Christmas and Boxing Day trains - ongoing discussion

[whole diary]

[IndustryInsider]

I think it's fair to expect reliability of the service to dip a bit during the last couple of years and up until the end of the decade as there is so much work going on at the moment.  But what we've seen during 2014 is much worse that I would have expected, and the passengers on the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) network (and the staff on the front line) deserve better.

[Electric train]

The Kings Cross overrun is due to a major S & C (switches & crossing) renewal at Hollow Way Road, the work is on the UP side between (the UP Fast and UP Slow) are on the same side of the permanent way on the ECML^▸ (East Coast Main Line) north of Copenhagen Tunnel, work involved deep dig, which effected signalling and traction cables to the Down lines; I don't know why they got so far behind although when major track work like this is done unforeseen problems emerge the only recovery plan once all the old track is removed is to keep going if there is a problem.

The plan was to get the Slow's handed back for 09:00 service Saturday morning, the Thameslink OLE^▸ (Overhead Line Equipment, more often "OHLE") work on the Slow lines between Copenhagen and Gasworks Tunnels was completed in time; although some work was cut from the programme on Boxing Day night to ensure Thameslink was ready for energisation and testing of the OLE Saturday morning

[TaplowGreen]

The Kings Cross overrun is due to a major S & C (switches & crossing) renewal at Hollow Way Road, the work is on the UP side between (the UP Fast and UP Slow) are on the same side of the permanent way on the ECML^▸ (East Coast Main Line) north of Copenhagen Tunnel, work involved deep dig

....and the Paddington overrun, unannounced until this morning (at least those heading North from Kings X had some warning) - due to utter incompetence from what I am told......what a disgrace.

[Super Guard]

The Kings Cross overrun is due to a major S & C (switches & crossing) renewal at Hollow Way Road, the work is on the UP side between (the UP Fast and UP Slow) are on the same side of the permanent way on the ECML^▸ (East Coast Main Line) north of Copenhagen Tunnel, work involved deep dig

....and the Paddington overrun, unannounced until this morning (at least those heading North from Kings X had some warning) - due to utter incompetence from what I am told......what a disgrace.

Source?

[TaplowGreen]

The Kings Cross overrun is due to a major S & C (switches & crossing) renewal at Hollow Way Road, the work is on the UP side between (the UP Fast and UP Slow) are on the same side of the permanent way on the ECML^▸ (East Coast Main Line) north of Copenhagen Tunnel, work involved deep dig

....and the Paddington overrun, unannounced until this morning (at least those heading North from Kings X had some warning) - due to utter incompetence from what I am told......what a disgrace.

Source?

Impeccable.

[IndustryInsider]

You're unable to verify it then?

[TaplowGreen]

You're unable to verify it then?

Verified by someone very close to the situation, whose details I am not going to share here for obvious reasons.......whether you choose to accept that of course is entirely up to you, but in the context of the overall chaotic situation at Paddington on Saturday I'm sure others will draw their own conclusions.

[IndustryInsider]

Ok, well thanks for giving a little more clarification.

Rumours are always rife in situations such as those, so a reliable source of, say, a member of staff in one of the control offices who was liaising with Network Rail (or one from Network Rail liaising with the contractor) would indeed be trustworthy, but I might not be quite so confident in other sources.

Either way, ''utter incompetence" will obviously mean that a clear source of the problem will be evident and as such there will be no excuse for appropriate sanctions not being taken.

[Electric train]

Ok, well thanks for giving a little more clarification.

Rumours are always rife in situations such as those, so a reliable source of, say, a member of staff in one of the control offices who was liaising with Network Rail (or one from Network Rail liaising with the contractor) would indeed be trustworthy, but I might not be quite so confident in other sources.

Either way, ''utter incompetence" will obviously mean that a clear source of the problem will be evident and as such there will be no excuse for appropriate sanctions not being taken.

I agree.  Often to the person leaning on a shovel by the side of the track or the person with a flag and whistle on a platform i.e. the guys on the ground don't see all the cross company communications at Route level, sometimes information is not cascaded effectively to person leaning on a shovel by the side of the track or the person with a flag and whistle on a platform

[TaplowGreen]

Ok, well thanks for giving a little more clarification.

Rumours are always rife in situations such as those, so a reliable source of, say, a member of staff in one of the control offices who was liaising with Network Rail (or one from Network Rail liaising with the contractor) would indeed be trustworthy, but I might not be quite so confident in other sources.

Either way, ''utter incompetence" will obviously mean that a clear source of the problem will be evident and as such there will be no excuse for appropriate sanctions not being taken.

I agree.  Often to the person leaning on a shovel by the side of the track or the person with a flag and whistle on a platform i.e. the guys on the ground don't see all the cross company communications at Route level, sometimes information is not cascaded effectively to person leaning on a shovel by the side of the track or the person with a flag and whistle on a platform

Bloke with shovel was not my source, but to paraphrase Electric Train lets just say "information was not cascaded effectively" and leave it at that......it's not a new problem for FGW^▸ (First Great Western), but one that is within their control and needs addressing.

[IndustryInsider]

I've taken a look at the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) control log and it runs into several pages listing how the problem developed.  'Utter incompetence 'is probably a little strong, but as the situation developed in the early hours it did appear that several work-around solutions to several outstanding issues with the possessions promised to, and then by, Network Rail simply didn't happen - for a variety of reasons.

That led to several plans and changes of plan being adopted by FGW to try and get the best possible outcome for their passengers.  Because various things were promised I can see how the controllers got pretty exasperated with having to change their plans several times. Not sure that it was a case of FGW not providing the information, more that they were promised things that didn't happen and in the end it looks like they were very wary of trusting anything that was said!

Hopefully a full enquiry (along with the same for the far more disruptive Kings Cross situation) will cause the situation to improve in the future, though on the face of it I think both passengers and staff will believe it when they see it!  A bad Christmas for the integrity and image of the railway industry.

[broadgage]

I can understand the arguments either way regarding trains on boxing day, but IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion), a first step might be to provide a reliable service on the day AFTER boxing day !

[Timmer]

I can understand the arguments either way regarding trains on boxing day, but IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion), a first step might be to provide a reliable service on the day AFTER boxing day !

Before they can start to think about running services on Boxing Day, TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) need to sort out the annual 'cancelled due to a lack of train crew' that plagues the network every year between Christmas and New Year. There were some long distance casualties on the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) network yesterday that would have caused inconvenience and overcrowding on those services that did run.

[ChrisB]

Difficult....unions would make any form of discipline very hard to implement where it was deemed necessary. Ditto any changes to rest-day working, where as I understand it, staff can easily change their minds without penalty

[IndustryInsider]

Ditto any changes to rest-day working, where as I understand it, staff can easily change their minds without penalty

That's not quite the case.  The precise rules vary from depot to depot, but by and large if you volunteer to work a rest day you can't then withdraw that application after the roster has been published if you've been booked out - usually about 5 days in advance, so there should be no problem in that respect.

Like I said in a previous post, if depots trained their staff on the routes and traction and filled some more of the vacancies that exist there would be little need for rest day working for much of the year and any shortfalls over Christmas and New Year (along with high summer school holidays) wouldn't exist.  At least the vacancy situation should improve over the coming months though as more of the trainee drivers pass out.