St Pancras plans for direct trains from UK to Germany - Feb 2025

[whole diary]

[eightonedee]

Not sure if this is the correct board, but this has cheered me up considerably-

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg5d6l5lz4jo

[Chris from Nailsea]

With thanks for starting this topic, eightonedee, I've moved it to this board, rather than our 'entirely overseas' board.

I'll also quote some detail from that BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) article:

New direct train routes from London to Germany, Switzerland and France could open as part of plans to boost passenger numbers at St Pancras station.

London St Pancras Highspeed, which owns the station and operates the track to the Channel Tunnel in Folkestone, has already set out proposals to increase capacity for international train travel from 1,800 passengers per hour to almost 5,000.  It now wants to attract different train operators to offer a range of services in Europe.

Eurostar currently holds a monopoly on the trains through the Channel Tunnel with routes to Paris, Brussels and Amsterdam.

London St Pancras Highspeed and Getlink have signed an agreement that will help them to commit to expanding rail connectivity between the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) and Europe.

"Many European cities could be reached directly by train in under six hours which we believe is really competitive with short-haul air travel," said a spokesperson for London St Pancras Highspeed.

Yann Leriche, chief executive of Getlink, which owns Eurotunnel, said: "We are keen to drive forward attractive opportunities for low-carbon mobility with a range of new destinations in Germany, Switzerland and France."

Getlink believes it is possible for train services to Bordeaux, Cologne, Frankfurt, Geneva, Marseille and Zurich to be created.  No set timeline has been revealed as yet.

Eurostar dropped services between London and Disneyland Paris in June 2023, and no longer has routes between London and the south of France.

Virgin Group and Evolyn are two companies developing plans for rival services to Eurostar that could take passengers to the newly proposed destinations.  Virgin acknowledged that it would be a "huge undertaking" to establish a new cross-Channel operator but said the route was "ripe for change with plenty of room and potential for new competition at St Pancras and through the Tunnel".

Competition between different companies on the route would benefit all customers, a spokesperson added.  London St Pancras Highspeed and Getlink have signed an agreement that will help them to commit to expanding rail connectivity between the UK and Europe.

Robert Sinclair, chief executive of London St Pancras Highspeed, said demand for international train travel was growing.  He said his company would work with Getlink "to encourage new and existing train operators to expand capacity and launch new destinations unlocking the potential of a fully connected Europe".

[grahame]

St Pancras plans ...

Which got me wondering who St Pancras was / is ...

[Chris from Nailsea]

From Wikipedia:

The station's name comes from the St. Pancras parish, whose name originates from the fourth-century Christian boy martyr Pancras of Rome.

Pancras (Latin: Sanctus Pancratius) was a Roman citizen who converted to Christianity and was beheaded for his faith at the age of fourteen, around the year 304. His name is Greek (Πανκράτιος Pankrátios), meaning 'all-powerful'.

[eXPassenger]

How do these plans fit in with the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) government requirement for entry checking before boarding?  or is there a secret plan to join Schengen?

[ChrisB]

There are plans to expand the check-in at St Pancras I believe. Featured in the news 6-9 months ago?

[stuving]

How do these plans fit in with the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) government requirement for entry checking before boarding?  or is there a secret plan to join Schengen?

HS1^▸ (High Speed line 1 - St Pancras to Channel Tunnel)/St Pancras has a programme to increase passenger capacity. Last year Active Thinking led a study for them into how much of an increase was possible, and what "modern approaches and technological solutions" could be used. Railway Gazette reported:

It found that expanded infrastructure and enhanced border security processes could increase capacity from 1 800 to around 2 400 passengers/h in the next three to four years. Redesigning the layout of the international area could see an increase of up to 5 000 passengers/h in the long term.

Then earlier this year a PQQ came out for an implementation study based on that. That closed last week, so while the contract notice is still on line the document defining the study has now disappeared.

The only bit of the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) report I can see that might be called news is

London St Pancras Highspeed and Getlink have signed an agreement that will help them to commit to expanding rail connectivity between the UK and Europe.

This agreement with Getlink is another bit of the same overall programme, and must have been agreed some time ago even if only signed now - and even then it's only an agreement to have an agreement.

[eightonedee]

or is there a secret plan to join Schengen?

Let's make it an overt one - I'd support it!

[eXPassenger]

I was more concerned with incoming trains as HM Government has wanted to perform immigration procedures on the continent to remove the possibility of arriving passengers who are denied entry claiming asylum.

[Electric train]

How do these plans fit in with the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) government requirement for entry checking before boarding?  or is there a secret plan to join Schengen?

I was more concerned with incoming trains as HM Government has wanted to perform immigration procedures on the continent to remove the possibility of arriving passengers who are denied entry claiming asylum.

Both the EU^» (European Union - about) and the UK are moving towards the electronic type visa, so instead of queuing to have your Passport stamped provided you are registered for the visa your Passport and face is scanned at the departure points and the barrier opens and on you travel.

The e-visa has to be the future

[grahame]

Both the EU^» (European Union - about) and the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) are moving towards the electronic type visa, so instead of queuing to have your Passport stamped provided you are registered for the visa your Passport and face is scanned at the departure points and the barrier opens and on you travel.

The e-visa has to be the future

Indeed - history is littered with changes that have made things work far quicker in less space.  I suspect that more people use Exmouth station (random choice) with one platform than they did with - well, how many was it before? - and with run round loops, water towers, stations staff and much more ...

Perhaps with compact scanning of international passengers, Ashford International could re-open for that, a curve (sorry - straight line) put in allowing direct running from Godstone to Reigate, and we could see international trains from Zurich and Berlin to Ashford, changing there for the London expresses (to not only St Pancras but also Charing Cross and Victoria), for Fishguard via Reading for passengers to Ireland, and to Bournemouth via Hastings, Brighton and Southampton

[rogerw]

The problem is not just passport checking but the need to scan all luggage. I use Eurostar 4 or 6 times a year and the security check always takes far longer than passport control. I wonder if these checks are really necessary. The Gotthard base tunnel is longer that the Channel tunnel and checks are not considered necessary for that.

[Noggin]

The problem is not just passport checking but the need to scan all luggage. I use Eurostar 4 or 6 times a year and the security check always takes far longer than passport control. I wonder if these checks are really necessary. The Gotthard base tunnel is longer that the Channel tunnel and checks are not considered necessary for that.

When the Channel Tunnel was first opened, IRA terrorism was a significant risk, hence many of the security measures.

Arguably its still a major target - unlike the Swiss, we have been involved in a lot of conflicts over the years. 

Also, if I recall correctly, the Spanish have airline-style security on high-speed rail routes too.