Loco hauled

[whole diary]

[G.Uard]

No 'new' stock at all for FGW^▸ (First Great Western) this winter, so no more 150/1s, three car or otherwise.  Shortfall to  be made up by splitting the hybrid 158s and reverting to 2 car operation.  I am told FGW can do  this because this was the level of service quoted when they took the franchise.  I must underline that this is only word of mouth and I have not seen anything concrete.  However, source is unimpeachable.

Would FGW be able to revert back to a 2 car operation on the Cardiff-Portsmouth line despite it being part of the service plan in the original franchise because of the remedial plan announced back in February committing FGW to operating 3 car trains until summer 2011. See below link:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/passenger/franchises/improveperffgw

Failure to deliver these new commitments would be a default of the franchise agreement which could lead to the Government terminating First Great Western's franchise.

I read that as being that FGW cannot go back on the agreement to operate 3 car 158s on the Cardiff-Portsmouth line so cuts in capacity would have to be made elsewhere if FGW are not able to source rolling stock to replace the 3 150s going back to ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) in May as Vacman has reported. I don't think that would happen and we would possibly see more loco hauled activity operating West services next summer until the LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise) 150s arrive.

quite correct they would be in breach of the franchise agreement if 3 cars were split again.

they cannot split them until 2011 at earliest hence why we are having loco hauled stuff.

i have also seen 158952 and 953 have had there added on cars changed from 748 vehicles to 745 vehicles so it looks like we are a 2 car short for now.i would suspect 748 needs some time based heavy maintenance work doing,anyone know what is being done to it?

I do hope you are right and I'm sure you are, my source is only a minor deity, not the big noise. But...by reading between the lines, could the use of summer be a clue as to just when these trains will be 3 car.  Hopefully in winter too of course.


In continuing the mischief theme, consider... what is to stop 2 car 158s being stretched with 153's, thus giving a more flexible 3 car formation? it couldn't happen...could it?

[Chris from Nailsea]

From my reading of the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) 'Remedial Plan Notice' for FGW^▸ (First Great Western) (available at http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/passenger/franchises/improveperffgw), it's clear that any reduction in the provision of three-car 158s would equate to a breach of the franchise agreement:

Additional trains on the Cardiff-Portsmouth route ^ from summer 2008 until summer 2011 every through train will have an additional carriage to provide extra capacity. This will increase trains from 2 carriages to 3, an aggregate increase of 40% capacity. This will mitigate the crowding on one of First Great Western^s most popular routes, which runs through Bristol.

Failure to deliver these new commitments would be a default of the franchise agreement which could lead to the Government terminating First Great Western's franchise.

So it won't happen.  Will it?   

[vacman]

No 'new' stock at all for FGW^▸ (First Great Western) this winter, so no more 150/1s, three car or otherwise.  Shortfall to  be made up by splitting the hybrid 158s and reverting to 2 car operation.  I am told FGW can do  this because this was the level of service quoted when they took the franchise.  I must underline that this is only word of mouth and I have not seen anything concrete.  However, source is unimpeachable.

Would FGW be able to revert back to a 2 car operation on the Cardiff-Portsmouth line despite it being part of the service plan in the original franchise because of the remedial plan announced back in February committing FGW to operating 3 car trains until summer 2011. See below link:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/passenger/franchises/improveperffgw

Failure to deliver these new commitments would be a default of the franchise agreement which could lead to the Government terminating First Great Western's franchise.

I read that as being that FGW cannot go back on the agreement to operate 3 car 158s on the Cardiff-Portsmouth line so cuts in capacity would have to be made elsewhere if FGW are not able to source rolling stock to replace the 3 150s going back to ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) in May as Vacman has reported. I don't think that would happen and we would possibly see more loco hauled activity operating West services next summer until the LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise) 150s arrive.

quite correct they would be in breach of the franchise agreement if 3 cars were split again.

they cannot split them until 2011 at earliest hence why we are having loco hauled stuff.

i have also seen 158952 and 953 have had there added on cars changed from 748 vehicles to 745 vehicles so it looks like we are a 2 car short for now.i would suspect 748 needs some time based heavy maintenance work doing,anyone know what is being done to it?

I do hope you are right and I'm sure you are, my source is only a minor deity, not the big noise. But...by reading between the lines, could the use of summer be a clue as to just when these trains will be 3 car.  Hopefully in winter too of course.


In continuing the mischief theme, consider... what is to stop 2 car 158s being stretched with 153's, thus giving a more flexible 3 car formation? it couldn't happen...could it?

153's aren't allowed to Portsmouth so that rules that idea out.

[grahame]

Failure to deliver these new commitments would be a default of the franchise agreement which could lead to the Government terminating First Great Western's franchise.

So it won't happen.  Will it?   

Hmmm ... part of the franchise as awarded (the commitment) was that FGW^▸ (First Great Western) would provide a train from West Wiltshire (Westbury, Trowbridge, Melksham) to arrive in Swindon between 8 and 8:30 in the morning.   However, this was mysteriously changed by what looks rather like collusion between the Dft and FGW, so I wouldn't bet on the three car commitment actually staying ... especially if removing it could get a few more labour votes in Wales - just like that earlier change was made to help the seat of the labour MP^▸ (Member of Parliament) in the Stroud Valley

[G.Uard]

In continuing the mischief theme, consider... what is to stop 2 car 158s being stretched with 153's, thus giving a more flexible 3 car formation? it couldn't happen...could it?

153's aren't allowed to Portsmouth so that rules that idea out.

Spoilsport!   We do have a 153 diagrammed run which goes to Southampton though

[The SprinterMeister]

From my reading of the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) 'Remedial Plan Notice' for FGW^▸ (First Great Western) (available at http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/passenger/franchises/improveperffgw), it's clear that any reduction in the provision of three-car 158s would equate to a breach of the franchise agreement:

Additional trains on the Cardiff-Portsmouth route ^ from summer 2008 until summer 2011 every through train will have an additional carriage to provide extra capacity. This will increase trains from 2 carriages to 3, an aggregate increase of 40% capacity. This will mitigate the crowding on one of First Great Western^s most popular routes, which runs through Bristol.

Failure to deliver these new commitments would be a default of the franchise agreement which could lead to the Government terminating First Great Western's franchise.

So it won't happen.  Will it?   

I suppose it all rather depends on whether FGW or DFT^▸ (Department for Transport) have perfected the knack of magic-ing operational 15x units out of thin air. Always going to be problems if you base your service delivery on subleased rolling stock as opposed to stock permanently allocated to the franchise.

Whoever sent 8 x 150/2's to Grumbly Gasworks Railways in December 2006 wants shooting IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion).

[Timmer]

Whoever sent 8 x 150/2's to Grumbly Gasworks Railways in December 2006 wants shooting IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion).

DaFT^» (Department for Transport - critical sounding abbreviation I discourage - about) decision?

[John R]

Whoever sent 8 x 150/2's to Grumbly Gasworks Railways in December 2006 wants shooting IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion).

Having travelled on the so called Grumbly Gasworks' latest railway yesterday, both the 2x Class 150 I was on coming down the valley, and the similarly formed preceding service which we passed on our way up, were both full and standing  long before they got to Rogerstone.

Now admittedly traffic flows were higher than usual yesterday, but the units are certainly being put to good use in Wales, judging by the well publicised traffic figures for the Ebbw Vale line.   

 

[r james]

Yeah, I have heard the Ebbw Vale line is very sucessfull at the moment.  Possibly more so than the Vale of glamorgan line?

Can 6 car units run on those services though? 

[John R]

No, only 4 car on EV. Not sure about Vale of G.

[DanielP]

Some services on the VoG are four car every day, but are usually 2x pacer units (e.g. the 17:41 from Cardiff to Bridgend- this is usually pretty full) rather than sprinters. 2 car trains are most likely to be Sprinters. Ebbw vale is usually two car Sprinters (rarely pacers), though are often bolstered to 4 coaches at the week end. Generally, Arriva's rostering is impressively rock solid around Cardiff- you will get the same combination running at the same time each day, rather than having whatever scrapings are lying around Canton at any given time. I know that the Vale of Glamorgan trains do a "W pattern"- which includes running from Barry Island to Methyr T, then back through Cardiff to Bridgend via Rhoose, then back up to Abedare. Sometimes trains can be short formed, but they usually put this right at the first opportunity as the train passes through Cardiff. The trains most prone to short forming seem to be trains heading up the valleys between five and six: this is when the most units are in use, so it is less likely that short formings can be corrected. Even with things relatively settled, it can still be pretty crowded. it's still a huge improvement on how things were, say five years ago. Still, people will actually invest ^ in railways in Wales.

Platforms have been adjusted so that six car trains can run from Treherbert to Cardiff, Rhymney Valley to Cardiff and Penarth- however, there are not enough trains to run 6 car trains yet. All other services can manage at least four car, except for Maesteg (four car platform extensions in progress) and possibly the City Line.

I hope some common sense prevails and FGW^▸ (First Great Western) actually get the trains to meet demand- however, I do think that maybe it is time to let go of the through trains to Brighton. I can remember Southampton to Portsmouth etc being a total trial in a clapped out Hampshire Unit- however, I was amazed at the quality of the Southern Electrostars now on the route. Surely it would not be a big ask to get people to change at Southampton + tweak the lecky service accordingly? I guess it would even be a cross platform interchange, so not too bad for those with lugage.

Daniel

[Btline]

Axing services to Brighton would also improve reliability and service flexibility/ service recovery.

Then again, I am sure the people of Worcester would be disappointed to lose the 6 hour direct service to Brighton... </sarcasm>

[tramway]

Not sure how concrete this is:

From December 15th

0732 TAU^» (Taunton - next trains) - BPW^» (Bristol Parkway - next trains)
0913 BPW - TAU
1102 TAU - CDF^» (Cardiff - next trains)
1400 CDF - TAU
1612 TAU - CDF
1900 CDF - TAU

ECS^▸ (Empty Coaching Stock) from/to Barton Hill with TnT 67s & Mk 2s

Do Rail mag get their info from here one wonders, this diagramme is in todays edition.

[vacman]

right guys, some clarity on some issues, the ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) sets are NOT yet destined to go back to ATW, there are no plans at present, there is a possibilty that 2 sets MAY return to ATW in May but not yet decided, 158's are staying as 3 cars NO MATTER WHAT! I know a few more bits and pieces but I really can't post them because if they get into the public domain then it could affect the outcome but put it this way big plans are afoot for the better at FGW^▸ (First Great Western)!

[John R]

Well one thing I've learnt is that Vacman is pretty reliable in terms of such knowledge. So here's hoping.....