Severn Beach line - timetables, engineering work, closures, incidents (merged topics)

[whole diary]

[Graz]

Perhaps this might be a lesson to the designers of these displays that having a tracking device fitted could be a pretty good idea - can't imagine they are particularly expensive these days.

I agree with Graz, the orange LED display would have been more suitable and probably less prone to damage/theft.  The station already had an emergency button, so this could have been left in place and perhaps given a lick of paint.

Definitely, if the LED displays were hanging from the station canopy (at Redland), or high poles where people couldn't get to them, etc! And they would also be easier to see - those little screens aren't particularly easy to see in sunlight.

[Graz]

How about difficult people who choose a station outside the SB^▸ (Signal Box) line? Like I would choose Oldfield Park Great idea though. Something has to be done, and that seems by far the best option.

[Brucey]

There are some pretty good options that have been suggested here, here are the ones I think may work along with some of the potential problems.

Parking ticket style machine
Just a simple one that will only give you a ticket if you feed it at least 75p in coins (i.e. the cheapest child or railcard fare).  The ticket can then be exchanged for a more expensive ticket on the train, at the sin bin or on another train (like a permit to travel).  If the ticket is valid for a short period (e.g. one hour), then it ensures that at least some revenue would be gained from every customer.  An option like this would allow the SVB line to have penalty fares.  After the theft of the information displays at Redland & Montpelier, I wouldn't expect FGW^▸ (First Great Western) to install anything of any value.

Pre-printed Zonal Tickets
To be used during rush hour.  One ticket for Inner Zone, another for Outer Zone and a third for Both Zones.  Probably very quick to issue these tickets but the guard would need to ensure a date is stamped.  If the different ticket types were different colours, it would allow easy recognition on ticket checks.

Pre-printed Check Box Tickets (as shown above)
Not as fast to issue as the zone tickets above, but probably quicker than using Avantix^▸ (Ticket Issuing System used on board trains) Mobile.  Would require some method of recording which tickets are sold for statistics and accounting purposes.

Pre-printed Weekly Season Tickets
As above for the Zonal Tickets, but also make these available at other outlets (e.g. newsagents and schools for the local schoolchildren who commute).  If bus companies can manage to sell tickets at newsagents, why can't a train company?

Cash Only for all fares
This would speed up all ticketing on the line and is compatible with all the other options suggested here.  Even for fares beyond Bristol Temple Meads, the ticket must be paid by cash.  In the event of someone wishing to pay by card, they should buy a single to BTM^▸ (Bristol Temple Meads (strictly, it should be BRI)) then exchange this for the correct ticket at BTM.  For customers wishing to pay for single/return fares within the line by credit/debit card, then books of 10 tickets could be stocked by local retailers and at BTM's ticket office - perhaps giving a discount for buying a book of 10 tickets to encourage people to have a valid ticket.

Random spot checks at stations
As mad as it sounds, having a person stood at the entrance/exit to the busier stations during rush hour may even allow extra tickets to be sold.  Not sure how expensive this would be or how it would work if penalty fares are not in place.

[Hafren]

A couple of thoughts.

The stats would be an issue for any of the zonal options. They would basically make Clifton Down and Severn Beach look disproportionately busy. Having said that, people probably 'overshoot' their tickets anyway (I often do for flexibility) where stations are close together. And if ticket sales are going to go up as intended, having higher total numbers is going to be an improvement even if they're allocated less precisely. Hopefully whoever interprets the statistics would be aware that Station X really covers several stations' ticket sales, and doesn't use it as an excuse to make out that the smaller stations are not being used!

Encouraging people to buy tickets the day before would be a simple option. Modern ticket machines do of course have this option... just a couple of snags! Firstly, it as far as I know they only allow it at the origin station, and secondly it can only be done after a certain time (is it 6pm?). If it were possible to do it at BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains), and then select station x as the origin, and do it a bit earlier, it would be more effective, although selecting the origin station makes the machines that bit more complicated to use, and opens up the scope for user error! Perhaps a dedicated 'ticket for tomorrow' machine for SVB stations could be installed at BRI platform 1!

I seem to remember that some of the Valley Lines booking offices just involve someone with an Avantix^▸ (Ticket Issuing System used on board trains), and I think one of them is/was an arrangement with the station taxi office (I'm thinking back a few years - not sure if it still happens). Perhaps local shops could be given Avantix machines - obviously this would work well somewhere like Clifton Down, but would be more difficult at stations like Redland that are in more residential locations; to be really useful the ticket selling would need to be on or right next to the station (particularly for one-off travellers). Perhaps it would be possible to allow traders to set up on or next to stations for low rent if they're willing to operate during the morning peak and sell tickets. Extra workload and training for the shop staff would need to be taken into account. Thinking along that tack, if the issue with self-service ticket machines is that they won't be secure enough, what about installing proper self-service ticket machines in the shops (with some sort of incentive for the owners) if there happens to be a shop close enough to the station for it to be useful as a makeshift booking office.

I'm not too sure about the cash only thing - depending on how black and white it is - I'm all for encouraging passengers to pay small fares in cash, but for longer journeys and irregular travellers who wouldn't know about the arrangement, it just seems to make things too difficult and off-putting

[rich0099]

Encouraging people to buy tickets the day before would be a simple option. Modern ticket machines do of course have this option... just a couple of snags! Firstly, it as far as I know they only allow it at the origin station, and secondly it can only be done after a certain time (is it 6pm?).

Hmmm... ticket machines may be ok in larger stations - but as with the recent stolen information point displays - machines on unmanned stations are very vulnerable.
At the end of the day, we're still talking about using coinage - and at least the guard can give you change.

Perhaps a dedicated 'ticket for tomorrow' machine for SVB stations could be installed at BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains) platform 1!

I've noted quite a few shift workers boarding & alighting the train at St Andrews Rd and Avonmouth both morning and evening. I'm guessing they get an Open return? A quicker on-board punch ticket system could still offer the same service.

I seem to remember that some of the Valley Lines booking offices just involve someone with an Avantix^▸ (Ticket Issuing System used on board trains), and I think one of them is/was an arrangement with the station taxi office (I'm thinking back a few years - not sure if it still happens). Perhaps local shops could be given Avantix machines

I guess at the end of the day it's down to profits. Wouldn't a local shop want a cut for the service they provide? There are also shops that aren't open before 8 and after 5pm. 

I'm not too sure about the cash only thing - depending on how black and white it is - I'm all for encouraging passengers to pay small fares in cash, but for longer journeys and irregular travellers who wouldn't know about the arrangement, it just seems to make things too difficult and off-putting

Well as the Severn Beach Line is a halt (for want of a better technical term) - the local people who use it (at least from SVB to BRI) could be told of the changes by leaflet (in fact, I had a timetable put through my door recently - even though it's due to change in May). Day trippers (*cough!*) going to SVB are either twitchers, spotters (EWS^▸ (English Welsh & Scottish Railway Ltd, now known as DB Schenker Rail (UK^▸ (United Kingdom))) 66's at Avonmouth), older people wishing to reminisce about the boating lake and the strip clubs - or people who are madly curious. In that event - people travelling from the BRI end could use the booking office if they hadn't change (obviously there are flaws with every plan).

[Hafren]

Encouraging people to buy tickets the day before would be a simple option. Modern ticket machines do of course have this option... just a couple of snags! Firstly, it as far as I know they only allow it at the origin station, and secondly it can only be done after a certain time (is it 6pm?).

Hmmm... ticket machines may be ok in larger stations - but as with the recent stolen information point displays - machines on unmanned stations are very vulnerable.

The entire line of thought behind that paragraph was that problem, i.e. not suggesting machines on every station (hence the point that self-service machines are usually for a fixed origin station AFAIK^▸ (as far as I know)) - I should have said 'at BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains)' more explicitly The idea would be that regular passengers could buy a ticket the day before on the way to the platform in the time that they would be waiting for the train to leave, if a way could be found for it to be done quite quickly. It would, however, only be of use for daily travellers, who might well be season ticket holders only, and therefore not necessarily the main target for this issue; it would also only serve BRI passengers - the question is would it replace a sufficient proportion of the on-train sales to be useful. Perhaps not - from my limited experience of the line (as an occasional visitor to the Redland/Clifton area) I'm aware that there are healthy numbers of people making journeys that don't go into the centre.

I'm just thinking that even with the alternative means of issuing tickets on the train, it's even quicker for the guard/examiner just to check a ticket that's already been purchased, and useful to keep payment options open.

I guess at the end of the day it's down to profits. Wouldn't a local shop want a cut for the service they provide? There are also shops that aren't open before 8 and after 5pm.

I would assume that a ticket machine wouldn't come without access to at least some of the commission. I wonder if FGW^▸ (First Great Western) would be willing to give up the 9%, and/or offer free travel to shop workers. There is a training issue also, along with time serving customers, which is why something more creative like a self-service machine (perhaps a simplified version for local travel) in a shop might be an option, but then one has to ask how many shops would be furnished with one, and at what cost to install it.

Another angle... is there a particular problem with numbers of people wanting weekly tickets on Monday mornings?

Well as the Severn Beach Line is a halt (for want of a better technical term) - the local people who use it (at least from SVB to BRI) could be told of the changes by leaflet

In the end non-locals would of course be very unlikely to be using the line as an origin in the morning peak... but I just like the existing idea that one can buy a ticket from any station using a set range of payment methods - a positive aspect of our current setup (somebody's going to think of exceptions now ). I suppose I don't like the idea that a non-regular could be caught out when they're quite willing to pay in what they might consider to be "the usual way". But obviously it might not be as black and white as "no cash at all".

[Chris2]

An idea that I have seen used in Switzerland, is that you buy tickets in advance with no date on them. You then place the ticket into a machine on the platform which stamps the date and time on the ticket.
This would be useable with a carnet system as long as the tickets are standard size.
I know this would not solve everyone's problems, especially if travelling further than Bristol Temple Meads. However, in this situation possibly allow them to use the value of the carnet ticket against the value of the ticket required at Bristol Temple Meads ticket office or on the train.

[rich0099]

The 2K05 (Nodding Donkey) failed on its return jaunt from SVB to BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains) this morning... half-way down the platform.

Apparently the electrics/speedometer had failed in the cab and so we had to wait for the later service to drag
the failed set back to BRI.

Driver with red flag and 3 detonators deployed, the DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) sets were coupled without a problem (shame all couplings
aren't the same as there was 66120 idling at St Andrews Rd  ).

Unfortunately, passengers were only allowed to board the working set... so by the time we got to Shirehampton it
was standing room only with the front and rear of the DMU looking like a Halfords cycle shop.

I'm sure there are rules governing the use of failed DMU's - but as there were now two sets of crew - it's a shame they
couldn't ease the overcrowding by using the failed set (the doors and lights were still working).


I just hope I can get home tonight! 

[smithy]

that would not be locked out due to the problem it had,the crew would have decided to keep locked out because there is no through gangway.

[devon_metro]

that would not be locked out due to the problem it had,the crew would have decided to keep locked out because there is no through gangway.

Is that a problem in Bristol?

Down in Devon there are numerous 142/143/you name it combos. (well, less since some donkeys went home to the grim north)

[JayMac]

From FGW^▸ (First Great Western) Live Updates:

Train services have been disrupted due to lightning having damaged equipment between Bristol Temple Meads and Severn Beach.Engineers have worked as fast as possible to restore services to normal. Short notice alterations may still occur.

Replacement road transport is in operation between Bristol Temple Meads and Severn Beach in both directions.

Last Updated: 22/07/2010 17:41

Bad timing on my part, taking the dog out when I did. We got a bit wet. Beat a hasty retreat and I was watching the brief, but intense, storm from my porch. I have a good panorama of Avonmouth and its environs from my front door - think I may have seen the lightning strike responsible. There was a definite 'hit' near St Andrew's Road. Pretty impressive and bleddy loud!!

[JaminBob]

Ooh you lucky (ish) thing. Very poor views from a grey block in the centre. Loud thunder though. Quite a storm.

[ReWind]

http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/news/100-000-extra-journeys-commuter-line/article-2523943-detail/article.html

[JaminBob]

Great news! I miss the little train.

Would suspect the increase in detected passengers is partly due to better fare collection.

[Brucey]

A Bristol councillor has given local rail campaigners his "written commitment" that the future of the Severn Beach line is secured.

Quite a long story, so I've only quoted the abstract.  Full story at http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/bristol/hi/people_and_places/newsid_8997000/8997578.stm