Another fare query

[whole diary]

[Mookiemoo]

I WANT TO GET THE 06:10 from kiddie connecting at Euston to Hemel - apparently you cannot buy a fare for this - Why?

I can only buy not LON or WAT or not LON - I am happy to pay the premium.

This is true for both the official online, at the kisok and even on advantix machines that tend to offer the widest range.

Tis first class so not sure if standard exists - but I dont think so

[thetrout]

I'm by no means an expert on this particular route. But I would say they limit the ticket to NOT LONDON to stop pax from buying a cheaper ticket via LDN and then not continuing the journey. I'm sure someone can (dis)prove this...

Maybe split the ticket at Euston or Birmingham...?!

[Mookiemoo]

I'm by no means an expert on this particular route. But I would say they limit the ticket to NOT LONDON to stop pax from buying a cheaper ticket via LDN and then not continuing the journey. I'm sure someone can (dis)prove this...

Maybe split the ticket at Euston or Birmingham...?!

Point is - if I pay Brum to Eust I got stung for the full Euston fair - there are singles via euston to hemel that are less than the kiddie to euston fair!  EXCEPT FOR THIS TRAIN

I DO NOT WANT TO GO INTO LNDON - I HATE THE PLACE - that s why I commute daily rather than staying over

I'll do what I did last time when I realised it was a mistake - every Wolverhampton to london train other than this stops at watford - last time I did it by mistake - I assumed it stopped at watford.  I'll see if the TM^▸ (Train Manager, or possibly Ticket Machine, depending on context) takes pity on me like he did last time.  He sold me the cheapest ticket possible to get me through the barriers - which it turned out i didnt need but I paid a supplement which ium happy about

I just dont like the fare not being possible

 

[inspector_blakey]

Just checked the fares manual. I don't know if KID - HML via EUS is a permitted route or not, but that's a bit of a moot point because the listed fares are either "Not London", "Watford not London" or "VWC and connections" (the last group are advance purchase). There is no fare routed "Any permitted".

Now, my geography of that area isn't great, but why not get a Pendo from Brum and change at Watford Junc onto a service for Hemel? That would be permitted with the "Watford not London" ticket, where SOR is yours for ^128 or SVR is ^43.50 (the SVR does not permit arrival at WFJ before 1045).

If you still have a Y-P you could do very well here: Virgin have an easement whereby a railcard discounted off-peak return ticket is valid for travel by any Virgin Trains service where the journey is priced by Virgin. So, you could get yourself a peak-time BHM - EUS return for the princely sum of ^26.65 with the railcard, valid by any Virgin service with no time restriction. That might help you split up the journey and save money.

[Mookiemoo]

Just checked the fares manual. I don't know if KID - HML via EUS is a permitted route or not, but that's a bit of a moot point because the listed fares are either "Not London", "Watford not London" or "VWC and connections" (the last group are advance purchase). There is no fare routed "Any permitted".

Now, my geography of that area isn't great, but why not get a Pendo from Brum and change at Watford Junc onto a service for Hemel? That would be permitted with the "Watford not London" ticket, where SOR is yours for ^128 or SVR is ^43.50 (the SVR does not permit arrival at WFJ before 1045).

If you still have a Y-P you could do very well here: Virgin have an easement whereby a railcard discounted off-peak return ticket is valid for travel by any Virgin Trains service where the journey is priced by Virgin. So, you could get yourself a peak-time BHM - EUS return for the princely sum of ^26.65 with the railcard, valid by any Virgin service with no time restriction. That might help you split up the journey and save money.

Because the only train wolverhampton to london that doesnt stop at watford is the one that get to me to hemel at 0918 - the one that requires me to go into london because it doesnt stop at watford!

I have a meeting at 0930 - the first train gets me there to early - the second too late - the one I want I cant buy a ticket for because they do not offer a via london fair

and I can buy a peak ticket - I did tonight - if the TM^▸ (Train Manager, or possibly Ticket Machine, depending on context) does not know YP cards are not valid on first class tickets - advantix machines issue them even though technically not valid


"Virgin have an easement whereby a railcard discounted off-peak return ticket is valid for travel by any Virgin Trains service where the journey is priced by Virgin. So, you could get yourself a peak-time BHM - EUS return for the princely sum of ^26.65 with the railcard, valid by any Virgin service with no time restriction. That might help you split up the journey and save money.
[/quote]"

How?

I am not a novice - I worked out that I could save a few hundred a month WOS^» (Worcester Shrub Hill - next trains) - PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) by splitting at oxford - I havent worked this one out - maybe my embarassment

[inspector_blakey]

How?

I am not a novice - I worked out that I could save a few hundred a month WOS^» (Worcester Shrub Hill - next trains) - PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) by splitting at oxford - I havent worked this one out - maybe my embarassment

My thought process was this:
You want to travel KID - EUS then double back to HML. I mistakenly assumed that your journey would take you via BHM. However, the same applies from Sandwell and Dudley: you could use your railcard to purchase a saver fare return SAD - EUS that would be much much cheaper than the peak time standard open fare, then tag your KID - SAD and EUS-HML tickets onto either end of that.

My response was a genuine attempt to help. Sorry if you found it patronizing.

[Mookiemoo]

How?

I am not a novice - I worked out that I could save a few hundred a month WOS^» (Worcester Shrub Hill - next trains) - PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) by splitting at oxford - I havent worked this one out - maybe my embarassment

My thought process was this:
You want to travel KID - EUS then double back to HML. I mistakenly assumed that your journey would take you via BHM. However, the same applies from Sandwell and Dudley: you could use your railcard to purchase a saver fare return SAD - EUS that would be much much cheaper than the peak time standard open fare, then tag your KID - SAD and EUS-HML tickets onto either end of that.

My response was a genuine attempt to help. Sorry if you found it patronizing.

Please accept my apologies - look at the time of my post - was the end of a long and tiring day involving annoying ticket machines, the worst designed station on earth (liverpool south parkway) and a very helpful girl at crewe you renewed my faith n the rail system.

Can you please direct me to where I can print that out - because I'm sure that I'd get grief on a peak hour morning train to london!  (Not doubting you BTW^▸ (by the way))

[inspector_blakey]

Apology accepted.

The railcard easement should be well known to Virgin Trains staff; three things to stress again:
1. it only applies to standard class tickets
2. it only applies on Virgin Trains
3. the ticket concerned must be priced by VT^▸ (Virgin Trains - former franchise (or, possibly, in a France context, Versement Transport - a payroll tax on employers to fund local transport) )

For your particular journey, which involves travelling SAD - EUS, the saver return fare is ^27.70, priced by VT. This has restriction 2C which is very long and complicated, but the vital "notes" section reads as follows:

NOTES:                       
1) Time restrictions are     
indicated by a restriction   
shown against the ticket's   
validity code.               
2) Holders of 16-25, Senior, 
Disabled Persons, HM Forces   
and Family & Friends Railcards
, New Deal Photocards and     
Inter-Rail (Code 70) Cards   
travelling with Off-Peak     
tickets may use ANY Virgin   
train service, as long as the
journey being made is priced 
by Virgin Trains. If the     
journey is not priced by     
Virgin Trains then the stated
Off-Peak restrictions apply. 
3) Only Senior, Disabled     
persons and HM Forces         
Railcards discounts are       
offered with First Class     
Off-Peak Tickets.

[Mookiemoo]

Apology accepted.

The railcard easement should be well known to Virgin Trains staff; three things to stress again:
1. it only applies to standard class tickets
2. it only applies on Virgin Trains
3. the ticket concerned must be priced by VT^▸ (Virgin Trains - former franchise (or, possibly, in a France context, Versement Transport - a payroll tax on employers to fund local transport) )

For your particular journey, which involves travelling SAD - EUS, the saver return fare is ^27.70, priced by VT. This has restriction 2C which is very long and complicated, but the vital "notes" section reads as follows:

NOTES:                       
1) Time restrictions are     
indicated by a restriction   
shown against the ticket's   
validity code.               
2) Holders of 16-25, Senior, 
Disabled Persons, HM Forces   
and Family & Friends Railcards
, New Deal Photocards and     
Inter-Rail (Code 70) Cards   
travelling with Off-Peak     
tickets may use ANY Virgin   
train service, as long as the
journey being made is priced 
by Virgin Trains. If the     
journey is not priced by     
Virgin Trains then the stated
Off-Peak restrictions apply. 
3) Only Senior, Disabled     
persons and HM Forces         
Railcards discounts are       
offered with First Class     
Off-Peak Tickets.

See there's the catch -I go first class - although sine im out of contract in three weeks (budget cuts)  I may well be reconsidering my mode of transit. 

Doesnt apply to me - but can an OAP's rail card be used in this manner with first? I have family who regularly go to and from Watford and are complaining at the new costs (since Liverpool VIrgin trains only stop at Stafford these days) - the advance tickets are not as good as they were but they wont go LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise) as they like the service!