Christmas and Boxing Day trains - ongoing discussion

[whole diary]

[12hoursunday]

As double time is on offer I have yet to see any problem covering these turns 

See-ing it's only time + 25% for these two days, that a driver would receive I think that they may have a shortage of volunters.
Also we need to get one thing straight. Previously drivers were booked off with pay (without loss of any holiday entiltement) because there was no service provided. That was the only reason. Nothing to do with union agreements etc. A notice was always posted ( although I have failed to see one this year) signed by mangement & LDC stating that if no volunters could be found then the booked driver would be required to work his turn. That is how it stands on the HSS^▸ (High Speed Services) side.

The SprinterMeister will no doubt enlighten us what happened with the West lot.

[smokey]

I know it's out of our Area but unless First Scot Rail run a Full Boxing day Service then why have Any Boxing Day trains in England or Wales?

IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly) untill very recently December 26^th was a normal working day in Scotland, maybe this changed when Jan 1^st became a bank holiday in England

[Electric train]

I don't think Xmas day or Boxing day should be to much of an issue for NR^» (Network Rail - home page) because as I was sitting at home Xmas morning look out of my window, which over looks part of the line Maidenhead to Bourne End, a NR patrol team walked past so NR has maintenance teams in already.

Which in theory to NR Xmas and Boxing Days are normal operational days it up to the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) to run trains.

[IndustryInsider]

The media have been giving very negative coverage about the railway not providing a service - a 58-hour complete shutdown seems to be the phrase they're all picking up on. Having spent an hour or so at Reading on the 27th - probably the busiest post-Christmas day for rail travel - things were very much on a knife edge in terms of getting people on and off the longer distance trains. The station staff were doing their best, but most trains were loading/unloading for 3-4 minutes. A couple of 4-car Voyagers were in a right state in terms of crowding. Thankfully everything was managing to run pretty much on time.

I'm a member of staff who enjoys having Xmas and Boxing Day off of work guaranteed, and stands to lose out if trains run over these two days, but I can't deny that a Boxing Day service should at least be trialled on FGW^▸ (First Great Western) routes. As mentioned there's the sales starting, sporting fixtures, and some people would like to go home from visiting relatives/friends on the 26th which would ease the pressure on the 27th a little.

This of course all hinges on staff being provided on trains and at stations, and NR^» (Network Rail - home page) being able to provide Signallers and maintenance staff, but vast numbers would not be required. Obviously engineering work might cause some alterations and if Reading happened to be playing Cardiff City that day you might need a couple of Footy specials. Broadly though, I'd suggest the following service should be provided initially from around 9am on Boxing Day:

Paddington-Plymouth-Penzance: Every two hours calling at Reading, Westbury, Castle Cary, Taunton, Tiverton PW^▸ (Permanent Way), Exeter SD, Newton Abbot, Totnes and Plymouth. Every other train (i.e. every 4 hours) to extend to Penzance calling at the usual stops. Branch line connections to Barnstaple/Newquay/Falmouth/St. Ives to connect with these trains.

Paddington-Bristol-Cardiff-Swansea: Every hour calling at Reading, Didcot, Swindon, Chippenham, Bath Spa, Bristol TM^‡(resolve), Newport and Cardiff Central. Every other train (i.e. every 2 hours) extending to Bridgend, Port Talbot, Neath and Swansea.

Paddington-Gloucester-Cheltenham-Worcester: Every 4 hours calling at Reading, Didcot, Swindon, Kemble, Stonehouse, Gloucester, Cheltenham Spa and Worcester Shrub Hill.

Paddington-Oxford-Worcester-Malvern-Hereford: Every 2 hours calling at Slough, Maidenhead, Reading and Oxford. Every other train (i.e. every 4 hours) extending to Hanborough, Charlbury, Kingham, Moreton, Honeybourne, Evesham, Pershore, Worcester SH & FS, Malvern Link, Great Malvern, Colwall, Ledbury and Hereford.

Paddington Local Services: Every hour a stopping train to Oxford, and every hour a stopping train to Reading - usual off-peak weekday stops except the Reading's would also stop at West Ealing and Hanwell. Hourly branch line connections to Windsor. Hourly or two hourly branch line connections to Henley and Marlow.

Other services: Two hourly service between Reading and Gatwick Airport. Two hourly service between Reading and Bedwyn via Newbury. Two hourly service from Cardiff-Portsmouth (usual off-peak stops) and a Four-hourly service from Great Malvern-Westbury.

Oh, and finally a shuttle service at least every 30 minutes on the TransWilts from Salisbury to Swindon via Westbury and Melksham to make sure my plans get Graham's seal of approval! 

[Tim]

I know it's out of our Area but unless First Scot Rail run a Full Boxing day Service then why have Any Boxing Day trains in England or Wales?

IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly) untill very recently December 26^th was a normal working day in Scotland, maybe this changed when Jan 1^st became a bank holiday in England

Boxing day isn't a bank holiday in Scotland (they have 2 january as an extra bank holiday in Scotland instead).  Traditionally Hogmany has been more of a holiday/party in Scotland than Christmas. 

[northwesterntrains]

It has been suggested that another First company will run a Boxing Day 2009 service.  However, Boxing Day is on a Saturday next year, so consequently the bank holiday is on Monday.

http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/MP-hopes-for-Boxing-Day.4825064.jp

[Btline]

The media have been giving very negative coverage about the railway not providing a service - a 58-hour complete shutdown seems to be the phrase they're all picking up on. Having spent an hour or so at Reading on the 27th - probably the busiest post-Christmas day for rail travel - things were very much on a knife edge in terms of getting people on and off the longer distance trains. The station staff were doing their best, but most trains were loading/unloading for 3-4 minutes. A couple of 4-car Voyagers were in a right state in terms of crowding. Thankfully everything was managing to run pretty much on time.

I'm a member of staff who enjoys having Xmas and Boxing Day off of work guaranteed, and stands to lose out if trains run over these two days, but I can't deny that a Boxing Day service should at least be trialled on FGW^▸ (First Great Western) routes. As mentioned there's the sales starting, sporting fixtures, and some people would like to go home from visiting relatives/friends on the 26th which would ease the pressure on the 27th a little.

This of course all hinges on staff being provided on trains and at stations, and NR^» (Network Rail - home page) being able to provide Signallers and maintenance staff, but vast numbers would not be required. Obviously engineering work might cause some alterations and if Reading happened to be playing Cardiff City that day you might need a couple of Footy specials. Broadly though, I'd suggest the following service should be provided initially from around 9am on Boxing Day:

Paddington-Plymouth-Penzance: Every two hours calling at Reading, Westbury, Castle Cary, Taunton, Tiverton PW^▸ (Permanent Way), Exeter SD, Newton Abbot, Totnes and Plymouth. Every other train (i.e. every 4 hours) to extend to Penzance calling at the usual stops. Branch line connections to Barnstaple/Newquay/Falmouth/St. Ives to connect with these trains.

Paddington-Bristol-Cardiff-Swansea: Every hour calling at Reading, Didcot, Swindon, Chippenham, Bath Spa, Bristol TM^‡(resolve), Newport and Cardiff Central. Every other train (i.e. every 2 hours) extending to Bridgend, Port Talbot, Neath and Swansea.

Paddington-Gloucester-Cheltenham-Worcester: Every 4 hours calling at Reading, Didcot, Swindon, Kemble, Stonehouse, Gloucester, Cheltenham Spa and Worcester Shrub Hill.

Paddington-Oxford-Worcester-Malvern-Hereford: Every 2 hours calling at Slough, Maidenhead, Reading and Oxford. Every other train (i.e. every 4 hours) extending to Hanborough, Charlbury, Kingham, Moreton, Honeybourne, Evesham, Pershore, Worcester SH & FS, Malvern Link, Great Malvern, Colwall, Ledbury and Hereford.

Paddington Local Services: Every hour a stopping train to Oxford, and every hour a stopping train to Reading - usual off-peak weekday stops except the Reading's would also stop at West Ealing and Hanwell. Hourly branch line connections to Windsor. Hourly or two hourly branch line connections to Henley and Marlow.

Other services: Two hourly service between Reading and Gatwick Airport. Two hourly service between Reading and Bedwyn via Newbury. Two hourly service from Cardiff-Portsmouth (usual off-peak stops) and a Four-hourly service from Great Malvern-Westbury.

Oh, and finally a shuttle service at least every 30 minutes on the TransWilts from Salisbury to Swindon via Westbury and Melksham to make sure my plans get Graham's seal of approval! 

What about Pewsey?

[IndustryInsider]

What about Pewsey?

What about it? What about Bramley? What about Heyford? What about Bicester Town? What about Weston-Super-Mare? You have to draw a line somewhere and Pewsey's passenger footfall is very small - though perhaps the two hourly Plymouth service that doesn't carry on to Penzance could stop there? After all, it's only meant to be a draft plan based on my own personal suggestions!

[John R]

I would start with a much simpler and basic service, designed to enable those must travel home on the afternoon and evening of Boxing Day in order to start work on the 27th to do so. Leisure traffic (football, sales) is another matter.

So (all starting in the afternoon, to discourage daytrippers):
bi hourly Swansea to London and bi hourly Bristol to London.
bi hourly Plymouth to London with a couple starting back from Penzance
bi hourly Portsmouth-Cardiff (strengthened to 6 coaches if that's feasible with platform lengths)
hourly Oxford - London stopping services
and a couple of services each way on the Stroud, Cotswold and Weymouth lines, and some other local lines.

That way a basic "get you there" service could be provided, without encouraging demand that would result in a large number of railway workers to need to give up their Boxing Day.

I would not allow advance tickets to be valid. If you need to travel on Boxing Day then you should not do so at a discounted rate. That would be contraversial and could give the press a field day, but the logic is sound - the railway would not be actively encouraging travel on Boxing Day, so it shouldn't be offering seats at prices which are designed to fill empty seats on trains which are otherwise running.

[grahame]

We can have a field day with this one (but, seriously, what a good day to look at some radical ideas!).

125s:
Every 2 hours - Paddington to Penzance via Bristol and Weston
Every 2 hours - Paddington to Swansea via Gloucester

Regional:
Every 2 hours - Cardiff to Portsmouth
Every 2 hours - Gatwick to Hereford
Every 2 hours - Chippenham to Weymouth

Connections between trains to be very carefully arranged - for example, train from Gatwick to arrive at Reading, then a 125 to call Westbound, and then the Hereford carry on. Similar thing at Westbury.

TV:
Every 2 hours - London to Bedwyn
Every 2 hours - London to Banbury

Regional and Thames Valley trains to be "all station", and the Swansea service to be all stations from Didcot to Cardiff at least.   And I would need to think further (and take advise) on Worcester to Bristol, Somerset, Devon, Cornwall and TV branches.  I'm suprised that no-one has proposed anthing for Paignton.

And, yes, John R. It would be a great day for trying out a pricing policy that didn't put rail fares into disrepute!  I'm not going to agree with your "discourage day trippers" though - if they are happy to use the service and pay the price, why turn them away?

Has anyone thought how the income from this extra day's service could / would be channelled to the [correct] operator?

I

[John R]

Graham - If you encourage daytrippers then it would mean many more railway staff would end up working.  Also, if you have trains in the morning (which you need to in order to have daytrippers) then staff would end up not being able to enjoy a drink or three in the evening on Xmas day because of the need to be on duty a few hours later. So it would not only be Boxing Day which would be impacted.

[12hoursunday]

Let's hope (from a staff's point of view) that management turn a blind eye to IndustryInsider's hairbrained suggestion eh!

[gaf71]

I like it, no Exeter unit work involved!

[IndustryInsider]

Let's hope (from a staff's point of view) that management turn a blind eye to IndustryInsider's hairbrained suggestion eh!

Fortunately for you, they've rarely shown signs of listening in all the years I've been suggesting things to them... 

[grahame]

Clearly, the thought of having to work over Christmas is a horror for many of our posters who work in the industry, and there are very strong suspicions that voluntary systems would turn into mandated systems.  As far as this forum is concerned, the discussion is an academic one, and it's good to have aired the views and conflicting needs and desires.

As an afterthought, I'm adding a link which contains strong language to a video clip which highlights the tensions in roster scheduling. It's a spoof ... not to be taken too seriously (and not to be viewed if you're easily offended), and needless to say I don't have any association with the clip or its producers - I'm just linking to an external site and leaving you to form an opinion (and I hope be amused!)
http://s260.photobucket.com/albums/ii4/mr_metaxa/?action=view&current=00HitlersleavedeclinedFG.flv