HS2 - Government proposals, alternative routes and general discussion

[whole diary]

[Bmblbzzz]

They can be reassured that the gain to GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) passengers is going to be access to HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) (once enough of HS2 is built to be useful).

I just hope that enough of it is built to be useful.

[TaplowGreen]

They can be reassured that the gain to GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) passengers is going to be access to HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) (once enough of HS2 is built to be useful).

I just hope that enough of it is built to be useful.

It'll be useful for those needing to travel between Acton and Solihull - the rest is up in the air it would appear - (along with Rishi's helicopter!)

[IndustryInsider]

That aside, setting aside recollections of arriving on a GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) HST^▸ (High Speed Train) at Marylebone, what percentage of Paddington's long distance services could be accommodated at another London terminus (and are the IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train) compatible - do i recall an HST service ran to Paddington for a while to provide connection to for trains to mainland Europe?).

Rear Clear markers for newer traction types are being installed at Acton, indicating that some services will be turning back at Ealing Broadway (with its Central/District Line connections).  That could mean certain IET services (as well as 345s and 387s) could run there instead of being diverted to an alternative terminus station.

[didcotdean]

Ealing Broadway was of course the main turnaround point used after the Ladbroke Grove rail crash until Paddington was accessible again. The District Line in particular though was overwhelmed in getting to there. Commuting is a bit different from back then but in a planned rather than emergency situation I would imagine something more than just Ealing Broadway would be desirable.

[IndustryInsider]

Oh yes, it would be used in addition to use of one or more of Waterloo, Marylebone and Euston.  Both in terms of passenger and train capacity.

That exact strategy happened during Christmas 2016 during Crossrail works.

[ChrisB]

And will be in use over this Christmas period (so I guess this is why the installation at this time) between 24th & 27th (i think) December when the line is closed

[TaplowGreen]

Interesting (although long!) read from Simon Jenkins;

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/07/hs2-the-zombie-train-that-refuses-to-die

[paul7575]

Interesting (although long!) read from Simon Jenkins;

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/07/hs2-the-zombie-train-that-refuses-to-die

Zombie journalist refuses to change his long term view. No surprise there then.

[IndustryInsider]

Interesting (although long!) read from Simon Jenkins;

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/07/hs2-the-zombie-train-that-refuses-to-die

Zombie journalist refuses to change his long term view. No surprise there then.

Yeah, good old Simon. 

Thanks for the link, TG.  But I think I’ll give it a miss!

[ellendune]

Interesting (although long!) read from Simon Jenkins;

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/07/hs2-the-zombie-train-that-refuses-to-die

Look at the date - he wrote that in 2016!

[TaplowGreen]

.....you read it here first! 

https://newsthump.com/2023/09/18/hs2-downgraded-to-ivor-the-engine/?fbclid=IwAR0AJjuD5woTzihx45lI4uhURrFVJ0AOIayHfJfX2PixAP_CfsZcQJzq2QA

[Bmblbzzz]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66895425

Former Prime Minister Boris Johnson has urged the government against building a "mutilated" version of HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)).

He said suggestions the high-speed rail link that began construction under his premiership could be scaled back were "Treasury-driven nonsense".

...

The former prime ministersaid: "It makes no sense at all to deliver a mutilated HS2", adding there was a "need" for the rail link in the north of England.

The bosses of dozens of businesses and business groups - including Manchester Airports Group, British Land, Virgin Money, and the Northern Powerhouse - have all signed the letter to the government urging renewed commitment to HS2, saying that repeated mixed signals are damaging the UK^▸ (United Kingdom)'s reputation and the wider supply chain.

"Two years ago, Yorkshire and the North-East lost the eastern Leg of HS2, with no settled alternative yet identified following protracted delays," they said.

"It is now reported that the entire line from Birmingham to Crewe - allowing access to Scotland - the new line to Manchester, and Euston station as the terminus may all be cancelled entirely in the upcoming Autumn Statement".

They added the "repeated mixed signals" on HS2 were damaging the country's wider supply chain as "spending commitments cannot be made with confidence".

[TonyK]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66895425

Former Prime Minister Boris Johnson has urged the government against building a "mutilated" version of HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)).

He said suggestions the high-speed rail link that began construction under his premiership could be scaled back were "Treasury-driven nonsense".

...

The former prime ministersaid: "It makes no sense at all to deliver a mutilated HS2", adding there was a "need" for the rail link in the north of England.

The bosses of dozens of businesses and business groups - including Manchester Airports Group, British Land, Virgin Money, and the Northern Powerhouse - have all signed the letter to the government urging renewed commitment to HS2, saying that repeated mixed signals are damaging the UK^▸ (United Kingdom)'s reputation and the wider supply chain.

"Two years ago, Yorkshire and the North-East lost the eastern Leg of HS2, with no settled alternative yet identified following protracted delays," they said.

"It is now reported that the entire line from Birmingham to Crewe - allowing access to Scotland - the new line to Manchester, and Euston station as the terminus may all be cancelled entirely in the upcoming Autumn Statement".

They added the "repeated mixed signals" on HS2 were damaging the country's wider supply chain as "spending commitments cannot be made with confidence".

I don't think I've agreed with Boris Johnson before, apart from when he resigned, but I do here. Yes, Rishi Sunak is desperate for votes as we get closer to the election, but this isn't going to help as much as he hopes it will, if indeed he thought it would. I see a possible bit of political chicanery here, with this being the usual leak to test the water. This time, it will also be intended to goad Labour into saying what they will do, before deciding whether to confirm plans to chop most of the planned route off, or for Super Rishi come to the rescue. After all, he has recently stopped plans to force people to share cars and use seven separate bins for recycling, even if they didn't exist, and the supposed easing of the end date for ICE vehicles doesn't mean that any will be available to buy new after 2030. Shortening HS2 would be a high risk strategy. It might please some of the louder voices in the debate, but does nothing to improve the situation on the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) or for the mythical "North".

[Bmblbzzz]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66895425

Former Prime Minister Boris Johnson has urged the government against building a "mutilated" version of HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)).

He said suggestions the high-speed rail link that began construction under his premiership could be scaled back were "Treasury-driven nonsense".

...

The former prime ministersaid: "It makes no sense at all to deliver a mutilated HS2", adding there was a "need" for the rail link in the north of England.

The bosses of dozens of businesses and business groups - including Manchester Airports Group, British Land, Virgin Money, and the Northern Powerhouse - have all signed the letter to the government urging renewed commitment to HS2, saying that repeated mixed signals are damaging the UK^▸ (United Kingdom)'s reputation and the wider supply chain.

"Two years ago, Yorkshire and the North-East lost the eastern Leg of HS2, with no settled alternative yet identified following protracted delays," they said.

"It is now reported that the entire line from Birmingham to Crewe - allowing access to Scotland - the new line to Manchester, and Euston station as the terminus may all be cancelled entirely in the upcoming Autumn Statement".

They added the "repeated mixed signals" on HS2 were damaging the country's wider supply chain as "spending commitments cannot be made with confidence".

I don't think I've agreed with Boris Johnson before, apart from when he resigned, but I do here. Yes, Rishi Sunak is desperate for votes as we get closer to the election, but this isn't going to help as much as he hopes it will, if indeed he thought it would. I see a possible bit of political chicanery here, with this being the usual leak to test the water. This time, it will also be intended to goad Labour into saying what they will do, before deciding whether to confirm plans to chop most of the planned route off, or for Super Rishi come to the rescue. After all, he has recently stopped plans to force people to share cars and use seven separate bins for recycling, even if they didn't exist, and the supposed easing of the end date for ICE vehicles doesn't mean that any will be available to buy new after 2030. Shortening HS2 would be a high risk strategy. It might please some of the louder voices in the debate, but does nothing to improve the situation on the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) or for the mythical "North".

It's a disturbing feeling, isn't it? But still, stopped clocks are right twice a day and so might slopped cocks be.

[stuving]

Jeremy Hunt was quoted in yesterday's Times as saying [even] MPs^▸ (Member of Parliament) in the red wall "will also be worried if we have an infrastructure project where the costs are getting totally out of control". Now what do you think he means by "out of control"?

I suspect he mean out of his control - in the sense that he can't write a number on a piece of paper and so determine the project's actual final cost. Politicians - as "funders" - can only have that kind of control much earlier in the project definition process, and after that they can't really re-write the history of that.