REDOUBLING GETS THE GO AHEAD FROM RAIL REGULATOR

[whole diary]

[IndustryInsider]

Out of interest: How far short of Finstock are they re-doubling?

To a point about 1/2 a mile to the west of the station, on straight track.

Just to update my own post. I heard from an NR^» (Network Rail - home page) employee that the track is being singled a little nearer to Charlbury than I thought. Well, right after Charlbury station in fact as it will be single by the bridge carrying the private road that leads to Cornbury Park Estate. Apparently this is due to clearances on this bridge (which is wide but very low) means the track would need lowering over two feet to put two lines in. Whether this is actually the case or just a rumour remains to be seen.

[eightf48544]

One question I don't think has been asked is the redoubling being planned to allow future electrification?

In particular it would seem sensible to immunise any new lineside signalling euipment to allow it work with the wires.

The mention of the low bridge above worries me, plus our incredible ability to spoil the ship for a "ha'peth of tar".

Now I know you're going to say electrification is too far ahead, but don't forget signalling equipment has a life of 40 years or more. In fact some manual signalling is probably getting on for a 100 years old, it's only the  relays in the 60s MAS schemes that are getting life expired. Solid state ought to last longer, if not it's easy and cheap to replace.

But even if the siganalling is replaced on electrification and who knows ERTMS^▸ (European Rail Traffic Management System.) level 3 might be working by then and available straight from the box at competitive prices. The infrastructure changes might as well be to electrification standards it's not going to cost any more. Now is good time to start, the construction industry is desparate for contracts so Networkrail should be able to screw them down to a price on any contract negotiation.

[Don]

One question I don't think has been asked is the redoubling being planned to allow future electrification?

Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha........

I bet they won't even design the signalling to take account of the new signalling centre at Didcot. I gather that the signalling for Oxford and this line is supposed to transfer to there at some stage around 2015

[Btline]

It will take decades for the electrification beyond Maidenhead to be PLANNED.

As for Cotswold line, probably centuries (at the rate they are going).

[Don]

Wrong forum I guess, But there are a lot of other electrifications that I would consider before electrifying Maidenhead & beyond.

I would start with routes that already run in-part under the wires - Off the top of my head - Cross Country: West of England to North West for instance, followed by South-Coast to North West and then to North East.

This would electrify Reading to Birmingham and Bristol to Penzance which would later make the case for Paddington to Penzance look better. 

But the world and his dog have speculated about this since the 1970s and we still have a department for (Road) transport who don't want to even consider the 60 or so passenger and freight infill suggestions that the TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company), FOCs^▸ (Freight Operating Company) and Network Rail have suggested - or for that matter High Speed Kibe No.2 so I guess the Cotswold line will be re-doubled using the least amount of money, and if that means re-doing the whole thing again later, then so be it.

[Btline]

The Department for Tarmac won't look at any of those suggestions.

And in general, look at the 125 mph cop out on the WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line). All those millions will have to be spent again to get 140 or 155 mph running.

We have had tilting and 125 mph trains since the 70s! What are the celebrations about?

[John R]

Well 3 trains ph to Manchester, with a headline journey of under 2 hrs,  and 3tph to Birmingham with a headline journey time of 1hr 12 mins. Also weekday frequencies and journey times after lunchtime on Sunday.

Quite a lot then.  Those of us in the West Country can only look on in envy.

[Don]

Well 3 trains ph to Manchester, with a headline journey of under 2 hrs,  and 3tph to Birmingham with a headline journey time of 1hr 12 mins. Also weekday frequencies and journey times after lunchtime on Sunday.

Actually, thinking about it, this could, with the right marketing, be quite excellent for the railways. Virgin just might destroy the airline traffic from these routes which could catalyse extra spending on the...... Oh God, I've drifted off into fantasy land again.

[Ollie]

Well 3 trains ph to Manchester, with a headline journey of under 2 hrs,  and 3tph to Birmingham with a headline journey time of 1hr 12 mins. Also weekday frequencies and journey times after lunchtime on Sunday.

Actually, thinking about it, this could, with the right marketing, be quite excellent for the railways. Virgin just might destroy the airline traffic from these routes which could catalyse extra spending on the...... Oh God, I've drifted off into fantasy land again.

Have you been forgetting your pills again? 

[eightf48544]

Well 3 trains ph to Manchester, with a headline journey of under 2 hrs,  and 3tph to Birmingham with a headline journey time of 1hr 12 mins. Also weekday frequencies and journey times after lunchtime on Sunday.

Actually, thinking about it, this could, with the right marketing, be quite excellent for the railways. Virgin just might destroy the airline traffic from these routes which could catalyse extra spending on the...... Oh God, I've drifted off into fantasy land again.

Have you been forgetting your pills again? 

Judging from from some strange forgetfullness (not annoucing things) on the part of the government some Ministers seem to be  forgetting to take their airline pills.

I agree the Cotswold line will be last to be electrified but that still doesn't mean the infrastructure upgrades at least could be done to electrification standards even if the signalling isn't .

Where's my pills?

[willc]

Assorted points I feel worthy of a response:

1. The overbridge south of Charlbury is a particularly awkward one, as it carries the Cornbury Park estate approach road, which is dropping down into the valley at this point, so it slopes from one side to the other over the railway. As for bridges generally, were the line to be electrified, then there are a great many that would have to be rebuilt - just as on any British railway electrification scheme. Recent new bridges, eg Moreton's footbridge, all have enough clearance designed in and BR^▸ (British Rail(ways)) rebuilt a bridge near Kingham a while back, which was reprofiled, so should pose no problems.

2. Signalling. The redoubling budget is going to be tight and I doubt there will be much money to spare for lots of new signal equipment anyway, except perhaps at Evesham station if the box there closes. If Moreton box stays, then so do the semaphores in the station. A full-blown resignalling scheme is likely to be part of the Oxford project - until then the mix of semaphores (manual and electric) and assorted existing colour lights seems likely to soldier on, so immunisation looks like an unnecessary luxury at this stage.

3. Electrification. I'm sure the Network Rail staff who have spent most of this year developing electrification plans would be surprised to know they haven't done anything about going beyond Maidenhead.

The likely programme looks something like Midland Main Line first (releases lots of modern diesels), then GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) (replace life-expired HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train)), then XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) to link lots of things up (and free more diesel with some miles left in them), then other routes.

And how can anyone can say DafT isn't considering electrification when ministers have (for the first time I can ever remember) actually made positive noises about it this year? I don't know where you've been recently.

Of course the Cotswold Line will be well down the queue, but if you've got wires to Oxford and wires past Worcester on the XC route, then it makes sense - especially if it provides the opportunity to get diesels out of Paddington and avoid bustitution every time there's engineering work between Oxford and Leamington, by diverting XC services.

[IndustryInsider]

2. Signalling. The redoubling budget is going to be tight and I doubt there will be much money to spare for lots of new signal equipment anyway, except perhaps at Evesham station if the box there closes. If Moreton box stays, then so do the semaphores in the station. A full-blown resignalling scheme is likely to be part of the Oxford project - until then the mix of semaphores (manual and electric) and assorted existing colour lights seems likely to soldier on, so immunisation looks like an unnecessary luxury at this stage.

Again, it's only hearsay, but I have heard talk that a couple of IBH^▸ (Intermediate Block Home - signal to break a long block) (Intermediate Block Home) signals will be installed as part of the re-doubling scheme. They are basically designed for long stretches of Absolute Block signalled line with large gaps between the signalboxes. They are controlled by the signalbox in rear of the IBH signal and would be colour-light of a similar nature to the current signals for the level crossings on the route, i.e. 2-aspect.

[grahame]

IBH^▸ (Intermediate Block Home - signal to break a long block) (Intermediate Block Home)

Added to Acronym list at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/acronyms.html  ... goodness, there are so many!

[IndustryInsider]

IBH^▸ (Intermediate Block Home - signal to break a long block) (Intermediate Block Home)

Added to Acronym list at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/acronyms.html  ... goodness, there are so many!

At least you're not charged with doing a medical acronyms list, Graham. IBH would then stand for Inclusion Body Hepatitis!

[IanL]

Out of interest: How far short of Finstock are they re-doubling?

To a point about 1/2 a mile to the west of the station, on straight track.

Just to update my own post. I heard from an NR^» (Network Rail - home page) employee that the track is being singled a little nearer to Charlbury than I thought. Well, right after Charlbury station in fact as it will be single by the bridge carrying the private road that leads to Cornbury Park Estate. Apparently this is due to clearances on this bridge (which is wide but very low) means the track would need lowering over two feet to put two lines in. Whether this is actually the case or just a rumour remains to be seen.

That agrees with the statement made at the Charlbury meeting the day this was announced.....1/2 mile east of Charlbury, ie the new double line would revert to a single almost within sight of Charlbury station and well short of the Cornbury access road bridge.