Fare evasion [original topic]

[whole diary]

[Mookiemoo]

I agree with Mookiemoo - if a loophole is there, you can't blame a passenger for using it.

5. I am the first to alert the TM^‡(resolve) to people I know are dodging or avoiding paying!  I nearly got into a bitch fight on friday because of it!

Very noble! What response do you get from the guard - it must be a difficult situation?

Before, how did you ensure you woke up before Reading?

Varies - depending on the guard and the situation

On thurs and fri - FC^‡(resolve) on the cotwolds line is the first place the dodger head and hide in the toilets

Often its just a - you know you've got XYZ down there boasting about not having a ticket - and the TM normally goes down and evicts them (they usuallly dont have ANY ticket let alone a FC)

However on the train on fri - I liked the TM - he sorted my issue at Pad!  But at Evesham two chavs got on - one who made me look like kate moss (those of you who may have worked out who I am will know what I mean).  They sat behind me taking the piss out of first class passengers.  As I packed up at pershore I suggested they didnt sit there without tickets (which they'd admitted) taking the piss of people who paid 900 quid plus a month..   Slagging off and everything ensued - the one who could walk rather than waddle (I am not thin by any means! so I say this openly ) - pursuied me down the train because I offended her friend when I forced my way past as she blocked the carriage exit by standing there!  I reported to the TM that not only did they not have a ticket they didnt have an FC ticket - the best he could offer was opening the door andinviting me to run for it.

[Tickets Please]

Knew my mind wasn't deceiving me

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=2726.msg20939#msg20939

The ICIS card isnt in itself proof of entitlement to a YP card. The railcard holder HAS to be studying for 15 hours or more a week and for at least 20 weeks of the year.

If the regs state OU courses or distance learning are exempt then holding a NUS or ICIS card counts for nothing.

If someone using a YP card who isnt a student for 15 hours a week or more for 20 or more weeks of the year was taken to court, waving a ICIS or NUS card at a Magistrate will not get you far.

[smokey]

Whilst there are Many Conditions of use associated with Ticket validity such as,

Cheap day not valid before 09.00 monday to Friday.

AND all the other 100's of such conditions, this issue about Young Person Discounted First Class Fare is covered very simply in LAW.

A Ticket is a CONTRACT, the Fare Paid is agreeded at the point of Sale (the sealing of the contract).
If a First Class Ticket has been issued with a Young Person Discount then it is the Mistake of the Train Company not the traveller.

Vacman often points out that You don't shop at a Supermarket then leave without Paying on the Excuss I'll pay in the Car park if I'm asked!

Well in said Supermarket, if the Shelf price is ^2.25 but the Check-out comes up at ^3.25 then the Supermarket HAS to by LAW honour the Advertised Price because, at the shelf is the Point of Sale and the AGREEDED price!

The Answer is Simple: FGW^▸ (First Great Western) need to get there act together!

BUT in the words of a Very Senior FGW Train Manager,
"There is a national shortage of trained circus personnel, so much so that Mr Billy Smart has been to Swindon to see First Great Western, to beg to have all his CLOWNS Back"

God's Honest that's what I heard a Senior Train Manager say, or words to that effect.

[TerminalJunkie]

Well in said Supermarket, if the Shelf price is ^2.25 but the Check-out comes up at ^3.25 then the Supermarket HAS to by LAW honour the Advertised Price because, at the shelf is the Point of Sale and the AGREEDED price!

Wrong: an advertised price in a shop is merely an invitation to treat.

The display of goods is not an offer by the retailer; if a customer places goods into a shopping trolley it is the customer who makes the offer, which the retailer can accept or reject at the point of sale. No contract has been made until this offer is accepted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharmaceutical_Society_of_Great_Britain_v._Boots_Cash_Chemists_(Southern)_Ltd.

Still, it's jolly decent of you to highlight your appalling spelling in bold so that nobody misses it... 

[vacman]

The Answer is Simple: FGW^▸ (First Great Western) need to get there act together!

it's in all avantix machines whether FGW, London midland.........
And what you say about the law is rubbish aswell mr smokey, if the customer is fully aware that the railcard is not valid but still asks for the discount then they are KNOWINGLY and WILLINGLY trying to obtain a discount that they KNOW is not valid which could well constitute an offence under 5.3(a) regulation of railways act 1889, agreed it would be quite difficult to prove but still........

[grahame]

The following posts on this subject went beyond the bounds of the forum agreement that members sign up to when they join the forum, and one contained text which could have got me - as forum administraor - into legal hot water had I not deleted it from public view as soon at it was brought to my attention.   These following posts have not been restored, but I am restoring the rest of the thread in a locked condition as it contains a great deal os useful information and discussion.

A new thread (same subject) carries on some elements of this discussion:

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=4629.0