DMU cascades - latest news

[whole diary]

[Mookiemoo]

I believe all the LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise) units are maintained at the same depot aren't they? Tyseley? Lets not forget the thrashing that the LM 150's have been subjected to over the years, ALL 150's are banned from Lickey, not just LM ones!

Very true, as when Anglia 150s were brought to CT (swapped for CT 158s), they weren't allowed on the Licky incline either. The ban was around 2003/4. So it just goes to show that they as a class are clapped out. Combine that with the woeful maintenance from both CT and LM, then I can't see them lasting, unless they are given some serious TLC^▸ (three letter code ).

Although I am no fan of them, I don't avoid them like FA - I consider that too far. The only time they are unbearable, is when it is hot, and they are packed. That's why I feel sorry for commuters to B'ham in the summer. The line from Kidderminster is Birmingham's MOST OVERCROWDED commuter line, and yet it has not been electrified, and the 172s will reduce seats by 10 in each coach (with 1 fewer vehicles as well). Not fair! Although they are well overdue, and they'll be more comfortable.*

*EDIT: Looking at the stats, LM 172s will have, on average, fewer seats per coach than CH 168s! So FA, you'll have plenty of tables!

Firstly - you live in Kiddie so for you to drive to ludlow to avoid them would be insanity - I'm closer to ludlow than you

You\re only viable option to avoid them is to drive to WOS^» (Worcester Shrub Hill - next trains) and use the WOS-Bromsgrove-university route - which would probably take longer!

By the time I drive from clee hill to kiddie, park, wait for the clapped out 150, sit on a seat with no padding etc etc - its only about an extra 20 minutes door to door to go ludlow to brum via shrewsbury

To be fare - when I work IN london as opposed to Thamed valley - its only the LM 150 issue that keeps me loyal to FGW^▸ (First Great Western).

[Btline]

as for the lm fleet only doing 50mph that is a load of rubbish

First, I didn't say ALL the fleet did. But I have been in the cab of one that did. The driver was not surprised and indicated that it was not rare.

But I have been on plenty (almost all) where 75 was reached.

Firstly - you live in Kiddie so for you to drive to ludlow to avoid them would be insanity - I'm closer to ludlow than you

I most certainly do not, at least 2 miles away! (although I take your points)

But will you switch to VT^▸ (Virgin Trains - former franchises) and LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise) to go to London post 172s?

[northwesterntrains]

Arriva get my business hands down.

London Midland units must be awful then 

You may not be aware that while Arriva Trains Wales and First Great Western have 150s with 2+2 seating and some tables, London Midland and Northern Rail have units with 3+2 seating and no tables.

[devon_metro]

it was moreof a dig at Arriva 

[paul7575]

One month on from my post that started this thread, the latest Modern Railways (Dec edition) now suggests that FGW^▸ (First Great Western) will not get any of LO's 150s, these 6 will now go to EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about).

Often these switch rounds are all about sorting out the stock into similarly lifed batches, or making sure a particular TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) has economies of scale in dealing with only one ROSCo, so it isn't that significant I guess.

Paul

[The SprinterMeister]

Seems an odd move, bearing in mind FGW^▸ (First Great Western) already have 2 x ex Silverlink / LOROL^▸ (London Overground Railway Operations Ltd) 150/1 on the books. Perhaps the balance of 150 vehicles to make up the 15 x 2 car sets will come from London Midland instead. Certainly 15 x 2 car is the minimum required to replace the current selection of subleased unit / locohauled tat currently in use.

[anthony215]

Latest news according to the Bristol evening post is that the London overground class 150's are going to East Midlands Trains.

[northwesterntrains]

One month on from my post that started this thread, the latest Modern Railways (Dec edition) now suggests that FGW^▸ (First Great Western) will not get any of LO's 150s, these 6 will now go to EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about).

Often these switch rounds are all about sorting out the stock into similarly lifed batches, or making sure a particular TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) has economies of scale in dealing with only one ROSCo, so it isn't that significant I guess.

Paul

So is that instead of the 6 156s EMT were supposed to be getting from Northern or could it be the 6 150s go to Northern and the 6 156s still go to EMT.

I think if EMT are going to get anything from Northern they should get back the 158 centre cars not 2 car 156s, which go around overcrowded in the North West.  The middle 158s were supposed to be for York-Blackpool but Northern just use them on any service serving Leeds.  It would certainly be diastrous for Northern to downgarde the North West 156 diagrams to 150, they already did that with the 158 diagrams from the First North Western area when they sent all the 158s to Leeds Neville Hill depot.

[paul7575]

So is that instead of the 6 156s EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about) were supposed to be getting from Northern or could it be the 6 150s go to Northern and the 6 156s still go to EMT.

I think if EMT are going to get anything from Northern they should get back the 158 centre cars not 2 car 156s, which go around overcrowded in the North West.  The middle 158s were supposed to be for York-Blackpool but Northern just use them on any service serving Leeds.  It would certainly be diastrous for Northern to downgarde the North West 156 diagrams to 150, they already did that with the 158 diagrams from the First North Western area when they sent all the 158s to Leeds Neville Hill depot.

I think the Modern Railways story suggests that more 2 car units is the preference so that some of the 158s currently in use on diagrams 'other than Liverpool - Norwich' can be transferred onto that route, but they'll then operate with joining and splitting at Nottingham.  This is probably more beneficial than having 3 car trains that are pretty empty as they head through East Anglia.

Paul

[paul7575]

Latest news according to the Bristol evening post is that the London overground class 150's are going to East Midlands Trains.

As I posted here last week, based on Modern Railways' article.  Note how the paper gets it completely wrong by suggesting that all 15 units (30 vehicles) were coming from LO, who only have 6 in use...

Paul

[Timmer]

Latest news according to the Bristol evening post is that the London overground class 150's are going to East Midlands Trains.

Here is a link to the Bristol Evening Post article that anthony215 is referring to:
http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/news/Great-Western-loses-train-carriages/article-1567430-detail/article.html

[eightf48544]

This is th 116thpost on thread.

Have any DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) cascades taken place yet?

The DafT seem to be trying to make too few DMUs run too many servcies. Hence the chopping and changing of who gets what.

Lets go back to the original plan and build lots 172s and if there is no work for them after the electrification of certain lines  they can be used to replace the Pacers which can be scrapped.

With the best will in the world it will be a very long time before every strectch of line in England Scotland and Wales is wired up. There should be at least 30 work for any new DMUS unless we don't have any branch lines in 30 years.

[paul7575]

This is th 116thpost on thread.

Have any DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) cascades taken place yet?

The cascade we are discussing will be triggered by the new build of 172s for LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise), LO and Chiltern. Although this was first proposed nearly 2 years ago, it was not planned to occur until 2010. That is the main reason why it hasn't happened yet, surely?

Paul

[The SprinterMeister]

The cascade we are discussing will be triggered by the new build of 172s for LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise), LO and Chiltern. Although this was first proposed nearly 2 years ago, it was not planned to occur until 2010. That is the main reason why it hasn't happened yet, surely?

Paul

172 production is about 5 months behind schedule and counting. And this is before LM / LOROL^▸ (London Overground Railway Operations Ltd) get one out on test, find the ZF lorry transmission is an abject disaster and order some sort of Voith T211r (preferably T311r) to be retrofitted. Shouldn't hold your breath waiting for DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit)'s to start moving round the country just yet..........
 

[northwesterntrains]

Here is a link to the Bristol Evening Post article that anthony215 is referring to:
http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/news/Great-Western-loses-train-carriages/article-1567430-detail/article.html

The message in that article seems very mixed up.  PTEs^▸ (Passenger Transport Executive) only involve themselves with local journeys not regional or express services and EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about)'s Liverpool-Manchester-Sheffield-Norwich service does not come under PTE categories. 

In the case of Merseyside the PTE, Merseytravel, are involved with Merseyrail and Northern Rail. London Midland who run Liverpool-Birmingham, TransPennine Express who run Liverpool-Scarborough and East Midlands Trains who run Liverpool to Norwich are not involved with Merseytravel.

I don't know where the idea that PTE's can get what they want comes from.  West Yorkshire Metro have been successful in doing that to get 158s and 333s, but Merseyside is stuck with a load of 1970s 507/508s and mid 1980s 142s and 150s.