Delayed early service from Oxford

[whole diary]

[James Vertigan]

I was waiting for the early service from Acton Main Line to Paddington this morning which I believe is the 04:00 from Oxford (normally arrives @ AML 05:31)

This morning, I hadn't checked the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) website to see if it was running on time, and the service arrived at 05:49 

I thought I would be entitled to some form of compensation, I believe TFL^▸ (Transport for London) will give compensation if you are delayed by about half an hour or more, it would seem this is not the case with FGW who say you have to be delayed by an HOUR, at least that's what the lady at Paddington ticket office said.

I had bought a ticket at AML (^3.20) as I hadn't topped up my Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) before going to AML, so I don't know how much compensation I would have got from that, so I wasn't best pleased to get no compensation for having to stand on the platform freezing my bum off for 20 mins!

Why do different companies have different compensation times, and can anyone shed any light as why the service was late this morning as no information was given.

[Tim]

Why do different companies have different compensation times, and can anyone shed any light as why the service was late this morning as no information was given.

Because they are all governed by different franchise agreements.  THe time-limits are often 30 minutes or 1 hour.  IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly), FGW^▸ (First Great Western) pays after 1 hour on Intercity and former Wessex services but after 30 minutes on former Thames services.  On the Tube I belive the limit is 15 minutes. 

[Phil]

The wording on the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) website is badly in need of editing to make it clear what you are actually entitled to. It states,

For journeys on First Great Western (London and Thames Valley services formerly provided by First Great Western Link)

If you hold a ticket for a single or return journey, or a Weekly Season Ticket, and your train is delayed or cancelled due to the fault of the rail industry, you will be entitled to compensation in National Rail travel vouchers of at least 50% of the price you paid for the delayed journey if:

Important
Please submit your ticket with your claim, as failure to do so will delay the compensation of your claim.

Cancellations
if a First Great Western trains is cancelled or fails to stop at your station when it is scheduled to, you may be eligible for compensation.

You must hold valid ticket and have arrived at the station in time to catch the train. Compensation is based on how long it took the next available train (or alternative transport provided by us) to arrive at your intended First Great Western destination.

Exclusions
The arrangements for compensation do not apply for certain delays which are outside the control of the rail industry. These include trespass, vandalism, security alerts and severe weather conditions.

Which I suspect has been left intentionally vague in order to avoid paying compensation. However, if someone was minded to take this literally as it stands at the moment they would have a very good case to pursue their claim through the courts. Take the following statement for example:

"you will be entitled to compensation in National Rail travel vouchers of at least 50% of the price you paid for the delayed journey if:

Important"

- so what they are saying then is that it's down to you to show that your journey is "important", and so long as you hold tickets for the journey you will then be entitled to 50% compensation.

Lawyers would have a field day with that!

And that's before exploring the burden of proof when the tickets which you are supposed to present in order to gain compensation have been withheld by the barriers on exit...

[James Vertigan]

Why do different companies have different compensation times, and can anyone shed any light as why the service was late this morning as no information was given.

Because they are all governed by different franchise agreements.  THe time-limits are often 30 minutes or 1 hour.  IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly), FGW^▸ (First Great Western) pays after 1 hour on Intercity and former Wessex services but after 30 minutes on former Thames services.  On the Tube I belive the limit is 15 minutes. 

Ah OK, so as a former Thames service, I would have been entitled to compensation if it was 10 minutes later than it was... I guess she didn't get a good enough look at my ticket to see it was the local branch line service and that's why she told me "an hour".

[Tim]

Lawyers would have a field day with that!

And that's before exploring the burden of proof when the tickets which you are supposed to present in order to gain compensation have been withheld by the barriers on exit...

If you need to make a claim, you should show your ticket at a staffed gate and ask to keep it.  Although the ticket is techicinally the property of the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company), the ticket inspector will in practice hand it back to you (often after tearing the strip or stamping it to prevent frauduent reuse).  Once it has been swallowed by the gate, you will have very little joy in getting it back. 

[James Vertigan]

I kept my ticket in hope of a claim, there was nobody manning the gates at Paddington, but they were open anyway.

[devon_metro]

You aren't entitled to compensation anyway, the 0400 Oxford - Paddington (0531 AML) was only 14 minutes late arriving!

[JayMac]

Severely delayed??? 14 minutes!?! 

[Btline]

Sorry, what is the fuss about over a 20 minute wait and a 14 minute late arrival?

Count yourself lucky. Some people are held up for hours - and haven't got another train coming a few minutes later!

[RailCornwall]

I must admit 14 mins does seem a little to complain about BUT it is good to see that someone does choose to do so. It's time the hour limit for compensation is brought down and the get out clauses rationalised. I would suggest that by 01-Jan-2019 (gives ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here) and other parties sufficient time to correct practices) a delay of any service for almost any reason longer than 10 minutes be deemed unacceptable' Through sufficient tracing of bookings and ticket purchases automatic refunds of compensation to delayed passengers via Credit and Debit card numbers to those booked on the delayed service could be paid instantly. A simple mechanism for those non booked casual travellers could be instigated at ticket barriers and offices. Cash customers would have to claim still.

[Mookiemoo]

Maybe it should be as a % of total journey time

[RailCornwall]

No... if you're late you're late.

[John R]

I'd rename this thread "Minor delay to Oxford service this morning." 

[Phil]

I have edited the title of the thread to remove any ambiguity over the day it refers to, and to hopefully end the debate over what constitutes a "sever" delay.

[willc]

It's not entirely true to say that compensation is due after a 30-minute delay on former Thames/FGW^▸ (First Great Western) Link routes.

It is paid after a delay of more than 30 minutes on a journey of less than an hour. That may indeed cover most trips people make in this area, but for some longer journeys, especially between London and the Cotswold Line, you would not get any vouchers unless it was a full hour late.

As for quibbling about the use of important in the FGW wording - I have never, ever been refused compensation for a journey with a 30-minute plus delay, except, I think, where they said vandalism was involved in causing it.