HS2 - Government proposals, alternative routes and general discussion

[whole diary]

[RailCornwall]

Could anyone detail the route being taken from Reading to Euston and vv. during the Old Oak Common blockades?

[ChrisB]

Off to Acton, round the North London Line until it reaches the line into Euston

[stuving]

Off to Acton, round the North London Line until it reaches the line into Euston

Sort of - though only 300 m of the distance is on the NLL itself. The route leaves the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) at the entrance to Acton Yard, and runs up the goods lines (the Poplars) to Acton Wells Jn. Having crossed the Central Line, it leaves the NLL for a parallel goods line through the South West Sidings to join the WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line) at Kensal Green Jn, where the West London line also joins from the other direction.

Work has started to electrify the Poplars, but that's not for the IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train) which can use diesel power. There is also a need for Cl 345s to be moved between the two ends of the Elizabeth Line when it is split at Old Oak Common.

[Mark A]

Is it the case that in the very early days, Euston was to be the terminus for the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) and then there was a change of plan, and it's that that brings the two lines relatively close?

Mark

[stuving]

Is it the case that in the very early days, Euston was to be the terminus for the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) and then there was a change of plan, and it's that that brings the two lines relatively close?

Mark

Yes, in the sense that the 1834 bill, and the 1835 Great Western Railway Act, only provided for that. At the London end the railway was described as "terminating by a junction with the London and Birmingham Railway in a certain field lying between the Paddington Canal and the turnpike road leading from London to Harrow on the western side of the general cemetery in the parish or township of Hammersmith". However, building started with Paddington as the future terminus, as authorised by the 1837 Great Western Railway Paddington Extension Act.

The route of the LBR was determined before the GWR as a project got going, mainly by topography and who owned the land. So I think that first GWR bill was done that way for speed, since there was competition to get acts for these major railway routes. A western route from Paddington had already been proposed by the London and Windsor Railway in 1833, though nothing came of that. However, the LBR being very close to the line of the extension Brunel had in mind would have suggested this short-cut to getting their bill ready for Parliament

[Mark A]

Thanks for this.

The maps.nls site has an early 1:500 OS^▸ (Ordnance Survey) map from those times - it's a series of sheets covering London and they're selective in what they shows (and gives the impression that the surveyers were more than a little overwhelmed at the rate of the changes they saw.)

The map  catches both main lines and the West London line in course of construction. It's a map that (eventually) made my scalp prickle as I imagined what the surveyors saw as they went about their work. Here's the place where the two lines (almost) converge.

Mark

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=15.1&lat=51.52979&lon=-0.23174&layers=250&b=OSLeisure&o=100

[stuving]

The maps.nls site has an early 1:500 OS^▸ (Ordnance Survey) map from those times - it's a series of sheets covering London and they're selective in what they shows (and gives the impression that the surveyers were more than a little overwhelmed at the rate of the changes they saw.)

The map  catches both main lines and the West London line in course of construction. It's a map that (eventually) made my scalp prickle as I imagined what the surveyors saw as they went about their work. Here's the place where the two lines (almost) converge.

That was the "skeleton survey", and was only meant to show roads, including frequent spot heights, for the Metropolitan Commissioners of Sewers. NLS have more about the rather complicated history of this set of maps. The published sheets had been reduced to 1:5,280 (12") scale, but the limited amount of fine detail conceals that.

When the survey started in 1848, both railways were already operating, though parts of Euston station were still not finished. There was only a temporary structure at Paddington, and the first permanent one was not started for several years. NLS don't have the map sheets for the Euston area, and at Paddington (sheet VI.SE) there is an empty space with "Paddington R^y Stⁿ (Great Western Term^s)" written next to Bishop's Road.

[johnneyw]

The Beeb reports today's discussions between Louise Haigh and the Metro Mayors for Manchester and the West Midlands.
Apparently resurrection of HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) Birmingham to Crewe remains a dead duck but a slower line along the route was included in the options discussed along with upgrading the WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line).

Here's the link:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4gz832149eo

[ChrisB]

From Evening Standard

Euston HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) station: New twist in saga as Government says £5bn terminus will only have six platforms

The new HS2 station at Euston will have just six platforms, the Government has confirmed.

Rail commentators fear this could result in a lack of capacity should HS2 ever be extended north of Birmingham.

Details about the Labour government’s plans emerged on Tuesday via a parliamentary written answer from rail minister Lord Hendy.

He had been asked by Lord Berkeley, a Labour peer who has taken a close interest in the cost of HS2, how many HS2 trains per hour were planned at Euston, and how many station platforms they were expected to occupy.

Lord Hendy replied: “The new HS2 station will consist of six platforms, which can support up to 10 HS2 trains per hour.

“No decisions have been made on the train services that will run when HS2 opens, and this will be subject to future consultation.”

Gareth Dennis, the rail engineer, author and commentator, told The Standard: “Unless there is a clear plan that integrates both station sites into one shared station with appropriate adjustments, this will kneecap the GB^▸ (Great Britain) rail network for a generation or more.

“The idea that a future high speed rail network of 17 trains per hour or more is not being planned for is extremely worrying.

“To lose the opportunity to build a large, spacious and resilient station in London will have massive impacts on the ability to run local services in the Midlands and the North for decades.”

William Barter, a rail consultant, said that having only six platforms at Euston would mean that HS2 would never be able to fulfil its full potential. He described the situation as “lunacy”.

Steve Coe, a former assistant general secretary at the rail union TSSA^» (Transport Salaried Staffs' Association - about), said building only six platforms was “incredibly shortsighted”.

He added: “Unless Euston is rebuilt with 11 platforms, HS2 will never be able to provide the increased capacity that our railways desperately need. A huge amount of money spent for relatively little gain.”

There will also be six HS2 platforms at Old Oak Common station in north-west London, which will be used as the line’s southern terminus when HS2 trains start running around 2030.

However the Old Oak Common HS2 platforms will be 400m long - meaning each can accommodate two HS2 trains at a time.

There is no opening date for the HS2 station at Euston.

Lord Hendy recently told the transport select committee that his aim was for the HS2 station at Euston to share a concourse with a renovated mainline station.

The original 2015 plan was for the HS2 station at Euston to be built in two phases, adjacent to the mainline station, and have 11 platforms.

But following the Oakervee review in 2020, the Department for Transport switched in 2021 to a “simpler design” for Euston, of 10 platforms that were all to be built in a single phase.

Then in 2023, as HS2’s costs continued to escalate, the Tory government switched to a six-platform design then ordered the work at Euston to be mothballed for two years.

Several months later, in October 2023, the then Prime Minister Rishi Sunak told the Tory party conference that he had decided to axe HS2’s northern leg.

Mr Sunak also confirmed that private sector investment would be needed to deliver the HS2 station at Euston.

It was also reported on Tuesday that the cost of completing the first phase of HS2 between London and Birmingham had increased by £9bn, to £80bn at current prices.

When work at Euston was paused in 2023, the cost of the HS2 station was estimated to have increased from its original £2.6bn budget to £4.8bn (both at 2019 prices).

In a 2022/23 report, the public accounts committee said the £2.6bn budget for Euston was “completely unrealistic” and said that, eight years after the scheme was devised, the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) “still does not know what it is trying to achieve with the station and what sort of regeneration it will support”.

Switching from an 11-platform to a 10-platform design meant that £106m of work was wasted, according to the National Audit Office.

[ChrisB]

From The Telegraph

HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) chairman quits in wake of £100m ‘bat shed’ comments

The chairman of HS2 is to step down after the Government said that the estimated £66 billion cost of the rail project was not an “accurate or reliable” figure.

Sir Jon Thompson, who said last month that a “bat shed” covering 900 metres of HS2 tracks near Aylesbury would cost £100 million to build, announced he will leave his role in the spring.

It came as Heidi Alexander, the Transport Secretary, said in a progress report published on Tuesday that there was doubt over forecasts that the cost had spiralled to between £54 billion and £66 billion – up to double the original estimate of £33 billion.

The report warned that the estimate included parts of the since-cancelled Euston station project. It added: “As it doesn’t take into account this work, or factor in private financing for Euston – which this government is committed to securing – we do not think these figures are accurate or reliable.

“It remains highly uncertain and subject to further assurance and has not been approved by the HS2 Ltd Board or [The Department for Transport] ... but has been included here for transparency.”

The £66 billion estimate, which does not take inflation into account, is based on costings from 2019.

The report said the project’s spiralling budget had been caused by factors including “environmental and planning compliance, as well as the disruption caused by external factors, primarily Covid and the Ukraine conflict.”

So far, £32.8 billion has been spent on HS2 since it was approved in 2012, and the latest estimates come following years of warnings that its spending was out of control.

In 2020 the Public Accounts Committee said the Department for Transport (DfT^» (Department for Transport - about)) had “failed to provide Parliament with clear warning that the programme was going off-course and value for money was at risk”.

Rachel Reeves, the Chancellor, said in October that HS2 would be built to Euston, ending uncertainty brought about by Rishi Sunak axing public funding for the line’s final 4.5-mile stretch into central London.

Instead, both the required tunnels and the extension to Euston station necessary to serve HS2 would have to be privately funded, the Conservative former prime minister said last year.

Sir Jon’s departure from HS2 comes after a new chief executive was appointed to the beleaguered rail project in May.

Mark Wild, a former boss of Crossrail, took up the post this month. The report said: “We have made it the number one priority of the new chief executive, after safety, to drive costs down.”

Sir Jon is expected to become the new chairman of the company behind Sports Direct, businessman Mike Ashley’s Frasers Group, Sky News reported in November.

A spokesman for HS2 Ltd said that “clearly changes in delivery are needed” for the project to “realise its full potential”.

They added: “Mark Wild joined as our new chief executive this month and clearly recognises the programme’s serious cost challenges.

“He is now leading a comprehensive review of HS2’s cost and schedule which will report into government next year and lead to a full reset of the project.”

A DfT spokesman said of the £66 billion costings: “These estimates are out of date and don’t take into account the urgent measures this government took to get the project back under control or the previous government’s decision to cancel Phase 2 and attempt to secure private funding for Euston.

“The Transport Secretary has asked HS2 to urgently provide updated and clearer estimates of the project as soon as possible and we have made it the number one priority of the new chief executive to drive costs down.”

[CyclingSid]

Not quite sure whether this is an attempt to sugar the pill of the holiday disruption https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1j05d296r1o

[ChrisB]

Paddington passengers face '180 days of station disruption' due to HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) work at Old Oak Common

From The Standard

Passengers heading in and out of Paddington face more than 180 days of disruption due to HS2 works – including 43 days when the station is shut entirely, MPs^▸ (Member of Parliament) have been told.

This includes a three-day shutdown immediately after Christmas when the Great Western main line is closed for three days between December 27-29 to enable work to be carried out at Old Oak Common station.

The full extent of the likely disruption to journeys in and out of Paddington emerged during a parliamentary debate.

Max Wilkinson, the Lib Dem MP for Cheltenham, said there would be five years of “widespread disruption” – followed by “every train between the west and south Wales and London” being slower once Old Oak Common station opens around 2030.

He said there would be 29 days of disruption in 2024/25, 30 in 2025-26, 41 in 2026-27, including 14 days when no trains run at all, 34 days in 2027-28, including 11 days when no trains run at all, and 47 days of disruption in 2028-29, including 18 days when no trains run at all.

This totals 181 days of disruption – including 43 days of full closures – and excludes any disruption in 2029/30, as the impact of works that year is not yet known.

Mr Wilkinson told a Westminster Hall debate that most of the disruption would fall “on Sundays and at Christmas”.

He said: “The number of constituencies that will be impacted by the work is absolutely huge. It will be every constituency in Cornwall and Devon, most of Somerset, Bristol, parts of Herefordshire and Worcestershire, south Wales, Gloucestershire—my own area of the country—Wiltshire, Berkshire and Oxfordshire.

“That is a lot of people whose journeys will be slower for a long time, and a lot of people who will have to make alternative arrangements when trains are cancelled.”

Tessa Munt, the Lib-Dem MP for Wells and Mendip Hills, said the closures could have a huge impact on the Glastonbury festival.

“The Glastonbury festival finishes on a Sunday, and many people travel in and out of Glastonbury on a Sunday, so this will be incredibly damaging to that event,” she said.

Mr Wilkinson said that it was “no exaggeration to say that weekends are a nightmare” and demanded improvements to Great Western Railway services on Sundays.

The 14-platform Old Oak Common station, which is costing about £2bn to build, will be used as HS2’s southern terminus until the new HS2 station at Euston is built. There is no opening date but it is likely to be around 2040.

Old Oak Common will also act as an interchange with HS2 for the Elizabeth line, Great Western Railway services and the Heathrow Express.

Mainline trains that stop at Old Oak Common will have four to seven minutes added to their journey times.

Even “fast” trains that run through the new station without stopping – the exact stopping pattern is yet to be determined - will have up to 90 seconds added to their journey times because the mainline track is being realigned and will curve through the new station.

During the Paddington closures, some Great Western Railway services will divert to Euston.

Transport minister Lilian Greenwood said it was impossible to build Old Oak Common “without some disruption to existing services”.

She told MPs: “The next significant blockade had been due to take place in December 2026, but this is now being re-planned to a later date by HS2 Ltd. Further detail on the future works plan will be shared as soon as it is available in the spring.”

Rail minister Lord Hendy is in discussions with HS2, Network Rail and the train operating companies in a bid to reduce the impact of the work at Old Oak Common.

He said in a written parliamentary answer: “Old Oak Common is estimated to be operational between 2029-2033.

“The large Christmas possessions that enable services to run on the new track layout, through Old Oak Common station, are currently being re-planned and further information will be available from Spring 2025.”

A Network Rail spokesman said: “Most of the work will take place without customers noticing, at weekends or overnight.

“However, where this isn’t possible, the industry is working together to comprehensively plan the work to reduce the impact to passengers as much as possible, as well as include any changes into timetables well in advance so customers can still travel by train.”

[Mark A]

Indeed, and seven-days-a-week well-timed through trains between Bristol and Waterloo would give some passengers the alternative that's needed.

Mark

[grahame]

Indeed, and seven-days-a-week well-timed through trains between Bristol and Waterloo would give some passengers the alternative that's needed.

Mark

There used be the Maesteg to Waterloo service in the early hours.

[IndustryInsider]

What real difference would a short DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) running a handful of services a day through to Waterloo actually make in the grand scheme of things?  Not much I would suspect.