How would you like GWR to handle their inability to crew all trains timetabled?

[whole diary]

[ray951]

The concern is is that they don't appear to be doing anything, the management need to do some managing.

The following was a conversation I had today: my other half planned to catch a train to Oxford (from Didcot) tonight. Her friend had checked the train schedules earlier in the week and found no issues. Aware of the notoriously poor Sunday service, I suggested she check the current schedule, and, unsurprisingly, she had not. Upon checking, we found that there are no trains returning from Oxford after 21:30, with only replacement bus services at 23:05 and 00:05. The last train is too early and the bus services are too late (and take too long). Had I not prompted her to check, she would likely have been stranded in Oxford for an extended period (or more likely, she would have called me to pick her up). As a result, she opted to travel by car, representing a loss of revenue for the railway.

<Rant on>
Given the above why would anybody choose to travel by train, if the management and employees don't seem to sort out this issue?
Why don't the management, staff, and unions come together to at least reach a temporary agreement?
Is the railway industry the most inept industry at undermining itself?
<Rant off>

[grahame]

Bringing Sundays into the working week is the only solution to guarantee staff on a Sunday

And this illustrates the utter folly of the new Government caving in to the Unions demands without at least getting it on the table & moving forward with it.

There will never be a 100% guarantee.  If we can reduce the cancellations - from 17% (weekends at Melksham over the last 12 weeks) of 7 services each way to - say - 2% of 5 services each way, I think we would have a promotable service which we do not have at the moment.

[grahame]

Is the railway industry the most inept industry at undermining itself?

I think in <rant> mode you have put two negatives in there and ended up with an unintentional positive.

The railway industry is the most capable industry at undermining itself?   

[a-driver]

Bringing Sundays into the working week is the only solution to guarantee staff on a Sunday

And this illustrates the utter folly of the new Government caving in to the Unions demands without at least getting it on the table & moving forward with it.

The government didn’t cave in.  They made the huge mistake of trying to negotiate one pay deal covering all TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) when every TOC has a different set of terms & conditions.

[ChrisB]

Another complication is that there is no indication of which drivers might be available in which depots with which competencies on which routes on which Sundays. So developing any reduced timetable is just not going to happen.

[a-driver]

The concern is is that they don't appear to be doing anything, the management need to do some managing.

The following was a conversation I had today: my other half planned to catch a train to Oxford (from Didcot) tonight. Her friend had checked the train schedules earlier in the week and found no issues. Aware of the notoriously poor Sunday service, I suggested she check the current schedule, and, unsurprisingly, she had not. Upon checking, we found that there are no trains returning from Oxford after 21:30, with only replacement bus services at 23:05 and 00:05. The last train is too early and the bus services are too late (and take too long). Had I not prompted her to check, she would likely have been stranded in Oxford for an extended period (or more likely, she would have called me to pick her up). As a result, she opted to travel by car, representing a loss of revenue for the railway.

<Rant on>
Given the above why would anybody choose to travel by train, if the management and employees don't seem to sort out this issue?
Why don't the management, staff, and unions come together to at least reach a temporary agreement?
Is the railway industry the most inept industry at undermining itself?
<Rant off>

The issue here is that the unions and management could come to an agreement but when it reaches the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) for approval it’ll be rejected.  If they want to sort it the ball is firmly in the court of the DfT.

I believe there’s a proposal for Northern Rail that’s been made to resolve the issue of Sunday’s…… and surprise, surprise, it’s basically an increase in pay.  The only thing that will solve the issue instantly in the short term.  Let’s hope the DfT gives approval for GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) to do the same.

[JayMac]

Hire more drivers.

But I suspect the unions and their members would be against that though. Reducing their opprtunity to earn overtime.

[UstiImmigrunt]

Hire more drivers.

But I suspect the unions and their members would be against that though. Reducing their opprtunity to earn overtime.

Incorrect. More members equals more subscriptions and there will always be plenty of overtime.

And add in training time as well. It takes over a year from starting a course to completing your maiden voyage. And that's just basic route and traction knowledge. In that time there's probably been either a retirement, moving to another company, going up the management tree, removal from the driving grade for either medical or disciplinary reasons or even a sacking.

[UstiImmigrunt]

How Sunday rostering works.

HSS^▸ (High Speed Services) staff have up to 2359 on the preceding Monday to opt out of the following Sunday, I'm not sure when the cut off is for GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) drivers to request a Sunday off.

On the Tuesday as long as the short term diagrammers have been able to complete their work then the rostering team create the DAS^▸ (Driver Advisory System) (Daily Alteration Sheet).

Then Thursday evening around 1900 the uncovered jobs are released for the Crew Resource Managers to start mission impossible and cover all the Sunday trains. But that job doesn't officially start until the Pre planner comes in Friday morning. The night shift MIGHT be able to look Thursday but no doubt they are still trying to cover Friday. Also if Saturday is still being worked on then Sunday's work may not start until a lot later. And as the diagrams change the majority of Sundays then the pre planner looks for extended breaks and PAO^▸ (Passenger / As Ordered. Traincrew travelling before/after working a service) (Passenger As Ordered) in the diagrams. Then negotiations start. For example a driver with a booked early Sunday but is then lates Monday will be asked to do a later start and then someone who is on earlies can cover that particular early turn. Someone who has a shed and ferry turn will have that diagram cut up so the driver is released for mainline driving.

Every driver has the right to their booked diagram and can claim that turn. So on the day the request goes in please cover a different turn they can say no and more cancellations occur.

A crazy system which relies on overtime being worked and less HSS staff are interested in that now.

[ChrisB]

How Sunday rostering works.

Every driver has the right to their booked diagram and can claim that turn. So on the day the request goes in please cover a different turn they can say no and more cancellations occur.

At what point in the timescale does a driver get to know their booked turn or turns? Every month, every quarter, every ??

[UstiImmigrunt]

Every May and December there is a new roster issued. It is a very complicated process which I'm not even going to attempt to explain...

But in summary you have booked turns and spares. On weekends those booked turns are regularly ammended but the turn number stays the same. From spare you can be moved a maximum of 2 hours either earlier or later as long as Hidden requirements are met.

The short term planners issue the diagrams for the Sunday and on the DAS^▸ (Driver Advisory System) a driver has a turn number allocated, whether as a long term booked number from the roster or from spare. That diagram is your booked work for the Sunday.

I can assure you that it is extremely complicated. A long term diagram maybe BTM^▸ (Bristol Temple Meads (strictly, it should be BRI)) PADD WORCESTER Stoke Gifford. But Swindon Didcot is closed so that diagram may become BTM Swindon shuttles all day as you can't get to Paddington for your booked Worcester service. And changing at Reading may not conform to break regulations plus you'd need an additional driver or drivers to work your trains Reading Paddington Reading.

Confusing enough?

[Bob_Blakey]

I chose the 'It's More Complicated' option as the closest I could get to 'None Of The Above'.

Given the recent statement by (fairly senior?) GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) management that they do have sufficient staff these major service disruptions should obviously not be occurring. So it falls to the bosses, with input from the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) where necessary, to sort things out.

Aside from the obvious stuff - e.g. implementation of scheduled 7 day rostering -  I would be fascinated to learn why qualified train drivers, and other on-train staff, apparently have their working days so significantly disrupted by loads of additional training. Also the claims of unnecessary intra-service crew changes, if true, should be binned because they allegedly don't make the maximum use of staff working hours.

[a-driver]

I would be fascinated to learn why qualified train drivers, and other on-train staff, apparently have their working days so significantly disrupted by loads of additional training.

There’s a lot of new drivers coming through the system. They don’t overload them initially by getting them to learn ALL the routes and traction in one hit. At some stage they then get released to learn additional routes or traction whilst new drivers are still coming through. There’s the additional assessment for newly qualified, simulator time etc.

[UstiImmigrunt]

Also the claims of unnecessary intra-service crew changes, if true, should be binned because they allegedly don't make the maximum use of staff working hours.

It's not a claim, it's a fact as I have previously posted. It's easy in a shift to spend more time out of the front seat being either sat in the back cab or waiting to travel on a late running service rather than actually driving a train.

All thanks to a "wondrous" computer program which nobody will dump.

[IndustryInsider]

Also the claims of unnecessary intra-service crew changes, if true, should be binned because they allegedly don't make the maximum use of staff working hours.

It's not a claim, it's a fact as I have previously posted. It's easy in a shift to spend more time out of the front seat being either sat in the back cab or waiting to travel on a late running service rather than actually driving a train.

All thanks to a "wondrous" computer program which nobody will dump.

And as I’ve said before, some of the longer distance trains which used to be crewed by one or two drivers/TM^‡(resolve)’s for the duration of the journey, are now often crewed by 3, 4 or sometimes more swapping in and out en-route.

So, if there’s a problem with a given train theres’s a far larger chance it will create problems that will take much longer to sort out.  All because of a few marginal ‘on paper it works’ efficiency gains.