Passenger's anger as train ticket office shuts

[whole diary]

[Chris from Nailsea]

"When Leah Senington arrived at Yatton railway station to pick up her pre-paid tickets to London, she was not expecting any hassle.  She was in good time to catch her train and well within the ticket office's opening hours.  But the office was shut, and she was asked to pay the full ^75 ticket price when she got to London.

The small ticket office in Yatton acts as a pick up point for pre-booked tickets and, according to the sign pinned in the window and information on First Great Western's website, should be open from Monday to Friday from 6.30am until 12.30pm.  But the office appears to close early on some days, which means people with a ticket to collect have to buy a second ticket to travel.

Miss Senington was told to get off at Bristol Temple Meads and collect her tickets from the Bristol ticket office.  She only had four minutes before her connecting train and did not have time to explain to staff why she did not have a ticket to get through the barriers.  The conductor's machine on the London train was broken, but after arriving she was told to pay the full fare of about ^75.  After refusing to pay and another explanation, she was finally allowed to collect her tickets.

She said: "The whole thing was a total nightmare and I'm already dreading my next trip.  I even called First Great Western the day before to check that it would be open and they said it would be, why didn't they communicate the closure to their staff?"

Cath Millman, of First Great Western said: "If you have trouble obtaining your ticket it is at the train manager's discretion and the worst-case scenario would be buying another ticket which could later be refunded.

"The early closure of the Yatton office is only a temporary circumstance and we hope that it will be back to normal soon."

For the full article, see http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/news/Passengers-anger-train-ticket-office-shuts/article-284106-detail/article.html

[grahame]

Oh goodness - yet another story "of this ilk".  Good for Miss Senington that (it seems) she firmly stood her ground and didn't get browbeaten into paying the full fare.  But how must the experience have left her feeling?   And how would someone who didn't have their head screwed on right have coped?

Cath Millman of FGW^▸ (First Great Western) is wrong and taking an arrogant attitude. Sorry. The "worst case scenario" is not just a refund.  The worst case scenario is a very upset customer who will be thinking about it for hours or days afterwards, and who doesn't feel the strength or know how to follow it up. And in my scenario, First Great Western end up pocketing the extra money which they have extracted from a perfecly rule abiding customer because of their own failure.  Sorry - I'm putting this very strongly, but I have been disgusted by parallel treatment I have seen for myself, to customers of mine ...

[bemmy]

I bet getting that refund after the event would be a difficult and time-consuming process, as in any non-standard situation which the system isn't be geared up to deal with. And as grahame says it's simply not good enough to treat your customers this way.

Most people in this passenger's situation would probably not be assertive enough to hold their ground like she did, and would most likely react to the situation by avoiding trains altogether in future, not to mention moaning to everyone they knew and reinforcing FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s bad reputation. For everyone I know who uses trains, there is at least one other person who has vowed never to travel by rail again because of being let down one way or another.

I don't see why the guards shouldn't be able to issue pre-booked tickets on the train in these circumstances. Their machines can connect to the credit card terminals so surely it should be possible to connect to the reservation system, just like the machines at stations do.

Unfortunately I suppose this would require investment in new machines, so it probably makes economic sense to FGW to lose customers instead.

[eightf48544]

grahame you've not put it strongly enough. This is  sympton of what's wrong with modern society especialy when dealing with the government and large corporations.

They make us jump through all sorts of hoops to get services, then when they go wrong  because of their mistakes it's not their fault and you have to go through yet another set of hoops to get any form of redress.

The most galling thing is that most of these companies make great play of their "customer service" and have "customer service  staff"  however most have never looked up customer and service in the dictionary and appear to be mearly apologists for the company with no power to put the matter right. Although most are treated like  the poor squaddies of WW1 forced into the firing line with little or no back up and are disiplined if they don't obey the rule book to the letter.

Rant over.

[super tm]

Cath Millman, of First Great Western said: "If you have trouble obtaining your ticket it is at the train manager's discretion and the worst-case scenario would be buying another ticket which could later be refunded

Yes she seems to be blaming the TM^‡(resolve).  However the TM did use his discretion and allowed the lady to travel to her destination.  It was the barrier staff who asked her to pay the full amount for the journey.

Also if I might add there is a bit more to the story that shows on this site.  When you book tickets on the internet you must show your card at the station to pick them up or you can collect them from the fast ticket machine.  However the card used by the lady in question does not belong to her so really she should not have been able to collect the tickets either from the booking office or the fast ticket machine. 

She must have been relying on the good will of the ticket office staff to give her the tickets even though they should not have done so when the ticket office was closed she could not get them!

I should imagine when she got to the excess fare window at Paddington she was told to show the credit card, when she said she did not have it they probably asked her to buy a new ticket.  That is how the system works I am afraid.  Why cant her company give her a charge card to use ?  That is how all the other company travellers get their tickets.

The system seems quite reasonable to me.  It is just to confirm that you have paid for the tickets and you have not borrowed someone elses card for the transaction.

[swlines]

Also if I might add there is a bit more to the story that shows on this site.  When you book tickets on the internet you must show your card at the station to pick them up or you can collect them from the fast ticket machine.  However the card used by the lady in question does not belong to her so really she should not have been able to collect the tickets either from the booking office or the fast ticket machine.

That only came in last year. You used to be able to put any card in the machine (you still can with some ticket issuers) and type in the code.

[standclearplease]

The office is apparently closed at the moment due to staff sickness and holiday leave.

[Chris from Nailsea]

Thanks for your comments, super tm!

However, if I may in turn comment on a couple of points, from a passenger perspective:

Yes, the full article in the Bristol Evening Post also covered the question of whether the lady was entitled to collect tickets that had been pre-paid by her employer.  I am in a similar position, working for a company which contracts with a supplier in Warrington for my travel.  They pay for my tickets, and send me a rail booking confirmation e-mail.  I can then collect my tickets, from either BTM^▸ (Bristol Temple Meads (strictly, it should be BRI)) or Nailsea, using the machines - I just insert a card (one of my own, certainly not the one they use in Warrington to pay for the ticket!) for identification, and the ticket reference number.

The only problem is, it does take time to queue up, get to a machine, shove in a card, key in your number and wait for the machine to print out the myriad of tickets/seat allocations and receipts.  That's probably why the lady didn't try to do that at BTM and risk missing her train to PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains)!  I'm perhaps more fortunate in having a suitable machine at Nailsea & Backwell (when it's working!), so I can do this the day before I travel, for example - but there isn't one at Yatton.  Hence the need for a manned ticket office there - and if it's not manned properly, exactly this problem will occur again!

And yes, the train manager did allow her to travel - but he couldn't insist on her buying another ticket on board, as his machine was broken, apparently?  I also rather hope the barrier staff were more helpful than you describe, as the e-mail I am sent with my rail booking confirmation says, "Should you experience any problems collecting your tickets from a station FastTicket machine, please proceed to the station ticket office where a member of staff will assist you."

I must say, I've always found the staff in FGW^▸ (First Great Western) ticket offices to be very friendly and helpful. 

[Ollie]

Still think there might be more to it. But that's just me, I'm a sceptical person.

I have witnessed first hand advance tickets from a station further west being issued at Paddington due to machine not working/office being closed.

Reading that article doesn't tell me if she got her booked train or not? IF she got her booked train, her confirmation code and prove of reservations and such should have been enough for her as she was unable to collect at Yatton, and would have done so at Paddington.

It says she only had a 4 minute changeover at Bristol TM^‡(resolve), as far as I know Bristol TM has a minimum connection time of 10 minutes.

I get the impression that maybe she didn't get her booked train.

But without knowing the full facts we can't really judge. All we have is what papers say..

[Chris from Nailsea]

A very diplomatic (but nevertheless helpful) answer, Ollie. 

[Super Guard]

Still think there might be more to it. But that's just me, I'm a sceptical person.

I have witnessed first hand advance tickets from a station further west being issued at Paddington due to machine not working/office being closed.

Reading that article doesn't tell me if she got her booked train or not? IF she got her booked train, her confirmation code and prove of reservations and such should have been enough for her as she was unable to collect at Yatton, and would have done so at Paddington.

It says she only had a 4 minute changeover at Bristol TM^‡(resolve), as far as I know Bristol TM has a minimum connection time of 10 minutes.

I get the impression that maybe she didn't get her booked train.

But without knowing the full facts we can't really judge. All we have is what papers say..

Ahhh it was you that was taking the "Sceptical Training" class at Swindon

You are correct about the minimum connection time at BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains) being 10 minutes.

[devon_metro]

maybe her connection arrived late?

[Ollie]

maybe her connection arrived late?

I'm not sure knowing newspapers if that was the case they would be all over that as well.

"Not only could she not collect her ticket, but the train was late too meaning she only had 4 minutes to connect at Bristol Temple Meads"

[Ollie]

Ahhh it was you that was taking the "Sceptical Training" class at Swindon

You are correct about the minimum connection time at BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains) being 10 minutes.

I run the course

[swlines]

Knowing the papers, they've probably got some facts wrong.

Could it in fact have been the SAME train...?