying one for myself.

Yes - I have been there too.

If you can't get a ticket because your card has been refused (through no fault of your own - you are trying to be a lucrative customer), could you be PF^▸ (Penalty Fare)'d?

simple answer is yes, you would then need to appeal, if your card is declined then how do you intend to pay? if your card was declined in Tesco then you wouldn't be allowed to take the goods without providing another means of payment.

[Mookiemoo]

I believe that there is a limit as to the number of times a card can be used in the same day in the same ticket machine.

I have had a card refused when trying to buy a ticket for a friend after buying one for myself.

Yes - I have been there too.

If you can't get a ticket because your card has been refused (through no fault of your own - you are trying to be a lucrative customer), could you be PF^▸ (Penalty Fare)'d?

simple answer is yes, you would then need to appeal, if your card is declined then how do you intend to pay? if your card was declined in Tesco then you wouldn't be allowed to take the goods without providing another means of payment.

For the same reason as yesterday there was perfectly good money in my bank account yet for some reason FGW^▸ (First Great Western) chip and pin machine refused to accept it (I thought the glitch was fixed)

[Brucey]

Do TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) still accept cheques, e.g. in the case your card is refused even though the account is full of money?  I remember enquiring a little while back and it was a yes - is this still the case?

[Ollie]

Do TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) still accept cheques, e.g. in the case your card is refused even though the account is full of money?  I remember enquiring a little while back and it was a yes - is this still the case?

We can take cheques as long as you have a cheque guarantee card.

[Super Guard]

Do TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) still accept cheques, e.g. in the case your card is refused even though the account is full of money?  I remember enquiring a little while back and it was a yes - is this still the case?

We can take cheques as long as you have a cheque guarantee card.

Assuming the fare isn't greater than the limit...

[JayMac]

I suspect that this is an anti fraud measure, since otherwise a thief could use a stolen card to buy numerous tickets, and then take these tickets to the ticket office for a refund.

That wouldn't benefit a thief with a stolen card in any way. The refund would be processed back onto the card and the tickets surrendered.

[brompton rail]

One card transaction and you are out! Well, that is one of the reasons that I have long ceased using machines for tickets. "Save time and use the machine sir" ... well, if your transaction is for 2 tickets, both with Railcards and the machine will only issue one railcard ticket at a time, and then refuses a second card transaction how are you to buy 2 tickets?

Therefore I now always buy my travel tickets from a staffed Travel Centre or Booking Office. That way I get my ticket quicker, with less hassle, with a pleasant word from the staff AND contribute to keeping someone in a job!
 

[Brucey]

I heard an announcement at Temple Meads today.  Not exactly "hard hitting".  No mention of being ^20 or twice the single fare, just a mention of having to buy before you board.

I noticed there were three people manning the gates today (usually one or none) and they now wear yellow and orange reflective jackets (previously just the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) suit jacket thing or a yellow jacket).  Perhaps trying to increase visibility.

On the train to Severn Beach, the guard got round to 7 people before we arrived at Lawrence Hill.  Of these, only 2 had tickets (including myself).  The other 5 needed to buy one.  As the ticket barriers were in force today, I'm assuming these people must have come from destinations further afield as all 5 had suitcases.  Made me wonder why someone would want to buy a separate ticket at ^1.50 (and risk a Penalty Fare) when most distant destinations either don't have a surcharge for an SVB line station or they are very minimal (e.g. 10-50p)?

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

I heard an announcement at Temple Meads today.  Not exactly "hard hitting".  No mention of being ^20 or twice the single fare, just a mention of having to buy before you board.

I noticed there were three people manning the gates today (usually one or none) and they now wear yellow and orange reflective jackets (previously just the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) suit jacket thing or a yellow jacket).  Perhaps trying to increase visibility.

On the train to Severn Beach, the guard got round to 7 people before we arrived at Lawrence Hill.  Of these, only 2 had tickets (including myself).  The other 5 needed to buy one.  As the ticket barriers were in force today, I'm assuming these people must have come from destinations further afield as all 5 had suitcases.  Made me wonder why someone would want to buy a separate ticket at ^1.50 (and risk a Penalty Fare) when most distant destinations either don't have a surcharge for an SVB line station or they are very minimal (e.g. 10-50p)?

i was also at bristol today and you know what? went up last night and returned this morning both cross country.... walked straight threw the barriers and tickets were not checked at station or on trains... comment from my friend who doesnt often use the train was ' mate we could have gone for free..... posters and warning notices alone are not good enough.... the barriers were however working at st davids so good show there!

[Brucey]

i was also at bristol today and you know what? went up last night and returned this morning both cross country.... walked straight threw the barriers and tickets were not checked at station or on trains... comment from my friend who doesnt often use the train was ' mate we could have gone for free..... posters and warning notices alone are not good enough.... the barriers were however working at st davids so good show there!

But that is where the system gets even more complicated and provides yet more loopholes for fare evaders.  CrossCountry don't do penalty fares.  That means that if you hadn't bought a tickets and travelled to EXD^» (Exeter St Davids - next trains) on XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)), then you can't be PFed.  The gate assistants at EXD will only be able to sell you the most expensive single.

I've pointed out a similar loophole previously, where FGW^▸ (First Great Western) don't do penalty fares from most SWT^▸ (South West Trains) stations.

A successful penalty fare scheme needs, in my opinion, all operators for a particular area to participate and ensure that tickets are thoroughly checked at both the beginning or end of journey (or even better, during the journey).

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

and today as the 944 xc service was 28 mins late everyone going towards plymouth jumped on the fgw stopping service to plymouth we however waited 10 mins and the xc hst was quiet i pitty the people on the stopper that looked cosy !  but it did get me thinking (ok bank holiday so not relivant) but are the off peak times for xc and fgw different at bristol?

[brompton rail]

The Off Peak times are set by whichever TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) sets the fare for the journey being made by the passenger. Also some Off Peak tickets carry only a after 5.00 am restriction, whilst others it could be after 9.30. The example I can quote is, say, Doncaster to Bristol - after 9.30 departure for O/P, but Doncaster to Taunton Off Peak means after 05.30. So 2 passengers on the same train, bothe have O/P tickets but if the Bristol passenger is on the 09.42 arrival at TM^‡(resolve) then their ticket isn't valid, but the Taunton passenger is OK. Confused? You should be!!

Oh! Of course today is a Bank Holiday and Off Peak time restrictions don't apply!!

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

was just thinking is it possible to get an off peak ticket plan on getting an xc train for which its valid... its late a fgw service turns up going the same place so you get on but their off peak is a different time so you get a pen fair... is that possible?