Yet Another Imbalance.

[whole diary]

[Trowres]

<snip>
Here's the real imbalance though. If you request your fare to London Waterloo (via Salisbury) from Shirehampton on the Severn Beach Line, the CDR^▸ (Off Peak Day Return [ticket type] (formerly 'Cheap Day')) is ^27.10. It gets weirder though; all other CDR fares on the SBL to London Waterloo are ^28.10.  Seeing as you have to change at Bristol Temple Meads it's a little odd that it is a whacking ^9.40 cheaper to travel further.

This fare is particularly good value as the restrictions on it during Mon-Fri are that you can arrive on any train into Waterloo after 1000. Compared with the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) service into Paddington the earliest you can arrive on a SVR (Off Peak Return) is 1045. Also there is no early evening peak restriction on the return from Waterloo.

I often buy this fare, even when I start my journey at Bristol Temple Meads. Starting short on a CDR is permitted under the terms of National Rail Conditions of Carriage.

I looked up this example on www.nationalrail.co.uk - the site indicated this fare only for journeys arriving Waterloo after 13:00. It's shown as "off peak day return" but the restriction seems to indicate that it's "super off-peak". The latter is shown for Trowbridge-Waterloo but not Shirehampton-Waterloo. Anyone know what's going on?
Secondly, the ^27.10 fare is shown as valid for all the 5 quoted return journeys via Salisbury. There is another fare ^37 "Off peak return" which is valid via Salisbury on the options shown that involve a change at Salisbury, but not on the late ones that involve an overnight journey. Why is the day return valid on overnight but not the [month] return? 

[Mookiemoo]

extra 40 mins really dont sound so bad now does it>?

Yes!!

Time is money! If on business (which let's face it is where the money is made) I'd go fgw. I can't stand the prospect of a 159 with rubbish legroom, no powerpoints, no decent catering and non existant armrests for a long journey!

Ah but for a SWT^▸ (South West Trains) first class fare that is still approx ^40 cheaper than the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) Anytime Return (STD) you can have the better leg room, armrests and powerpoints, no free coffee and nibbles though.

Agreed, time is money, but surely saving money needs to be paramount in business. A business that spends over the odds ain't gonna last long when times are hard.....just ask National Express.

If business isnt going to spend over the odds - why do people still buy FC^‡(resolve) at all!

Fact is, if you have to be in London for 6 hours ish with a client, an elongated journey with SWT is not going to save ^40 if it means you lose the business!

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

extra 40 mins really dont sound so bad now does it>?

Yes!!

Time is money! If on business (which let's face it is where the money is made) I'd go fgw. I can't stand the prospect of a 159 with rubbish legroom, no powerpoints, no decent catering and non existant armrests for a long journey!

Ah but for a SWT^▸ (South West Trains) first class fare that is still approx ^40 cheaper than the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) Anytime Return (STD) you can have the better leg room, armrests and powerpoints, no free coffee and nibbles though.

Agreed, time is money, but surely saving money needs to be paramount in business. A business that spends over the odds ain't gonna last long when times are hard.....just ask National Express.

If business isnt going to spend over the odds - why do people still buy FC^‡(resolve) at all!

Fact is, if you have to be in London for 6 hours ish with a client, an elongated journey with SWT is not going to save ^40 if it means you lose the business!

well if its last min drop of a hat ive just found out i have to be there in 4 hours then yes paddington, knowing in advance, certain you will get a seat knowing the train is over 90% sure to run to time you know you can get food onboard and your saving money no brainer? unless you want to go first class in which case to be fair swt offers a poor mans first class option but for 90% of commuters (random figure plucked out of the air) southwest trains is a better option!

[JayMac]

<snip>
Here's the real imbalance though. If you request your fare to London Waterloo (via Salisbury) from Shirehampton on the Severn Beach Line, the CDR^▸ (Off Peak Day Return [ticket type] (formerly 'Cheap Day')) is ^27.10. It gets weirder though; all other CDR fares on the SBL to London Waterloo are ^28.10.  Seeing as you have to change at Bristol Temple Meads it's a little odd that it is a whacking ^9.40 cheaper to travel further.

This fare is particularly good value as the restrictions on it during Mon-Fri are that you can arrive on any train into Waterloo after 1000. Compared with the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) service into Paddington the earliest you can arrive on a SVR (Off Peak Return) is 1045. Also there is no early evening peak restriction on the return from Waterloo.

I often buy this fare, even when I start my journey at Bristol Temple Meads. Starting short on a CDR is permitted under the terms of National Rail Conditions of Carriage.

I looked up this example on www.nationalrail.co.uk - the site indicated this fare only for journeys arriving Waterloo after 13:00. It's shown as "off peak day return" but the restriction seems to indicate that it's "super off-peak". The latter is shown for Trowbridge-Waterloo but not Shirehampton-Waterloo. Anyone know what's going on?
Secondly, the ^27.10 fare is shown as valid for all the 5 quoted return journeys via Salisbury. There is another fare ^37 "Off peak return" which is valid via Salisbury on the options shown that involve a change at Salisbury, but not on the late ones that involve an overnight journey. Why is the day return valid on overnight but not the [month] return? 

I compared the Off Peak Day Returns (CDR) to Waterloo (WAT) from Bristol Temple Meads (BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains)) and Shirehampton (SHH), because there are no published time restrictions on Avantix^▸ (Ticket Issuing System used on board trains) for the fare from SHH, it merely says 'Restrictions Apply' with a link to a non-existent note. So I assume the '...not before 1000' restriction applies despite National Rail Enquiries not allowing this on their fares inquiry for a SHH-WAT CDR. This is an obvious anomaly, probably brought about by the fact that the SHH fare is set by GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) and the BRI fare is set by SWT^▸ (South West Trains)! I'm reluctant to point out to ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here), FGW or SWT of this anomaly, as any change will, doubtless, not be in my favour! Instead I rely on the lack of knowledge across the board; no guard, RPI^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector (or Retail Price Index, depending on the context)), or gateline staff have yet challenged me when I've travelled to Waterloo on a CDR ticket from Shirehampton on the first train arriving after 1000.

[JayMac]

 Why is the day return valid on overnight but not the [month] return? 

Umm....because you have a month to use it so you wouldn't need to complete your journey the next morning. However on the last day of validity you can break overnight:-

(From National Rail Enquiries)
Where Break of Journey is available on your specific journey, if you wish to stop overnight or it is not possible to complete the journey by 0230 on the day following the last day of validity, you may continue your journey the following morning. Travel must resume before 1200, where the time restrictions that apply to the ticket should be observed and no further break of journey is allowed except to change trains.

[paul7575]

I looked up this example on www.nationalrail.co.uk - the site indicated this fare only for journeys arriving Waterloo after 13:00. It's shown as "off peak day return" but the restriction seems to indicate that it's "super off-peak". The latter is shown for Trowbridge-Waterloo but not Shirehampton-Waterloo. Anyone know what's going on?

I think so, yes. On the NRES^▸ (National Rail Enquiry Service) fares display, Off Peak and Super Off Peak both show up in the same row of the fares matrix (alongside the side heading 'Off Peak') unless you click on the 'more fares' link under the Off Peak 'side heading' (IYSWIM). Clicking 'more fares' nearly always makes the display much clearer AFAICT^▸ (as far as I can tell).  As a related example, if you click on Anytime's more fares, you get two rows, and can more easily work out which fare goes with which times and connections - from which route restrictions then become more apparent.

Normally the SWT^▸ (South West Trains) SOP^▸ (Standard Operating Instructions) availability is 'after 1200 at Waterloo', and it is available on the 1219 arrival.
The SOP fare will possibly only be available for routes SWT price - and which are completely within their area?

Paul

[devon_metro]

and for the record the 159's do have power points do have arm rests have you been one one?

No power points in cattle class!

I know there are armrests, they are simply too low to provide any worthwhile use.

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

and for the record the 159's do have power points do have arm rests have you been one one?

No power points in cattle class!

I know there are armrests, they are simply too low to provide any worthwhile use.

you tryed sitting in the seat