Great Western Main Line electrification - ongoing discussion

[whole diary]

[ChrisB]

That is what NR^» (Network Rail - home page) is saying...they will revisit once the wires are up

[Rhydgaled]

As much as I like to have pretty looking structures, at the end of the day there have been numerous consultations and amble time for various bodies and organisations to get 100% satisfaction before any work has started.

On the other hand, while we knew about electrification a while before work started, I visit this forum very frequently, and am a subscriber to a railway magazine, and as far as I can recall was never aware of any consultation on the design of OHLE structures for the Great Western project. If somebody with an interest in railways such as myself isn't aware of a consultation, then I would imagine that others were even less aware than myself, and thus I can hardly blame the Goring complainers for being supprised when the substantial portal structures appeared.

[ChrisB]

Deposited with Council Oplanning Department, yhe allocation of a planning reference number would require advertising. This they had the same notification (incl the Parish Council) as they would for a new build.

I suspect that is a reason that NR^» (Network Rail - home page) lodges these type of plans with Councils even though they don't need planning consent

[SandTEngineer]

As much as I like to have pretty looking structures, at the end of the day there have been numerous consultations and amble time for various bodies and organisations to get 100% satisfaction before any work has started.

On the other hand, while we knew about electrification a while before work started, I visit this forum very frequently, and am a subscriber to a railway magazine, and as far as I can recall was never aware of any consultation on the design of OHLE structures for the Great Western project. If somebody with an interest in railways such as myself isn't aware of a consultation, then I would imagine that others were even less aware than myself, and thus I can hardly blame the Goring complainers for being supprised when the substantial portal structures appeared.

But that is the point I was trying to clarify above.  There was consultation between NR^» (Network Rail - home page) and West Berkshire and South Oxfordshire, and those organisations are there to represent and support residents.  Do we have any evidence that there wasn't any such consultation?

The structures are referenced in the consultation documents and have been well publicised in the railway and non-railway press.

Its like any other planning application I have been involved in, its no good complaining once the thing is built.  I always make a point of going to any public consultation meetings for issues surrounding the area where I live, even if ultimately they don't directly affect me.

[ChrisB]

Ditto. Plus looking at ALL local-to-me planning adverts just to check. Someone on their PC will have done this too...

[SandTEngineer]

If you want to know about the OLE^▸ (Overhead Line Equipment, more often "OHLE") structures you only have to look here:
http://www.furrerfrey.ch/de/systeme/Series-1.html and specifcally this document to be found there:
http://www.furrerfrey.ch/dam/jcr:98f3522c-51ff-4d89-9fd7-dc16601d1db3/20130717_F+F_Series1_Web.pdf

[ellendune]

But that is the point I was trying to clarify above.  There was consultation between NR^» (Network Rail - home page) and West Berkshire and South Oxfordshire, and those organisations are there to represent and support residents.  Do we have any evidence that there wasn't any such consultation?

Yes there is evidence - See South Oxfordshire DC^▸ (Direct Current) Planning reference P13/S1892/ES

I assume that SODC would have consulted Goring Parish Council. 

[ChrisB]

Quite.

[didcotdean]

There are some "Example Photographs of Proposed Overhead OLE^▸ (Overhead Line Equipment, more often "OHLE") Designs" included in the Environmental Statement Volume 2: Appendix E. However, the 4 track portals shown are significantly different in detail from the Furrer & Frey Series 1 that have been installed. In particular they are lattice rather than a solid structure. There are also illustrative pictures of headspans at a station.

So anyone who had seen these examples could well have been surprised by the metal work actually installed, especially its 'chunkiness' to be non technical.

I understand that it is the absence of any consultation at the detailed design phase that the AONB^▸ (Areas Of Natural Beauty) have been not happy about. The AONB extends way beyond Goring - from just east of Didcot to the east of Pangbourne although some areas are more beautiful than others ....

[BBM]

I noticed today that the first masts have now appeared at the east end of Sonning Cutting and the Twyford West crossover area.

[ellendune]

There are some "Example Photographs of Proposed Overhead OLE^▸ (Overhead Line Equipment, more often "OHLE") Designs" included in the Environmental Statement Volume 2: Appendix E. However, the 4 track portals shown are significantly different in detail from the Furrer & Frey Series 1 that have been installed. In particular they are lattice rather than a solid structure. There are also illustrative pictures of headspans at a station.

So anyone who had seen these examples could well have been surprised by the metal work actually installed, especially its 'chunkiness' to be non technical.

A good point.

I understand that it is the absence of any consultation at the detailed design phase that the AONB^▸ (Areas Of Natural Beauty) have been not happy about. The AONB extends way beyond Goring - from just east of Didcot to the east of Pangbourne although some areas are more beautiful than others ....

Ah yes.  A reputable planning consultant ought to have identified that need.  I would also have expected South Oxon DC^▸ (Direct Current) and West Berks DC to have pointed that out at the time if it was an issue. 

[lordgoata]

Yes there is evidence - See South Oxfordshire DC^▸ (Direct Current) Planning reference P13/S1892/ES

I assume that SODC would have consulted Goring Parish Council. 

Considering GPC are taking SODC to court over two particular recent planning approvals (the Goring Hydro-Electric scheme - and another one which I can't recall off hand), I wouldn't expect or assume anything!

[ChrisB]

People quite often cofuse "consult" with referenda.....meanings are quite different

[eightf48544]

Technical question. I live by the only (?) fully wired stretch (4 lines) between Burnham and Taplow, which was done at Christmas 2015.

Now we are getting a kind of gibbet being fitted on top of the horizontal arm which holds the hangers (dangly bits) for the wires. Looks like there will be another wire slung between them. What's it for?

[paul7575]

Technical question. I live by the only (?) fully wired stretch (4 lines) between Burnham and Taplow, which was done at Christmas 2015.

Now we are getting a kind of gibbet being fitted on top of the horizontal arm which holds the hangers (dangly bits) for the wires. Looks like there will be another wire slung between them. What's it for?

From your description that's for the 'Auto Transformer Feeder' or ATF.   

As a modern design the GW^▸ (Great Western) OHLE is actually fed at 50 kV, with two anti phase 25 kV conductors.  So you get a 25 kV - Ov - 25 kV feed where the rails are the Ov line, the contact wire (and its support catenary) is at 25 kV, and your newly observed line is also at 25 kV but anti phase to the contact wire.  So the ATF needs similar insulators to the contact wire, similar clearances from structures, and needs to be positioned where it cannot accidentally touch the contact wire under fault conditions.

It's all a bit complicated electrically, but it all helps make the system far more efficient than the earliest simple 25 kV with traction return down the rails.

The autotransformers themselves are mounted in various track side compounds along the line, how they actually work in terms of detail is above my pay grade, so I think although they should be mentioned as existing, that'll do for now...

Paul