Rail fare prices - the basis of increases (merged ongoing discussion)

[whole diary]

[paul7575]

Going back to the quote in Timmer's first post, the whole rationale for the higher rises in the Southeastern 'TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) area' is to get their fares up to the same broad cost/mile as in the rest of what the public refer to as 'the Southeast' of the country.  It may seem unfair to people in those areas, but they are just being brought more into line with the fares already charged by the likes of SWT^▸ (South West Trains) and FGW^▸ (First Great Western).

Also, they definitely aren't paying extra across the whole of Kent and East Sussex specifically for HS1^▸ (High Speed line 1 - St Pancras to Channel Tunnel) domestic services, as suggested in a number of newspaper articles over the last couple of years...

Paul

[Chris from Nailsea]

From the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page):

Train boss defends above-inflation rise in fares

The chief executive of the Association of Train Operating Companies has defended fare increases which average 6.2% and in some cases are much higher. Michael Roberts said the rises were part of a government policy to make rail passengers pay a greater share of the cost than taxpayers. The hikes will also result in "more trains and better services", he said.

But Anthony Smith, chief executive of customer watchdog Passenger Focus, said many passengers would be "baffled".

Regulated fares, which include season tickets, have gone up by an average of 5.8%, but some mainline season tickets have increased by almost 13%. Some unregulated fares, typically short distance off-peak ones, have also risen by more than the 6.2% average but the industry has not given a figure. Tube and bus fares in London have risen by an average of 6.8%.

Speaking to BBC - Radio 5 live's Weekend Breakfast, Mr Roberts said the above-inflation fare rises were the result of a broader policy decided by the government, rather than train companies.

"At the moment, (the cost of travel) is paid for half-and-half between the taxpayer and passenger. The government policy is that the taxpayer ought to pay a smaller share of that in the future, which is why fares are going up. The money raised will pay for more trains to address overcrowding, better stations and quicker journeys," he said.

He admitted that "in the current economic climate, any talk of increase is clearly something people are not going to be particularly pleased with" but said rail journeys were at an "all time high since 1940s - which is a sign people are able to buy the right ticket for the right journey".

The government and London Mayor Boris Johnson say the increases are necessary to support vital transport projects.

But shadow transport minister Maria Eagle said the changes were unfair and would be a "nasty New Year shock" for commuters. "The government have given the train operating companies freedom to fiddle the fare rises by reintroducing something which the Labour government put a stop to - flexibility. Which means that they can charge commuters who have to get on particular trains even higher than the already high average while charging less on little-used routes," she said.

Anthony Smith, chief executive of rail customer watchdog Passenger Focus, said: "Many passengers returning to work in the new year will be baffled about why they are paying much higher figures than the 'averages' published by the train companies. With the train companies again free to raise fares on individual routes, some passengers will be facing rises way above inflation and in some cases it will be back to the bad old days of double-digit fare increases."

The Campaign for Better Transport said the cost of some annual season tickets exceeded ^5,000 for the first time and warned the rises would price people off trains. It says an annual season ticket for commuters travelling on services between London and Tonbridge, in Kent, has risen by 12.7% to ^5,192. A season ticket on the First Capital Connect stopping service between Peterborough and London, which was ^5,000, is now ^5,320.

Regulated fares are tied to an annual price cap formula meaning fares can increase each January only by the previous July's RPI^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector, or Retail Price Index, depending on context) inflation rate plus 1%. This means a 5.8% average rise for 2011.

However, companies are able to put up some fares by more than 5% as long as other fares decrease at the same rate. There is no price cap on unregulated fares.

In January 2012, passengers will have to dig even deeper into their pockets when the annual price rise formula changes to RPI plus 3% across the network.

[Lee]

From Christian Wolmar:

Rail fares could kill the growth

I have done a couple of TV^▸ (Thames Valley) interviews on the steep rale fare rises today and it is striking that the mood out there is very angry. The fares regulation rules were designed to protect people who had no choice other than to use the railways, notably south east commuters, and it is they who are hardest hit.

Having 12 per cent slapped on the price of your ticket, as has been the case some commuters on Southeastern as the price of having the high speed line, is really excessive and completely against the spirit of the legislation. Train operators I have talked to are confident that the growth in usage is not going to be affected, but I am not so sure. Of course petrol prices are rising, too, but that is always a much more hidden cost which motorists tend to just put up with. Season tickets are upfront money coming out in one lump sum. So they hurt more.

This is, of course, just the start of things to come. For reasons that are unclear ^ though probably out of fear that rises of near double digits across the board would be unapalatable ^ Hammond has postponed the RPI^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector, or Retail Price Index, depending on context) plus three per cent rise until next year, but by the end of this run of rises, many people may well have fled from the railway. That in turn will diminish the case for investment and, indeed, for HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)).

There is, of course, no logic to any of this. A government that was really interested in boosting rail use permanently would have a coherent strategy to do so, not have a policy that is supportive of rail investment on the one hand, but then deterring people from using the railway on the other.

[Lee]

From the Swindon Advertiser:

Swindon to London season ticket hits ^7,000

Commuters face travel misery when they return to work tomorrow with a double whammy of rising rail fares and petrol pump prices.

Swindon rail passengers heading for London will feel the pinch more than most, faced with the prospect of coughing up more than ^7,000 for a season ticket to the capital.

And those wanting to escape the price hike by switching to the road, are still going to be hit. Motorists, already paying record prices for petrol at the pumps, will see further hikes from tomorrow due to VAT^▸ (Value Added Tax) increases.

The train fare increase which came into force yesterday means thousands of commuters will have to pay ^7,024 for an annual season ticket from Swindon to London Paddington, an increase of ^384 on last year^s ticket which cost ^6,640.

At a Swindon Borough Council scrutiny committee meeting held in November, 2010, managing director of First Great Western, Mark Hopwood, defended rail fares at the time saying that Swindon commuters were getting value for money.

Mr Hopwood said: ^Swindon to London has probably one of the best train services in terms of distance from London, with 71 trains a day most taking about an hour through the key parts of the day with a minimum of four trains an hour.

^There are very few places with trains that frequent, usually only one an hour. The success of rail in this area has been quite phenomenal.^

Councillor Peter Greenhalgh told the committee then: ^The cost of travelling by train from Swindon to anywhere is having a massive impact on the economy of Swindon. It deters businesses and deters commuters living in Swindon. It is having a detrimental effect.^

Swindon commuters face some of the highest prices in the region, even though rail passengers travelling to London from Didcot in Oxfordshire, which is only 30 miles away, will pay almost ^3,000 less for a season ticket for a Swindon ticket, which will cost ^4104. Robert Buckland, MP^▸ (Member of Parliament, or Mile Post - a method of measuring the railway in miles and chains from a starting point - usually London, depending on context) for Swindon South, said: ^I would hope the train operators would make the fares fairer from Swindon because they have been consistently more expensive than surrounding areas such as Didcot.

^I share the commuters^ concerns with regards to the increases. While I accept that there must be increases, I would like to see an increased capacity in the service.

^I think season ticket holders should have their own space where they know they have a seat given they have paid ^7,000 each for their tickets. These are people who have no choice but to travel to work and there^s a case for giving them special treatment.^

It was announced last year that rail fares between Swindon and London have risen to the highest in Europe, according to a Parliamentary report. The report by the South West regional committee said the cost of a standard-class Anytime Single on a First Great Western train was the highest per mile in Europe.

Rail fares are set to continue rising with the cost of season ticket from Swindon to Paddington expected to cost ^8,783.29 by 2015.

[devon_metro]

Buy a Swindon - Didcot and Didcot - Paddington season then. Valid on any trains, saves a little bit of money...

[JayMac]

Buy a Swindon - Didcot and Didcot - Paddington season then. Valid on any trains, saves a little bit of money...

If both tickets are seasons then you have to use services that call at Didcot.

Only a combination of season and non-season permits travel on non-stopping services.

[devon_metro]

Buy a Swindon - Didcot and Didcot - Paddington season then. Valid on any trains, saves a little bit of money...

If both tickets are seasons then you have to use services that call at Didcot.

Only a combination of season and non-season permits travel on non-stopping services.

Ah ok, presumed season + season worked the same way.

[JayMac]

Don't understand the logic myself as to why 2+ seasons cannot be used in such a way. But then, when has logic had anything to do with rail fares?

[Lee]

Interesting data and map at http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/03/rail-fares-increase

[vacman]

Not all bad news.

Liskeard to Plymouth

Standard Day Return was ^8 now ^7.90
Seven Day Season was ^23.90 now ^19 - a 20% reduction!

See my message earlier below - but I don't know why Liskeard to Plymouth has been singled out for these reductions when the rest of Cornwall is facing increases nearer to 6%

This fare was reduced due to the withdrawall of the Looe-Plymouth Carnet ticket.

[Timmer]

Interesting data and map at http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/03/rail-fares-increase

Very useful. Note the small print - Beware if you currently use the 1830 Mon-Fri out of Paddington using an off peak ticket:

Changes to restrictions
To FGW^▸ (First Great Western) main line services
Off Peak used to allow travel between 08.10 - 16.40 and after 18.25 ; this has now changed to 08.10 - 16.40 and after 18.31.
This 6min extension to the evening peak effectively removes 1 departure to Bristol.

Have confirmed using the journey planner that this is correct. Not surprising as the 1830 to Weston-super-Mare is rated as the third most crowded service on the rail network*

*source Annual TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) survey. Reported in Sunday Express 2/1 http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/220619/-4-000-for-a-ride-in-cattle-class-

[JayMac]

Still legitimate ways around that restriction, with split ticketing, though!   

[SDS]

Interesting to see FGW^▸ (First Great Western) making the 16:49 & 18:51 peak as well for Slough travellers.

[Ollie]

18:30 has been a peak service for a while - it's not new as that seems to suggest.

[JayMac]

I fear this is too late in the day....

From The Independent:

Ministers urge Osborne to reduce steep rail fare rises

George Osborne is being urged by fellow ministers to scale back steep rail-fare rises due in the new year amid fears that the planned increases will force passengers back on to the roads.

Ticket prices are due to go up by an average of 8 per cent in January under a formula approved by ministers for above-inflation rises for the next three years to raise cash for investment on the railways. But Justine Greening, the new Transport Secretary, has urged the Chancellor to announce a rethink in his Autumn Statement on Tuesday.

Ms Greening is suggesting that fares should go up by about 6 per cent ^ 1 per cent above inflation ^ in a move to reduce the impact on hard-pressed commuters and long-distance travellers. The move would cost the Treasury an estimated ^26m.

The Independent understands talks on the issue are still "live", but the Department for Transport is privately optimistic of success in its negotiations with the Treasury. A DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) source said: "We've been fighting very hard and we're very hopeful we have won something. There is money around for things when we think they are worth it, such as [weekly] bin collections."

The department is arguing that the potential benefits from higher fares have to be offset by the danger of a drop in revenues as travellers swap trains for other forms of transport.

Ms Greening's move signals a change of approach at the DfT. Insiders last night said she places far more emphasis than her predecessor, Philip Hammond, on passengers' needs.

Could ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies see - here) and TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) pricing managers really change everything in the next 11 days? The new fares go into the ticketing systems on 5th December. Some new prices (mostly season tickets for travel post- Jan 2nd 2012) are already beginning to appear online and it would be nigh on impossible to recalculate all the flows and baskets this late in the day. They could put back the 'go live' date I suppose, but I don't think ATOC will be very happy at that.