Train GraphicClick on the map to explore geographics
 
I need help
FAQ
Emergency
About .
Travel & transport from BBC stories as at 06:15 08 Jan 2025
 
- Boy, 14, stabbed to death on London bus
Read about the forum [here].
Register [here] - it's free.
What do I gain from registering? [here]
 today - Steam loco restoration - IRTE
tomorrow - Bath Railway Society
24/01/25 - Westbury Station reopens
24/01/25 - LTP4 Wilts / Consultation end

On this day
8th Jan (1991)
Cannon Street buffer stop collision (link)

Train RunningCancelled
05:57 Liskeard to Looe
06:00 Windsor & Eton Central to Slough
06:10 Slough to Windsor & Eton Central
06:20 Windsor & Eton Central to Slough
06:30 Looe to Liskeard
06:40 Windsor & Eton Central to Slough
07:20 Liskeard to Looe
07:54 Looe to Liskeard
Short Run
04:50 Fratton to Salisbury
05:59 Gatwick Airport to Reading
08:35 Plymouth to London Paddington
Abbreviation pageAcronymns and abbreviations
Stn ComparatorStation Comparator
Rail newsNews Now - live rail news feed
Site Style 1 2 3 4
Next departures • Bristol Temple MeadsBath SpaChippenhamSwindonDidcot ParkwayReadingLondon PaddingtonMelksham
Exeter St DavidsTauntonWestburyTrowbridgeBristol ParkwayCardiff CentralOxfordCheltenham SpaBirmingham New Street
January 08, 2025, 06:20:40 *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Forgotten your username or password? - get a reminder
Most recently liked subjects
[192] Coastal walks - station to station
[169] 'Railway 200' events and commemorations 2025
[74] Fatal Oxfordshire train crash remembered 150 years on
[67] Warnings of snow, wind and rain across the UK for New Year
[45] Oxford station - facilities, improvements, parking, incidents ...
[34] Senior Railcard - ongoing issues, merged posts
 
News: the Great Western Coffee Shop ... keeping you up to date with travel around the South West
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: 1 ... 89 90 [91] 92 93 ... 112
  Print  
Author Topic: Cotswold Line redoubling: 2008 - 2011  (Read 706803 times)
willc
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2330


View Profile
« Reply #1350 on: July 23, 2011, 18:40:30 »

Bullhead rail has likely been used in place of the point, for the time being, because, as electric train says, mixing in bits of flat-bottom rail (all of 30ft or so) in the middle of a load of bullhead doesn't make much makes sense when it's all going to be lifted and replaced shortly anyway.

In addition to the lorry trailer with the bullhead track panels at Moreton, there is another loaded with flat-bottom rails and new timber sleepers which look like they are for some of the new pointwork.

Why is it surprising to see steel sleepers on the branch line? The track on that bit of line at Honeybourne will be used by trains travelling at low speed entering and leaving the branch and sidings and will last for many years - no need to gold-plate it, just adopt the most cost-effective solution to each aspect of the job, just like using recycled track lifted from Chipping Campden tunnel two years ago to provide the sidings. Someone within Network Rail may be able to explain why concrete got the nod for the main line rather than the steel used for recent renewals - probably just something as basic as the price was right compared with steel.

Quote
Most of the Cotswold Line was still laid with Bullhead track until the 1980's through neglect then BR (British Rail(ways)) finally started to replace it.

Through neglect? Not exactly. The track still had useful life left in it until early 1980s - then a lot of it reached the end of the line at much the same time, at a point when BR was very short of money, hence the resulting threat to end loco-hauled services to reduce wear and tear. Renewals, particularly through Oxfordshire, were eventually funded.

Other bits of bullhead on the line hadn't worn out then and lasted past 2000. And flat-bottomed rails (on timber sleepers) of only slightly more recent vintage than the mid-1950s bullhead rails at Moreton are still in use around Evenlode and in Honeybourne station.

Some pictures taken at Honeybourne and Moreton-in-Marsh today are online at http://www.flickr.com/photos/willc2009/
Logged
paul7575
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 5335


View Profile
« Reply #1351 on: July 23, 2011, 18:50:25 »

There is (or was at least a few months ago) 'new' bullhead rail lying between the tracks at Salisbury for use during re-railing.  If the existing sleepers and chairs are still not life expired the rail is replaced.

To suggest that any bullhead rail remaining in use is down to 'neglect' is ridiculous. Once you start looking for it off the primary routes it is all over the place...

PS - willc's photo here http://www.flickr.com/photos/willc2009/5966529165/in/photostream shows that bullhead for new use is still being made...  Smiley

Paul
« Last Edit: July 23, 2011, 19:04:23 by paul7755 » Logged
willc
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2330


View Profile
« Reply #1352 on: July 23, 2011, 20:32:13 »

Paul,

No, it doesn't show new use of bullhead track. Those chairs on the two outer sleepers are for flat-bottomed rail. This section will probably be used during the track renewal, where two pieces of long-welded rail meet - see http://www.railway-technical.com/Expansion-Joint.jpg. The old siding underneath in my picture has bullhead rail and chairs, which look quite different.



Logged
paul7575
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 5335


View Profile
« Reply #1353 on: July 23, 2011, 20:46:58 »

No, not the running rails,  Roll Eyes  the two rail sections on their side in the middle, that hold the four sleepers together, are cut from bull head rail.  It's a standard method, it's used on breathers assembled on concrete sleepers as well.

Paul
« Last Edit: July 23, 2011, 20:53:19 by paul7755 » Logged
willc
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2330


View Profile
« Reply #1354 on: July 23, 2011, 23:58:27 »

Perhaps, in the context, you might have given a clear explanation of what you meant in the first place.
Logged
Not from Brighton
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 108


View Profile
« Reply #1355 on: July 24, 2011, 00:00:29 »

Thank you all for answering my questions. Interesting stuff.
Logged
Moreton134
Full Member
***
Posts: 30


View Profile
« Reply #1356 on: July 24, 2011, 00:25:32 »

To suggest that any bullhead rail remaining in use is down to 'neglect' is ridiculous. Once you start looking for it off the primary routes it is all over the place...

Ok I possibly used the wrong word when I stated 'neglect', as I wasn't refering to all bullhead track around the country still used on secondary routes.  The Cotswold Line is considered a primary route but has had mixed fortunes as described below.

The line has seen very little investment and infrastructure improvements compared to other main lines in the area and until recently living in a 1960's timewarp.  During the late 70's early 80's period the route was considered secondary with half the level of todays service and extremely low passenger numbers (off-peak), an idea was even proposed to close the line as a through route and make two branches Evesham to Worcester and Moreton to Oxford possibly an attempt by BR (British Rail(ways)) to try and close the line in the long term which would be unthinkable today.    As willc stated through loco hauled trains were drastically cut to reduce wear and tear of the track. 

Track has gradually been renewed.   Through growth possibly due to commuting the Cotswold line has managed to turn its ill fortune, it's great to see the route which I grew up by finally receiving the modernisation improvements it deserves.
Logged
willc
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2330


View Profile
« Reply #1357 on: July 24, 2011, 00:57:03 »

First, sort of, freight train on the southern end of the line for some time ran on Monday, empty scrap wagons from store at Long Marston to Dagenham, though the train had to go all the way to Worcester for the loco run round to be at the right end to head south. Couple of pictures here http://www.petertandy.co.uk/Recentpics.html

Quote
The Cotswold Line is considered a primary route

It wasn't even that under the GWR (Great Western Railway), Castles not Kings were used, and it's not exactly front-rank InterCity territory to this day, given the size of the places it serves - many off-peak trains aren't exactly rammed to the doors now - though its fortunes have obviously improved greatly in recent times.

And, to go right back to the beginning of the redoubling project, the aim was nothing to do with the supposed status of the line, what it deserved, etc... it was to deal with the shockingly bad levels of performance - in the low 60s per cent overall punctuality in early 2008, with some individual trains much worse than that. That there are other benefits for the route as a result is nice but they were never at the heart of what drove the process.

And it's very easy to pillory BR (British Rail(ways)), but at the time it was making service cuts and singling the line, the area it serves was a rather different place - long-haul commuters were rare beasts and telephone-number property prices not an issue. They wrung every last minute of life out of that track and had to, given the state of the nation's finances in the late 1970s and early 1980s.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 01:02:53 by willc » Logged
Electric train
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 4495


The future is 25000 Volts AC 750V DC has its place


View Profile
« Reply #1358 on: July 24, 2011, 08:27:52 »

And, to go right back to the beginning of the redoubling project, the aim was nothing to do with the supposed status of the line, what it deserved, etc... it was to deal with the shockingly bad levels of performance - in the low 60s per cent overall punctuality in early 2008, with some individual trains much worse than that. That there are other benefits for the route as a result is nice but they were never at the heart of what drove the process.

The performance of the Cotswold line was also having a knock on effects on the performance of the rest of the GW (Great Western) mainline

And it's very easy to pillory BR (British Rail(ways)), but at the time it was making service cuts and singling the line, the area it serves was a rather different place - long-haul commuters were rare beasts and telephone-number property prices not an issue. They wrung every last minute of life out of that track and had to, given the state of the nation's finances in the late 1970s and early 1980s.
The UK (United Kingdom) rail network in the 70's, 80's and even into the 90's was seen by the UK Government (all parties) as being in terminal decline, this decline was the drive to the privatisation process, it is only in the last 5 to 8 years that rail travel has been expanding last year 7% growth
Logged

Starship just experienced what we call a rapid unscheduled disassembly, or a RUD, during ascent,”
Nottage_Halt
Jr. Member
**
Posts: 23


View Profile Email
« Reply #1359 on: July 24, 2011, 12:59:08 »


Quote
The Cotswold Line is considered a primary route

It wasn't even that under the GWR (Great Western Railway), Castles not Kings were used,


Oh yes Castles were!  Several were allocated to Worcester over the years.  As late as 1964 Honeybourne bank was the site of speed trials where a number of the class were used to test which ones should be used on the famous high speed finale enthusiast tours to the westcountry.  And in the late 1930s the famous Cecil J Allen published records in The Railway Magazine of a number of very high speed runs behind 5063 Earl Baldwin, 5049 Earl of Plymouth and 4086 Builth Castle down Honeybourne bank at over a ton.

Nick
Logged
willc
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2330


View Profile
« Reply #1360 on: July 25, 2011, 00:01:14 »

That would be Chipping Campden bank.

Quote
The UK (United Kingdom) rail network in the 70's, 80's and even into the 90's was seen by the UK Government (all parties) as being in terminal decline, this decline was the drive to the privatisation process, it is only in the last 5 to 8 years that rail travel has been expanding last year 7% growth

I don't really want to get into this debate again in this thread but BR (British Rail(ways)) experienced substantial growth in the late 1980s and early 1990s and was allowed to invest in lots of new rolling stock, ECML (East Coast Main Line) electrification and Thameslink among other things, even under railway-hating Mrs T. Getting the railway's finances off the government balance sheet was a very powerful motivating factor in privatisation and is why to this day we have to pretend that Network Rail isn't really a state-owned business.

Some pictures taken today at Chipping Campden and Blockley showing progress on level crossing changes and installation of posts for new LED signals now online at http://www.flickr.com/photos/willc2009/
Logged
willc
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2330


View Profile
« Reply #1361 on: July 25, 2011, 23:18:37 »

The plot thickens. Looks like as well as the little island of semaphore signals, Moreton-in-Marsh is to have a little island of new bullhead track around its pointwork. More lorries had appeared this evening loaded with track panels and rails and among them were point sections for the crossover, which are constructed with bullhead rails. They were being stacked up next to the Network Rail depot. Some pictures at http://www.flickr.com/photos/willc2009/

A couple of big Xs have been marked on the cabin housing the single-line token machine at the north end of platform 1 at Moreton-in-Marsh, indicating it is to be removed next month.
Logged
IndustryInsider
Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 10361


View Profile
« Reply #1362 on: July 26, 2011, 00:10:41 »

With regard to bullhead track, we don't want to run the risk of bringing Moreton-In-Marsh into the 21st century too quickly do we?  Getting rid of the token machine is quite enough of a technological march forward for this decade.   Tongue
Logged

To view my GWML (Great Western Main Line) Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/
Electric train
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 4495


The future is 25000 Volts AC 750V DC has its place


View Profile
« Reply #1363 on: July 26, 2011, 07:58:43 »

With regard to bullhead track, we don't want to run the risk of bringing Moreton-In-Marsh into the 21st century too quickly do we?  Getting rid of the token machine is quite enough of a technological march forward for this decade.   Tongue

The Marlow Branch is still bullhead rail and timber sleepers with token block between Maidenhead and Bourne End.  NR» (Network Rail - home page) have been re-railing and re-sleepering the line admittedly with 120' rail and not 60' not sure how long the token will remain when Slough (Old) Panel area gets resignalled
Logged

Starship just experienced what we call a rapid unscheduled disassembly, or a RUD, during ascent,”
willc
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2330


View Profile
« Reply #1364 on: July 28, 2011, 23:01:22 »

Assembly of the new crossover has begun in the station car park at Moreton-in-Marsh. The new LED down distant signal for Moreton-in-Marsh (ie for Worcester-bound trains) is being installed slightly further south than the existing signal. I think a new signal may also be going in for up trains just north of Moreton as there seems to be S&T (Signalling and Telegraph) activity just out of sight round the curve but I haven't had a chance to go into the field up there to have a look. A new power supply cabinet has been installed in a cage above the tracks alongside the London Road bridge (the one south of the station).

Like the cabin housing the token machine on platform 1, the older electrical cabinets around Moreton also have Xs showing they are to be removed marked on them.

Picture of the point now at http://www.flickr.com/photos/willc2009/

There is an article about the token signalling, mainly focused on arrangements at the Worcester/Norton Junction end of the line, in the current issue of Rail magazine.
Logged
Do you have something you would like to add to this thread, or would you like to raise a new question at the Coffee Shop? Please [register] (it is free) if you have not done so before, or login (at the top of this page) if you already have an account - we would love to read what you have to say!

You can find out more about how this forum works [here] - that will link you to a copy of the forum agreement that you can read before you join, and tell you very much more about how we operate. We are an independent forum, provided and run by customers of Great Western Railway, for customers of Great Western Railway and we welcome railway professionals as members too, in either a personal or official capacity. Views expressed in posts are not necessarily the views of the operators of the forum.

As well as posting messages onto existing threads, and starting new subjects, members can communicate with each other through personal messages if they wish. And once members have made a certain number of posts, they will automatically be admitted to the "frequent posters club", where subjects not-for-public-domain are discussed; anything from the occasional rant to meetups we may be having ...

 
Pages: 1 ... 89 90 [91] 92 93 ... 112
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.2 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
This forum is provided by customers of Great Western Railway (formerly First Great Western), and the views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that the content provided by one of our posters contravenes our posting rules (email link to report). Forum hosted by Well House Consultants

Jump to top of pageJump to Forum Home Page