SWT Pricing confusion

[whole diary]

[JJ]

I was just looking at ticket prices and discovered the following.

GILLLINGHAM DORSET to EASTLEIGH Via Salisbury ^18.60
GILLINGHAM DORSET to BASINGSTOKE Direct ^20.30
GILLINGHAM DORSET to EASTLEIGH Via Basingstoke ^18.60

So does that mean if I wanted to go to Basingstoke I buy a ticket so Eastleigh and save  couple of quid.
Is there any more of these known?

[devon_metro]

GILLINGHAM DORSET to EASTLEIGH Via Basingstoke ^18.60

No such fare.

CDR^▸ (Off Peak Day Return [ticket type] (formerly 'Cheap Day'))   -  OFF-PEAK DAY R               SWT^▸ (South West Trains)
00618 -  SALISBURY       

   1 Adult    @^    18.60  =  ^    18.60
                              __________
                              ^    18.60

Is the only one.

[JJ]

But I put 'Via Basingstoke' In the box.

[Ollie]

Probably also had a multiple tickets symbol.

[Brucey]

The only ticket available for that journey is routed Salisbury.  However, if you go via. Basingstoke, you are still passing through Salisbury on your way to Basingstoke, so that is valid.

Also I've just checked the Roueting Guide.  Gillingham is in both Yeovil and Salisbury group.  Yeovil-Eastleigh is permitted through maps BB+LE (plus others) which both include Basingstoke.

So going via Basingstoke on the Salisbury ticket is allowed.

The Gillingham - Eastleigh ticket allows a break of journey, so you would be able to terminate your journey early at Basingstoke.  HOWEVER, the Gillingham - Basingstoke ticket is valid ANY PERMITTED whilst Gillingham - Eastleigh is valid SALISBURY.  So you must ensure you pass through Salisbury.

[JJ]

Sweet!

[TheLastMinute]

Also I've just checked the Roueting Guide.  Gillingham is in both Yeovil and Salisbury group.  Yeovil-Eastleigh is permitted through maps BB+LE (plus others) which both include Basingstoke.

So going via Basingstoke on the Salisbury ticket is allowed.

The Gillingham - Eastleigh ticket allows a break of journey, so you would be able to terminate your journey early at Basingstoke.  HOWEVER, the Gillingham - Basingstoke ticket is valid ANY PERMITTED whilst Gillingham - Eastleigh is valid SALISBURY.  So you must ensure you pass through Salisbury.

I hope you don't mind Brucey, but for the benefit of others I can just highlight an error in the above? The conclusion that travel via Basingstoke is allowed was correct but the method was flawed.

You've correctly said that the associated routing points of Gillingham (Dorset) are Yeovil and Salisbury. However in this case we can't use the Yeovil routing point as it is not an appropriate routing point for this journey i.e. the fare from Yeovil to Eastleigh (21.20) is higher than from Gillingham (18.60). Salisbury is an appropriate routing point as the fare is lower at 11.60. The permitted routes between Salisbury and Eastleigh are maps BD and WX. BD permits travel via either Southampton Central or Chandler's Ford. WX permits via Basingstoke.

The fare is Route Salisbury but as we have to go though Salisbury anyway the permitted route is the shortest route from Gillingham to Salisbury and then either via Southampton Central, Chandler's Ford or Basingstoke.

Cheers,
TLM

[grahame]

[snip]

Is there any more of these known?

Hi, Welcome "JJ".  The fare system is overcomplex and you'll find a number of curiosities, though I'm not sure as I would describe them as "blunders".   Even starting a new system from scratch, you'll have some anomolies crop up that won't easily be answered / explained away.

With some fares just gone down by 0.4% and others risen by 15%, it may be "all change" on these oddities this morning.  I don't personally know of any others on SWT^▸ (South West Trains) ... but (at least at the end of last year) there were a number on First Great Western, some of which you'll find in old threads here.  But don't just look at overshoots ... you can sometimes do very well by splitting your journey into two pieces, especially if one half is peak and the other half strays into off peak.

[paul7575]

'Via Basingstoke' doesn't really have a purpose now, because it has no time advantage over Salisbury > Romsey > Eastleigh via Chandlers Ford. It may have been a logical routeing prior to the new Chandlers Ford service starting though, depending on what the connections were like from FGW^▸ (First Great Western) at Southampton.  OTOH^▸ (On The Other Hand) although it looks a long way round on the railway map, it isn't really on the geographic map.

The problem with breaking your journey at Basingstoke is that you won't get through the ticket gates, so the existence of the cheaper ticket is immediately highlighted to staff. If it started being regularly used by Basingstoke pax SWT^▸ (South West Trains) will probably get the Routeing Guide amended...

Agree also that the Yeovil routeing point is irrelevant in this case.

Paul

[Tim]

The problem with breaking your journey at Basingstoke is that you won't get through the ticket gates.

You will if you ask at the manual gate.  These loopholes are there to be used. 

[paul7575]

But that's my point. When the barrier staff at Basingstoke let you out they'll visually check the ticket. I know you are entitled to BOJ, but if they notice a sudden increase in the number of people fronting up with an Eastleigh ticket, they do have the means to close the loophole.

Paul

[Tim]

But that's my point. When the barrier staff at Basingstoke let you out they'll visually check the ticket. I know you are entitled to BOJ, but if they notice a sudden increase in the number of people fronting up with an Eastleigh ticket, they do have the means to close the loophole.

Paul

yes, but surely better to use the loophole until it is noticed and closed (if it ever is) than not use it for fear of it being closed. 

[grahame]

JJ asked (at the start of this thread) for other examples.

I just checked on the new pricing ... an off peak return for Saturday, Melksham to Stapleton Road costs 9.40.  An anytime return is cheaper at 9.00, and an off peak return to Sea Mills (that's a few stations further on, towards Severn Beach) is just 7.60. More interestingly, the off peak return from Melksham to Bristol Temple Meads is 8.90, so it's a saving if we're going to Bristol from here to buy a ticket to a Severn Beach line station ...

Trowbridge to Temple Meads is 8 pounds off peak return, as is Trowbridge to Sea Mills .... so if you want to burn the candle at both ends (as it were) you can pay 7.60 for a Melksham to Sea Mills off peak return and use it for just the middle part - Trowbridge to Temple Meads - part of the journey.

All very silly ... the system is riddled with anachronisms like this which (as this thread showed earlier) you need a great deal of time and understanding to be able to work out.  I would much rather have a simpler system and, yes, I would be prepared and expect to see some of the 'loopholes' closed. The income saved on the unintended anacronisms could - just could - make the difference between a certain service being financially viable and not!

[Brucey]

Trowbridge to Temple Meads is 8 pounds off peak return, as is Trowbridge to Sea Mills .... so if you want to burn the candle at both ends (as it were) you can pay 7.60 for a Melksham to Sea Mills off peak return and use it for just the middle part - Trowbridge to Temple Meads - part of the journey.

Trying to increase the ticket sales for Melksham there Graham?

Here is another one:
Bristol TM^‡(resolve) to Cosham - ^36.70 for an SVR ticket
Bristol TM to Havant - ^35.70 for an SVR ticket
Havant is actually further than Cosham (from Bristol) and would usually involve changing trains at Cosham (unless you are on the Brighton train).

[devon_metro]

One of my favourites, stemming from Intercity days is where you can get a CDR^▸ (Off Peak Day Return [ticket type] (formerly 'Cheap Day')) from A to B at ^10.40 which allows travel via C.

A to C is a SVR and costs ^15.20

Blooming marvellous.