Ticket Machines - machines missing or broken, and penalty fare implications (merged topics)

[whole diary]

[g4mby]

Two ticket machines at Yate, one on each platform, aren't we lucky? And there's talk of a third being installed as the machines can't issue tickets quick enough at peak times so many have to board without tickets.

Both machines have been installed facing the direct sunlight so no matter what time of year they are both virtually unusable if the sun is shining. Last week I managed to select the ticket that I wanted but couldn't work out why my debit card was being rejected. The screen was probably telling me but I couldn't see the screen very well. Come to think of it, the machine at Filton Abbey Wood faces due south so if that machine is ever brought into use passengers there will have the same problem. Don't they ever think of these things when they plan the installation?

[g4mby]

all I ask for is a bit of flexability from the train company when someone is genuinely endeavouring to purchase a ticket but the ticket machine either isn't working or is only partcially working.

Flexibility and consistency amongst conductors is needed. Some make you feel like a criminal, some are only too happy to sell you a ticket while on many trains that I travel on there is absolutely no attempt to check tickets at all.

[Lee]

Insider's take on the Penalty Fare / Ticketless Travel issue (link below.)
http://indefenceoffirstgreatwestern.blogspot.com/2007/08/fares-fair.html

[g4mby]

Personally, I think if a PF^▸ (Penalty Fare) scheme is going to work, all stations need to be under the same rules, like SWT^▸ (South West Trains), EVERY station now excpet West Of Salisbury is PF zone, which is how to do it, not make half the stations exempt

If the PF scheme is going to work then FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s conductors need to be more consistent in their approach to people without tickets. Some treat you like criminals and give you the third degree while some are only too willing to sell you a ticket even if the ticket machine is working and the station you boarded at is staffed!

[Timmer]

Personally, I think if a PF^▸ (Penalty Fare) scheme is going to work, all stations need to be under the same rules, like SWT^▸ (South West Trains), EVERY station now excpet West Of Salisbury is PF zone, which is how to do it, not make half the stations exempt

If the PF scheme is going to work then FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s conductors need to be more consistent in their approach to people without tickets. Some treat you like criminals and give you the third degree while some are only too willing to sell you a ticket even if the ticket machine is working and the station you boarded at is staffed!

Wouldnt surprise me if you board a train with an ex-Wessex conductor that they would happily sell you a ticket on the train just like in Wessex days. Whereas on a IC^▸ (Inter City) service with original FGW conductors who weren't used to issuing many tickets you could find it much harder. I could be wrong though.

[g4mby]

Wouldnt surprise me if you board a train with an ex-Wessex conductor that they would happily sell you a ticket on the train just like in Wessex days. Whereas on a IC^▸ (Inter City) service with original FGW^▸ (First Great Western) conductors who weren't used to issuing many tickets you could find it much harder. I could be wrong though.

I was actually indirectly referring to ex-Wessex conductors. Mind you with the severe over-crowding I'm currently experiencing, now worse in the late afternoons due to the school holidays, ticket checks are often not even attempted. 

[mr_guard]

If a station is unstaffed, then the passenger must be able to buy the CHEAPEST ticket at the first available place. If this means it's their destination because a guard can't check tickets due to knackered machine / overcrowding / frequency of stops, then it still applies. The cheapest ticket would include railcard discounts (if valid at the time of day) and any local offers / groupsave or whatnot tickets.

How can you dodge a fare you cannot buy?

* I'm not overly familiar with the route, but I'm guessing the train goes from Weston through to Bath direct, via Bristol Temple Meads. I'd have to check whether the company can in theory insist you alight the train at Bristol (taking the assumption Bristol Temple Meads is always fully staffed) to buy the ticket. I would consider this to be highly unfair though if it was the case.

[Lee]

* I'm not overly familiar with the route, but I'm guessing the train goes from Weston through to Bath direct, via Bristol Temple Meads. I'd have to check whether the company can in theory insist you alight the train at Bristol (taking the assumption Bristol Temple Meads is always fully staffed) to buy the ticket. I would consider this to be highly unfair though if it was the case.

Northbound services from Weston generally run via Temple Meads on their way to Filton Abbey Wood , where they either terminate , or continue towards Cheltenham and sometimes beyond. The odd Virgin Cross Country service also calls at Weston on its way to Temple Meads , Parkway , Cheltenham & the Midlands. This means that you usually have to change at Temple Meads for Bath. However , there are some direct Weston - Bristol - Bath - London services.

By the way , thanks for your initial insights , and welcome to the forum.

[Steve Bray]

At Dorking Deepdene, there is a ticket machine, which has actually been situated on the pavement (I wonder if special permission is needed for that), as you need to walk up 30 steps or so to the platform. Alas, I would say that half the time it is "Out of Service".

At Dorking West, there isn't a machine.

I was curious to learn why the fare quoted to me on the train was less that than the ticket machine quoted. It was explained to me that some of the machines that the conductors carry are the old ones, which haven't had their fares updated!

[Graz]

I had the (dis)pleasure of using one of these blasted machines today.

I arrived at Oldfield Park 15 minutes before the train was due. Great, I thought, plenty of time to buy a ticket. How wrong I was!
Approaching it, I thought it was off/broken because the screen looked blank. On closer inspection, I realised that it was on, but the screen was so dim I could barely see a thing. Sadly for me it was a sunny day! So shielding with one hand from the sun, I somehow managed to navigate through the menus and find Clifton Down. It was so difficult to see anything, I had to squint my eyes to read the text and find the tiny 'railcard' button to add my young persons card to.

So, the price was ^3.75. Fine, I thought. Pay ^4, 25p change and I'll have my tickets. Wrong. I put in ^4, a message came up "Amount Tendered Too High" and my money dropped back into the tray. There was NO SIGN AT ALL that the machine did not give change. Not on the machine or as far as I could see on the screens. Great, now about 8 minutes before the train arrives!

So, I struggled through the process again. Thank goodness I had change! Got up to ^3.70. Needed a 5p, so I fumbled everywhere in my wallet until I found one. Just about to put it in and I saw "Transaction ended" or something similar and once again my money was rejected. That was in about 30 seconds from when I started to put in the cash.

Third time, and I was giving up if it happened again. I got the tickets at last, but it shouldn't have been so hard. Covered in sweat, I picked up the tickets and boarded the standing room only 1-car 150 as it was just pulling into the station

If the guy I know was in the ticket office, it would have taken just 20 seconds to get the ticket. This took 15 minutes. Buying tickets should not be stressful at all, but this sure was.  I feel myself as a more experienced traveller- imagine if someone with little experience tried this! In my view, they should get rid of all these horrible things and have stations like Oldfield Park staffed until 6pm daily.

I will be sending an e-mail to FGW^▸ (First Great Western), as it was totally unacceptable.

[Lee]

I put Graz's struggle to FOSBR^▸ (Friends of Suburban Bristol Railways) , and Joe Patrick has offered the following opinion :

In the former West Midlands county , the PTE^▸ (Passenger Transport Executive) funds opening of almost all stations from first train in the morning , to last in the evening. This results in stations such as Small Heath and Tyseley , which each have usage smaller than all stations south of Clifton Down , being staffed.

[vacman]

Bodmin Parkway in Cornwalls TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) suffered damage by people trying to break in. They failed just leaving scars to the base of the machine. But fear not, they returned and instead of damaging it, they took the whole bloody thing! They may survive around Bristol, but Bodmins has been stolen!!

The machine was badly damaged by vandals (who didn't get into it!) but wasn't stolen! it was taken away by engineers as it was quite badly damaged, the theives went to great lengths to rob it but to no avail! they do seem quite vandal proof, so far!

[Graz]

I share the views with Joe Patrick, Lee. I know stations like Avoncliff and Freshford shouldn't be staffed because they are so small, but Oldfield Park, and Keynsham should definitely be. There are already ticket offices on these stations- it won't cost the earth to have them staffed throughout the day and would probably encourage more customers. Why do we always seem to be losing out when it comes to service like this?

Here are some photos of my trip taken with my mobile (I won't post any more as it would make this thread go a bit too off topic!)

A lovely floral display at Oldfield Park that some people put a lot of effort into:

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd13/GrazzaD/oldfieldpark.jpg

Crowds on the 1-car Weymouth-Cardiff Ctl service, every seat was taken (Sorry- a bit blurred):

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd13/GrazzaD/crowds.jpg

The offending machine that caused me so much grief:

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd13/GrazzaD/ticketmachine.jpg
(Just noticed it says tickets and CHANGE at the bottom- yeah, right!)

[grahame]

Here are some photos of my trip taken with my mobile (I won't post any more as it would make this thread go a bit too off topic!)

Crowds on the 1-car Weymouth-Cardiff Ctl service, every seat was taken (Sorry- a bit blurred):

Don't worry about going a bit off topic - especially if you're a regular.   I know I do from time to time, and I welcome it and will continue to do so up to a point at which it seriosuly diluted the board or caused offence (But then you weren't going to advertise "Get Rich Quick" schemes, were you, Graz?).

I note the crowds and I remember the horrors on the line at Easter - denied boardings, etc.  This weekend I'm fixed firmly in Melksham and not making any pleasure trips!

[Lee]

An interesting Oldfield Park ticket machine background link.
http://oldfieldparktrains.blogspot.com/2007/04/ticket-machine.html