Windsor Link Rail

[whole diary]

[Chris from Nailsea]

From Get Surrey:

Egham 'should have say' over Windsor Link Railway


Proposed routes for the Windsor Link Railway

A new privately financed rail link will not gridlock Egham^s level crossings if built, according to its boss.

George Bathurst, managing director of the Windsor Link Railway (WLR), hopes support for its proposals in Windsor will be echoed in Runnymede.

The scheme would link Windsor with Heathrow Airport via a new line through Wraysbury, or alternatively via Staines on the route championed by BAA^s now defunct and opposed Airtrack scheme.

If built, the project aims to expand to the Reading line, which passes through Egham before diverting at Staines on the new line, meaning more services across Egham^s four level crossings.

Campaigners strongly objected to Airtrack, fearing the extra services would cause level crossing barriers to be down so long it would gridlock the town, discouraging businesses and shoppers. Egham Chamber of Commerce led the protests against the project, which was ditched two years ago.

Chairman Mark Adams said of the WLR: ^The Chamber of Commerce broadly welcomes plans to improve the railway network as a means to dealing with transport problems and providing better connectivity and services. However, as was the case with the Airtrack scheme, we would not support a scheme that does not tackle other related parts of the transport network at the same time, particularly in relation to level crossings and the significant impact of increased barrier downtimes on the local population and economy.^

Mr Bathurst said: ^The railways were built when the South East was mostly rural, and while many towns in the region have relatively easy links to the capital, orbital connections remain difficult. The WLR will not only tackle these historic problems but will also provide much needed jobs and growth.^

Results from an online survey running since March 3 show 95% of 237 respondents in Windsor backed the plan. Yet, anti-Airtrack petitioner Richard Smith, of Wavendene Avenue, Egham, felt if the rail link would affect wider communities, they should be included in the survey. He added: ^If it is going to provide as much traffic as the Airtrack scheme it is not going to be good for the Egham area, that^s for sure. We suffer enough with the crossings as it is, and certainly an increase in traffic will cause us problems ^ we^ll be back to the same situation we were in a couple of years ago and we would ask for the same investment we asked for then ^ a road tunnel.^

WLR said the Department for Transport confirmed the plans satisfy government specifications for a westerly link to Heathrow, and Mr Bathurst said WLR^s approach to Egham would be different to BAA^s.

He said: ^We would consult and design a system that works with them, we would be replacing level crossings or other mitigations to work out what people needed. It^s a scheme for local transport improvements throughout the area.^

To take part in the survey, visit: http://windsorlink.co.uk/.

[Electric train]

Seems to have gained a little more traction .........

http://www.windsorobserver.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2013/06/20/90502-boost-for-windsor-link-railway-project/

Although in Network Rail speak ...... you find all the money and we'll be happy to support the project as long as it don't cost us anything

[JayMac]

I've said elsewhere, porcine aviation will happen first.

[Electric train]

I've said elsewhere, porcine aviation will happen first.

maybe so but you have to admire there enthusiasm and even eccentricity

[eightf48544]

Still think curve and gradient of Link makes it impractical.

[tom m]

Seems that it is being pushed a little more:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-27760760

Its only funding for planning permission, but if the permission is granted, is it a serious proposal that can be privately funded?

[Electric train]

Seems that it is being pushed a little more:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-27760760

Its only funding for planning permission, but if the permission is granted, is it a serious proposal that can be privately funded?

I went to an IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) lecture last month in High Wycombe where George Bathurst gave lecture, he has the business plan laid out for funding the project, his first objective raise the funding for planning permission once planning permission is granted he sees the funding for the design and construction being unlocked, he has various thoughts who would fund it.

[eightf48544]

Still think curve and gradient of Link makes it impractical.

To add to my misgivings there's the question of electrifcation. by the time any work could start the Slough to Windsor branch will have the wires slung. Riverside is already third rail. So are SWT^▸ (South West Trains) (or whoever) going to have a set of dual voltage units for the service, for just for 2 miles?

Maybe the 313s if there are any left. The Riverside passengers aren't going to like those after their Desiros and refurbed Junipers.

[Electric train]

Still think curve and gradient of Link makes it impractical.

To add to my misgivings there's the question of electrifcation. by the time any work could start the Slough to Windsor branch will have the wires slung. Riverside is already third rail. So are SWT^▸ (South West Trains) (or whoever) going to have a set of dual voltage units for the service, for just for 2 miles?

Maybe the 313s if there are any left. The Riverside passengers aren't going to like those after their Desiros and refurbed Junipers.

Nop!

Windsor Rail Link intention is to de-wire the Slough - Windsor route and install third rail, the WR trains terminate at Slough, SW Trains have told WR they don't want to run AC/DC^▸ (Direct Current) stock, also the AC/DC change over area is a complex bit of electrification.

They have to terminate at Slough because the cost of a grade separated junction at Slough is prohibitively expensive, NR^» (Network Rail - home page) will not allow a flat junction across the Mains to Reliefs.  Also WR will almost certainly have to build one new Traction Substation and at least one Track Paralleling Hut between Datchet (currently the nearest Traction Substation to Windsor Riverside) and Slough.  Its more these aspects that make me think it will falter

[eightf48544]

Thanks for spelling out the problem Electric train.

I tackled Councillor Bathurst on the problems of elctrifcation and it was brushed aside. You've given me some good ammunition for any future encounter with him.

Whilst in general terms I would support such links they have to have a point.

I can't see what advantage Windsor gets from the link.

OK Slough gets direct access to Staines Feltham, Twickenham (for rugby fans)and Richmond, but I'm not sure many people from Slough want to go to those places and even less from them to Slough! Plus as the Windwor line to  Waterloo is slow it will probably still be quicker to go via Crossrail and the Bakeloo  from Slough.

[grahame]

Consortium submits proposal for Windsor Link Railway in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) - Global Rail News

A consortium including global investor Meridiam has submitted a market-led proposal to the UK government to build the Windsor Link Railway.

Phase 1 of the project will cost £370 million and will see a new rail tunnel constructed in Windsor – as well as new houses – to connect the South Western and Great Western main lines. Phase 2 will connect Heathrow to the west.

[ellendune]

Consortium submits proposal for Windsor Link Railway in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) - Global Rail News

A consortium including global investor Meridiam has submitted a market-led proposal to the UK government to build the Windsor Link Railway.

Phase 1 of the project will cost £370 million and will see a new rail tunnel constructed in Windsor – as well as new houses – to connect the South Western and Great Western main lines. Phase 2 will connect Heathrow to the west.

[/PedantMode=On]
So houses are now to be provided to connect South Western and GW^▸ (Great Western) Main lines - will the passengers be delayed that long they will need to live there?
[/PedantMode=Off]

[FarWestJohn]

Hope it is completed more speedily than the re-opening to Tavistock.

[paul7575]

Heathrow doesn’t need three new links does it? 

If the more direct western link via Langley towards Slough is built, which already seems to have DfT^» (Department for Transport - about)&NR^» (Network Rail - home page) backing, surely the second priority should be the Southern link via Staines and West Byfleet towards Woking and Guildford?

Paul

[Noggin]

Consortium submits proposal for Windsor Link Railway in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) - Global Rail News

A consortium including global investor Meridiam has submitted a market-led proposal to the UK government to build the Windsor Link Railway.

Phase 1 of the project will cost £370 million and will see a new rail tunnel constructed in Windsor – as well as new houses – to connect the South Western and Great Western main lines. Phase 2 will connect Heathrow to the west.

[/PedantMode=On]
So houses are now to be provided to connect South Western and GW^▸ (Great Western) Main lines - will the passengers be delayed that long they will need to live there?
[/PedantMode=Off]

As far as I can see it's effectively a property development scheme which is enabled by burying the railway under Windsor and as a sweetener, ties the two lines together. Whilst such tunneling is hardly going to be cheap, the resulting property is going to be highly desirable, and thus very lucrative for the developers.

I've not read all the bumph, as ever, the devil is in the detail and a few things strike me as problematic (some of which are mentioned above). Presuming that the intention is to extend Waterloo services to Slough rather than reverse them in a new underground Windsor station:

1) The line from Windsor to Slough will need to be redoubled. How practical/costly is that going to be? There are a number of bridges to be replaced for a start.
2) Slough station will likely need an additional platform (at least) to terminate Waterloo services, that will presumably block the current access to the car park. 
3) The line will need to be electrified. The obvious way to do it would be to extend 3rd rail to Slough as it will be less visually intrusive and not require dual-voltage stock, but will the regulators allow this through a semi-rural area which is difficult to control access to? As we know, running 3rd rail and 25kV in close proximity is tricky and the cost of NR^» (Network Rail - home page) making alterations to the wiring in Slough station is likely to be high.
4) The plans indicate a west-facing curve linking the Windsor line to the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line). As far as I can see from Google Maps it's going to be extremely tricky to provide access to Stranraer Gardens as the ORR^» (Office of Rail and Road formerly Office of Rail Regulation - about) now frowns on level crossings.