Bicycles on trains (merged topics)

[whole diary]

[mjones]

Would these be the cyclists who ride on pavements? Ignore no entry signs, ride along one way streets in the WRONG direction?
No problems OFF-PEAK but cyclists hopefully should see other passengers wish to travel with luggage, prams etc. We are carry MORE passengers with less rolling stock compared to the early 90s.

Another silly generalisation. You might equally say that the people who drive to the station are the same drivers who jump red lights, park on the pavement, break the speed limit, use their phones while driving etc etc 

Note that I've already acknowledged the constraints on capacity and space.

[Toiletdriver]

Would these be the cyclists who ride on pavements? Ignore no entry signs, ride along one way streets in the WRONG direction?
No problems OFF-PEAK but cyclists hopefully should see other passengers wish to travel with luggage, prams etc. We are carry MORE passengers with less rolling stock compared to the early 90s.

Another silly generalisation. You might equally say that the people who drive to the station are the same drivers who jump red lights, park on the pavement, break the speed limit, use their phones while driving etc etc 

Note that I've already acknowledged the constraints on capacity and space.

Thank you on the space, and I agree with you about car drivers and designer indicators !
Thanks to Thatcher, the attitude is "I'm alright Jack, screw you!"

[Mookiemoo]

Ok I've stayed out of this but on behalf of cyclists can I say we are not all the same.

I have one of these


http://uk.dahon.com/bikes/2010/cadenza-p18

Folds in half - for years I travelled with it in the disabled space in g - and on two occasions ive ended up on a wind swept platform on the Cotswolds line in the dark when someone who needed to use the space boarded - and I'm fine with that - tis the gamble I took/take

I never

1. Disobey the highway code
2. Cycle on pavements
3. Jump red lights (apart from one near paddington where the light is half way up a hill and it's a t junction where the road is the straight one and if you come to a stOp getting going again is a mare but as q cyclist you don't interfere with the motor flow - you hav e to know the junction to know what I mean)

[BBM]

In Germany most local trains have a 'Mehrzweckbereich' which basically means a multi-use area. Here's an example from the Hamburg S-Bahn:



The area is fitted with tip-up seats to allow room for bikes, buggies and wheelchairs. I think it's an excellent idea - I have no problems with bikes on trains as long as they don't block exits. However I suppose it would be too expensive for FGW^▸ (First Great Western) to re-fit part of one coach on each Turbo set like that?

[IndustryInsider]

There already is some tip-up seats (admittedly only 3) and a general purpose area which can store at least two bikes in the centre carriage of a class 166.  So a class 166 can potentially store up to 4 bikes without blocking any doorways.

[dviner]

Tip-up seats to allow for bicycles are a fair solution when applied to off-peak travel, but I could envision some raised blood-pressure during peak commuting time - 2-3 seats tipped up out of use to accommodate a bicycle, while the cyclist is sat in another...

Ah, the joys of defining a one-size-fits-all carriage layout!

[argg]

I just can not see the need to take a bike to Padd anymore, lock the bike at your local station and use a Boris Bike in zone 1 simples

Bikes especially full frame ones do grate with me and really *iss's me off when I can not get on a train because someone wants to occupy more space than they are paying for simply passenger with bike = 2 fares

Agree wholeheartedly on both points but have you tried finding a working boris bike anywhere near Paddington in the morning peak? Many more bikes required - damn good system IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion)

On the basis that all peak non-HST^▸ (High Speed Train) services are full and standing all bikes should be banned.  At Paddington surely the gate staff could enforce this policy for the evening peak and impose an excess fare in the morning.  As you say..."simples"

I also agree with the other comments here about behaviour and attitude (of cyclists).  For some reason their journey is far more important than anyone else's.

While we're banning certain users, what about families using evening peak services during school holidays.  Have a meal in town early evening (the kids will love it) and travel later.  And for an insight into "bohemian" life travel back late at night - that's always an invigorating experience 

[jane s]

Phew! Seems like I'm not the only one to have a problem with cyclists then! 

Put it this way, I'll stop hating cyclists when they stop trying to run me over when I'm crossing on a green man at pelican crossings. (If only the police would fine them a fixed penalty for every time this happened!)

Anyway, a couple of good bike-on-train stories for you:

1) A few months ago I had just got on the 07:43 SDO^▸ (Selective Door Opening) HST^▸ (High Speed Train) from Tilehurst when we were informed that we would be delayed while the train was moved forward a few yards and the doors re-opened because unfortunately there was a cyclist in one of the rear carriages who needed to get off, and the carriage in question was not currently on the platform. (Presumably resulting in one very red-faced cyclist!) Anyway for several weeks after that the indicators for that train had a specific "no bicycles" message.

2) One day I got on a turbo at Reading in the morning peak only to find that some ^%$%^ seemed to find it perfectly reasonable to park his bicycle along the aisle, blocking off several rows of empty seats. I said, none too politely, "Scuse me, how many seats do you need?", whereupon he did at least move it, but I'm still not sure he actually understood the problem he was causing.

All this in addition to "the Burnham problem" (i.e. the fact that the doors open on the "wrong side) and the number of times an almighty crash is heard coming from the vestible because a bike has fallen over (on to me on one occasion, resulting in a large bruise).

IMO^▸ (in my opinion) there are only two options for bikes:

a) get a folding bike, or preferably
b) get two, one for each end of the journey.

[SDS]

Get two cheap and nasty bikes for each end.
That way they wont get nicked as much as an expensive flash looking nice one would.

Still think they should bring back the mandatory reservation charge for bikes ^5 each way, regardless of season ticket cost. No refunds, No exchanges for whatever reason, just like advance purchase tickets!
If you don't have a reservation, you get one chance and one chance only (and get charged a tenner). Next time your seen without a reservation you WILL be refused travel and told to politely b***er off to the booking office.

"But I cant get bike reservations where I buy my ticket."
"Tough find a booking office that does, all FGW^▸ (First Great Western) ticket offices can do them, just some may not know how to."

[mjones]

Nice to see such an ethos of good customer service on the railways! 

And Jane, I could equally say "I'll stop hating drivers when they stop passing too close/ chatting on their phones" etc etc, couldn't I, but that would be silly generalisation to make, wouldn't it? So why is it OK for everyone to pour out their silly prejudices against cyclists on this forum?

[SDS]

Nice try of change of subject. Drivers using mobiles while driving. I like it........
But of course that is illegal so you are entitled to hate them for it. Train Drivers are banned from using mobiles in a cab (except in an emergency or when the CSR^▸ (Cab Secure Radio)/NRN^▸ (National Radio Network) fails).

[JayMac]

...and nice continuation of the change of subject.

Can you tell me SDS pad how you go about telling a customer (you know - the people who you are providing a service for) "to politely b***er off to the booking office"?

Were you off sick when you were supposed to attend your employers "Putting Customers First" course?

[Pedros]

I've been reading this debate with interest and am amazed by some of the really lazy generalisations being made by some.  It's like saying all Guards are 'jobsworths' or all BMW drivers are '**insert appropriate swearword**'. Its all just pretty silly and does you no favours what so ever.

To add to the debate, and I don't think I've heard anyone in disagreement here. Big bikes CAN be a nuisance on trains especially when it is busy, in a similar way in which pushchairs, prams, wheelchairs, massive handbags (added for lazy generalisation) can also be seen as a nuisance.  However, I really don't think people do it especially to make your journey a misery. 

One last point, and this is a genuine question and not fishing for an argument, but JaneS, how was the cyclist at fault for your scenario No.1?  Had the cyclist stored their bike in the wrong carriage and then couldn't get it out again, or was the Powercar with bike storage not aligned with the platform.  I'm struggling to see how this would happen.  Also, scenario 2, you asked the biker to move their bike and they did?

[SDS]

Can you tell me SDS pad how you go about telling a customer (you know - the people who you are providing a service for) "to politely b***er off to the booking office"?

Were you off sick when you were supposed to attend your employers "Putting Customers First" course?

I'm sorry sir, but new company policy tells me that you must have a mandatory reservation to get on this train with your bike. You can get one from the booking office.
Why?
Because some bike passengers have been abusing the system, just like you did last week sir.

I was also told to not to accept verbal abuse off anyone whoever they were.

[IndustryInsider]

I wonder what problems the other long distance TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company)'s have with bikes?  I'm thinking specifically of Virgin, East Coast, East Midland Trains and NXEA^▸ (National Express East Anglia) - all of them seem to have a 'reservation compulsory' system (at all times) rather than in just the peak hours, but none of them mention barring totally on some long distance services, like FGW^▸ (First Great Western) do.

I think there's much more that could be done to encourage cyclists to not travel with their bike on the train.  Facilities at stations need improving - schemes like the Leeds Cycle Point - http://cyclinginfo.co.uk/blog/cycling/cycle-point/ - should be considered for all of the large stations in London and some others.  With Paddington's ongoing Span 4 renovation it would be an ideal time to have set aside some space for one there.  Also, the TfL^» (Transport for London - about) bike scheme is proving to be a great success, judging from the number of people I've seen on them in London and the lack of news stories about the scheme (a pointer that any new scheme is working well!), so an expansion of that to other cities would also be good.