IndustryInsider
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« Reply #105 on: January 05, 2009, 19:16:35 » |
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As for all these extra trains on the Bicester line, I hope someone is going to use them, because numbers on the current service are very low whenever I see them at Oxford. Sometimes it would be cheaper to hire a couple of taxis. Neither Oxford station, nor Bicester Town, is exactly brilliantly sited for the centre of either place.
And that's with an off-peak return available at ^2. The whole Bicester Village thing is worth exploring to the maximum potential, but the trip with 30/40mph maximum speeds is painfully slow, and although quicker than the bus it's much less frequent and when you take into account time walking to/from the centre of Bicester/Oxford it's not that attractive. But knock off 5 minutes - which with 50mph speeds you'd be able to do, and ramp up the off-peak frequency to 1tph and the peak service to every 45 minutes and that may well tip the balance in the favour of the train for enough people to make remedial investment worthwhile, before Chiltern and East-West Rail realise the full potential of the route. As GWR2006 said, the track is mostly up to the job of 50mph already especially between Islip and Bicester which was totally re-laid with steel sleepers about four years ago. As a single 165/2 would operate this service there is little impact on resourcing the stock and crew above what is needed now. The notorious jams on the A34 (currently made worse by the major bridge replacement at Wolvercote which will last well into 2010) mean the peak trains load quite reasonably with around 50-60 on the service in from Bicester in the morning and the same loadings spread over the two evening peak trains, but off-peak numbers sometimes don't hit double figures.
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/
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Btline
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« Reply #106 on: January 05, 2009, 19:29:00 » |
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Loadings are probably low due to Chiltern and Bicester North.
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John R
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« Reply #107 on: January 05, 2009, 20:06:04 » |
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How do you make that out? Chiltern don't provide a service to Oxford. It's a completely different market.
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willc
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« Reply #108 on: January 05, 2009, 23:12:46 » |
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Industry Insider, agree with much of what you say. The journey time is the key factor and I'm not even sure 50mph will quite do the trick.
While increased frequency could help, don't forget you still need to provide paths for MoD freight traffic to Bicester and the odd binliner to Calvert. Also, the MoD is touting for non-military freight traffic to use its facilities at Bicester - there's an open day for potential customers next month, according to an advert in the current issue of Rail, so it could get a little crowded on the branch.
Bicester Town is well sited for Bicester Village, but unless you live near Oxford station, the time taken to get there means it's easier to drive yourself to Bicester - except perhaps last week, when the town was gridlocked much of the time due to the sales.
In Bicester itself, some sort of feeder taxibus service, like Chiltern operate from Bicester North, might be useful. Much of the new housing is a fair way from the stations, but a reliable link would probably encourage people to use the trains. Not forgeting a bit of targeted marketing!!!! I bet if you did a random survey in Bicester Market Place, most people wouldn't have a clue they could get to Oxford and back by rail for ^2.
The Moreton fare cut scenario gets even dafter - the relief clerk who was on today had no idea the off-peak Oxford fares had gone down until I said what a bargain it was now. Someone, somewhere at FGW▸ Towers must have made the decision to do it, so why hasn't it been followed through, with some promotion to make sense of the change - or are they going to leave it until 2010?
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gwr2006
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« Reply #109 on: January 05, 2009, 23:24:36 » |
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Hi! this is my first post but have been reading with great interest mainly about the plans for the Cotswold Line. Does anyone know if the old bullhead track at Moreton and Evesham main station areas will be replaced as part of the redoubling scheme? I respectfully realize this could be difficult with the 1960's signal box/signalling infrastructure and that the semaphores will remain at Moreton-in-Marsh and maybe Evesham (unless Evesham box closes). However places like Abergavenny and Kidderminster have got modern track with old signalling equipment. Any thoughts? I expect the bullhead rail will remain in both station areas and the new track will be connected to it as necessary. This is a scheme that must be delivered within a very challenging budget so any unnecessary works (like upgrading existing platforms to match the length of the new ones or replacing track) won't be included. At Evesham it is more than likely the signal box will be closed and demolished to make way for the western extension of the passing loop. The existing engineers sidings will be lifted with the tamper/stoneblower moving to Honeybourne. The boxes at Ascott-under-Wychwood and Moreton-in-Marsh are also earmarked for closure and a new signal centre for the whole line will be built at either Evesham or Honeybourne. This would be a WestCAD VDU-based system so I also expect that will mean the end of semaphores, and it will also monitor the CCTV▸ from upgraded level crossings.
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Moreton134
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« Reply #110 on: January 06, 2009, 00:18:56 » |
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Thanks for the info gwr2006. I didn't think they were resignalling the semaphores until both the Oxford and Worcester area resignalling happens after 2015. A new signalling centre and colour lights would be a great improvement between Evesham and Ascott which still mostly rely on semophores near signal boxes, although it would be sad to see these go. I also believed that Moreton signal box would stay for the forseeable future with Ascott and/or Evesham closing with the control panels going to Moreton box. Presently at Evesham the existing signal box looks over a siding and both the running lines, these become single again a few yards west of the signal box. It will be interesting to see what upgrading will happen.
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signalandtelegraph
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« Reply #111 on: January 07, 2009, 13:42:24 » |
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I expect the bullhead rail will remain in both station areas and the new track will be connected to it as necessary. This is a scheme that must be delivered within a very challenging budget so any unnecessary works (like upgrading existing platforms to match the length of the new ones or replacing track) won't be included.
At Evesham it is more than likely the signal box will be closed and demolished to make way for the western extension of the passing loop. The existing engineers sidings will be lifted with the tamper/stoneblower moving to Honeybourne. The boxes at Ascott-under-Wychwood and Moreton-in-Marsh are also earmarked for closure and a new signal centre for the whole line will be built at either Evesham or Honeybourne. This would be a WestCAD VDU-based system so I also expect that will mean the end of semaphores, and it will also monitor the CCTV▸ from upgraded level crossings.
Boxes to close as stated above but new control centre at Evesham. SSI▸ control, sidings at Evesham to go.
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Bring back BR▸
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willc
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« Reply #112 on: January 07, 2009, 14:04:27 » |
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I expect the bullhead rail will remain in both station areas and the new track will be connected to it as necessary. This is a scheme that must be delivered within a very challenging budget so any unnecessary works (like upgrading existing platforms to match the length of the new ones or replacing track) won't be included.
At Evesham it is more than likely the signal box will be closed and demolished to make way for the western extension of the passing loop. The existing engineers sidings will be lifted with the tamper/stoneblower moving to Honeybourne. The boxes at Ascott-under-Wychwood and Moreton-in-Marsh are also earmarked for closure and a new signal centre for the whole line will be built at either Evesham or Honeybourne. This would be a WestCAD VDU-based system so I also expect that will mean the end of semaphores, and it will also monitor the CCTV▸ from upgraded level crossings.
Boxes to close as stated above but new control centre at Evesham. SSI▸ control, sidings at Evesham to go. You don't need to demolish the Evesham box, as it was built when the track layout there was far more extensive and already has three tracks in front of it, the two loop lines through the station and a siding, see http://eclipseandy.fotopic.net/p45061312.htmlIf this is a short-term fix, with the interlocking presumably being plugged into the Didcot centre after Oxford resignalling, it might make more sense to use the existing box - or is it all going to be built into a shipping container? As for engineering equipment, unless the sidings at Moreton are also going, then tampers and the like can very well be parked up here, as they often are at the moment.
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Don
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« Reply #113 on: January 07, 2009, 16:56:47 » |
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Network Rail has not finally decided what is happening with regard to the signalling of the track doubling of the Cotswold line. What is currently happening is: 1. Track-side vegetation is being cut back to provide space for the double line; 2. A detailed land survey is being completed along the route; 3. Preliminary work is taking place this weekend just north of Oxford to enable the goods loop there to be upgraded for Passenger services in the near future this will provide space to park passenger trains outside Oxford which are going to either come up the line, or be overtaken; 4. The 8 or 9 options for signalling which range from keeping all the boxes open to building a new signal box for the Worcester area - and lots of options in between - are presently being discussed with regard to presenting a shortlist of options to Network Rail management for the extra funding needed for each option. Even the exact site of where the single lines at each end are not totally finalised (although all of the recent track plans seem to be using the same locations). What has been decided is that: - the track will double except for a few miles at each end;
- Honeyborne will be able to cope with platforms for a new town at Long Marston and trains from the Gloucestershire Warwickshire Railway, so 2 platforms with the ability to add 2 more.
- Moreton-in-Marsh will retain a turn-back facility for trains in both directions
- Platforms will be built where the track is doubled with ramp access for wheelchair users to all platforms
- This Summer's blockade for up to six has been agreed in principle with FGW▸
The final decision has yet to be made. At one stage it was announced that Evesham was to close, then both Evesham and Ascott, then that none closing. The current line from Network Rail is that the decision has not been made yet. Am I right in thinking that Norton Junction was three days from closing back in the late 70s, it's still there today, so don't count on anything just yet. I will keep my ear to the ground and tell you when I hear more.
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« Last Edit: January 07, 2009, 19:07:27 by Don »
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Regards, Don.
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Lee
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« Reply #114 on: January 07, 2009, 18:22:48 » |
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Excellent summary, and good for me as that's near the top of my list of issues to catch up on.
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super tm
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« Reply #115 on: January 07, 2009, 19:20:24 » |
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Am I right in thinking that Norton Junction was three days from closing back in the late 70s.
Surely not. That would mean that all the replacement signals and point motors would have to be in place. Unless you think BR▸ could have resignalled the whole junction in 3 days
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Don
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« Reply #116 on: January 07, 2009, 20:18:18 » |
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Am I right in thinking that Norton Junction was three days from closing back in the late 70s.
Surely not. That would mean that all the replacement signals and point motors would have to be in place. Unless you think BR▸ could have re signalled the whole junction in 3 days Ha Ha, you'll never believe it.... Apparently, BR spent a lot of time and money putting in new signals and cables so that the lines would run as a single line between Worcester Shrub Hill and Evesham and a second single line between Worcester Shrub Hill and Gloucester. About 3 days before the box was due to close..... they changed their minds and then spent a load more money taking the signals et al out again. Unbelievable, truly unbelievable, the cost of planning, fabrication & installation, just to cancel it at the last minute. Oh, note the two single lines from Worcester, so no point motors.
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Regards, Don.
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Btline
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« Reply #117 on: January 07, 2009, 22:50:14 » |
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Good job they never did that, Worcester would be even more of a bottleneck today! Why on earth were they attempting to remove yet more flexability from the area?
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Don
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« Reply #118 on: January 07, 2009, 23:08:27 » |
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Good job they never did that, Worcester would be even more of a bottleneck today! Why on earth were they attempting to remove yet more flexibility from the area? Financial I suppose. One less signal box. Remember back then the railway was reducing the number of trains, were most of the Cross Country ones not stopping at Worcester by then? They must have worked out that it was not necessary. Perhaps they only kept Norton Junction for off the main line diversionary reasons.
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Regards, Don.
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willc
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« Reply #119 on: January 08, 2009, 13:58:26 » |
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Some of those cables at Norton junction must still have come in handy, as the distant sempahore signal on the gantry for trains heading towards Gloucester is actually controlled by the signal box at Gloucester, not by the junction box, as it works in conjunction with the colour light protecting the junction with the Birmingham-Bristol line.
Lots of orange jackets out on the line today, with new cable troughs going in at Charlbury, and some very enthusiastic tree felling going on at, er, Hanborough, though I suspect that's in an effort to end problems with leaves on the line affecting westbound trains starting from the station. And lots of people at Oxford getting ready for the weekend possession to start work on the loops.
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