Night Riviera - merged posts, ongoing discussion

[whole diary]

[John R]

Mo one meets at 9....

When I was working - based in Exeter - I regularly had meetings at our other offices, in Salisbury, Bristol, Dorking and London, and can count on the fingers of one hand the number of morning meetings that started later than 9am.

Clearly not a very Friendly organisation then. 

[Brucey]

Mo one meets at 9....

I work in academia (aka relax-ademia) and often have meetings before 10:00am.

A conference in Norwich earlier in the summer, starting at 9:15am, left home at 5:15am to make the first train of the day therefore avoiding the cost of a hotel.
Meeting with external advisors last month, started at 9:00am as several were travelling back up North and wanted to get home on the train at a reasoable hour.
Conference in LA, started at 8:30am every day for five days, inlcuding a Saturday and Sunday!

I think your claim of no-one meeting at 9 is a little far fetched.

[ChrisB]

I did exclude conferences....

In my defence, I was referring to external meetings, doing business, rather than internal staff meetings

[Chris from Nailsea]

On Saturday, Ben Rule announced that there's to be an earlier service too (06:37, I think) starting quite soon, at around 06:37 from Paddington

From the slide used by Ben Rule at TravelWatch SouthWest in Taunton:

Earlier direct first inter-city service to the South West at c.0637 from Paddington, arriving in Exeter c.0845, Plymouth c.0945, Penzance c.1140

[bobm]

Was any indication given of the stopping pattern for that c06:37 or when it might be in the timetable?

[Chris from Nailsea]

No, Bob: I've quoted the full text from the slide, and I can't remember whether Ben added any detail in his talk - he was covering a lot of ground in the time available, so to speak! 

[bobm]

No worries. I should have been there to listen but the day job, which would make use of such a train, got in the way! 

[Chris from Nailsea]

I seem to remember that there may possibly have been some reference to that proposal in one of the slides flashed up on the screens during Ben Rule's presentation at the TravelWatch SouthWest meeting in Taunton last Saturday. 

The trouble was, there were so many slides, shown in quick succession, and containing so much textual detail, that it was impossible to take it all in - while still listening to the speaker. 

I'll obtain copies of the slides used, and report back here in due course. 

Here is the wording from that particular slide:

Night Riviera Services
 The future of these services is secured
 Upgrade in 2015 and 2016 funded by Cornwall Council
 Two additional carriages will be added to the fleet to enhance seasonal capacity
 The addition of another Class 57 locomotive to improve service reliability
 New or enhanced waiting facilities at Penzance, Truro and Paddington
 The platform used by the Night Riviera services at Penzance will receive a canopy

[Adelante_CCT]

This was announced earlier in the year within the franchise document, Page 10

We will provide an earlier direct first inter-city
service to the South West at c.0637 from
Paddington, arriving in Exeter by c.0845, Plymouth
by c.0945 and Penzance by c.1140

Also Page 48

We will increase the number of services between
London and Penzance by one train in each
direction. We will provide an earlier direct first
inter-city service to the South West at c.0637 from
Paddington, arriving into Penzance at 1140. The
1215 return working will provide a new Penzance
to London service, closing the three hour gap
between 1000 and 1303 that exists in the
December 2014 timetable

Was any indication given of the stopping pattern for that c06:37 or when it might be in the timetable?

The document says from the May 2017 timetable change

[TaplowGreen]

This was announced earlier in the year within the franchise document, Page 10

We will provide an earlier direct first inter-city
service to the South West at c.0637 from
Paddington, arriving in Exeter by c.0845, Plymouth
by c.0945 and Penzance by c.1140

Also Page 48

We will increase the number of services between
London and Penzance by one train in each
direction. We will provide an earlier direct first
inter-city service to the South West at c.0637 from
Paddington, arriving into Penzance at 1140. The
1215 return working will provide a new Penzance
to London service, closing the three hour gap
between 1000 and 1303 that exists in the
December 2014 timetable

Was any indication given of the stopping pattern for that c06:37 or when it might be in the timetable?

The document says from the May 2017 timetable change

The addition of the 0637 service is encouraging, if it's getting in at around 0945 that would suggest very few stops - perhaps Reading-Taunton-Tiverton-Exeter-Plymouth?

Apart from ChrisB (who likes a lie-in!  ) I still think it's an hour or so too late for those of us who start business at 0900 (or earlier!) - I wonder if it's not possible to run this one earlier, would it be possible, as extra coaches seem to be available, to run the down sleeper a little later so that it gets into Plymouth at say 0730, or even better return to having a carriage which is detached at Plymouth, allowing passengers to alight around 0800 rather than the current 0515?

[ChrisB]

Sorry, the demand to be in Plymouth from East of Exeter for 0800 I reckon could be counted on one hand on a day to day basis.

[TaplowGreen]

Sorry, the demand to be in Plymouth from East of Exeter for 0800 I reckon could be counted on one hand on a day to day basis.

I'd be interested in knowing on what you base this latest assumption since currently it's impossible by rail so I'm unclear what empirical/anecdotal data exists? 

If you'd tried the A38 into Plymouth at that time of the morning your opinion may be somewhat different! (...and yes I know it's not all coming from East of Exeter)

What I do know for a fact (because I have been involved in several) is that one of the key factors that Businesses look at in deciding where to locate/relocate is the availability of regular and reliable transport links, be it local and/or with National reach for larger companies - it's one of the more significant factors in the "rise" of Exeter as a location for Business at the expense of the (much larger) city of Plymouth, irrespective of the decline of the Dockyard.

Not the only factor, but can be a key differentiator when it comes to making the decision. It's a good opportunity for rail to be part of a joined up picture and to generate income.

[JayMac]

Sorry, the demand to be in Plymouth from East of Exeter for 0800 I reckon could be counted on one hand on a day to day basis.

So, you think GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) are going ahead with this earlier service based on a projected passenger count of 5 or fewer per day?

 

[The Tall Controller]

Many more people travel on the sleeper to Penzance than Plymouth. It's the only train that connects with the Scillonian to St Mary's.

[grahame]

Many more people travel on the sleeper to Penzance than Plymouth. It's the only train that connects with the Scillonian to St Mary's.

Funnily enough, I hadn't appreciated the importance of the offshore island market until I had a discussion on passenger flows with the station adopter for Mallaig last Friday.