Bus firm defends officers after woman 'humiliated'

[whole diary]

[infoman]

A bus firm has defended its use of revenue protection officers, after a passenger was challenged for not keeping hold of her ticket.

Tori Seager, from Norwich, said she paid for her paper ticket on the bus but did not take it from the onboard machine.

She said she felt "humiliated" when staff from First Bus approached her, telling her to either buy a new ticket or get off the bus.

The operator said: "Once you’re issued with the paper ticket, you must retain it for the duration of your journey."

Ms Seager, 44, said the bus driver refused to intervene and the officers refused to accept a timestamped transaction notification on her phone.

"I refused to pay again for a service I'd clearly already paid for," she said.

"I had heard nowhere about these rules or that these people were going to be getting on the bus and being very intimidating and not very lenient at all despite clear proof.

"It’s not about the money. It’s about being inclusive of everyone who comes to this city - whether you’re using the bus on a daily basis or visiting."

As a tutor of English as a second language, Ms Seager said she was concerned about her students who might be confused about the rule.

"When you've got these almost armour-wearing men getting on a bus and barking orders at you in a language you don’t understand, it can be very intimidating."
Ticket fraud

Revenue protection officers were introduced in both Norfolk and Suffolk in June to help crack down on fare dodging and support passengers and drivers.

The officers can fine passengers £50 if they do not produce a valid ticket or required identity pass.

Piers Marlow, managing director of First Bus in the East of England, said: "The unfortunate reality is ticket fraud does happen on our buses and we have introduced revenue protection officers to help with this issue."

[bobm]

Perhaps it is just me - but I thought it was common knowledge to keep hold of the ticket, or what is the point of printing it?

[Chris from Nailsea]

This news item is from the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page), at https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdrd36j2ervo

[Mark A]

There's a lot of variation in the circumstances in which a ticket will be issued though - between bus companies and even on the same bus.

*Diamondcard passes, nope.
*Touchcard, nope.
*Ticket on phone, nope.
*Cash, yup.
*Payment via a rfid transaction and a phone, perhaps.
*Payment using a debit card, can't recall.

This doesn't sound to be as wild as... certain car park arrangements (and we don't know if this story had two sides) but this is sounding like a customer service fail - the passenge had paid and could produce evidence that she had paid - also, possibly, a problematic relationship between them and the member of staff driving the bus and taking the fares (which is one of the more underrated jobs and if both are experienced they'll know where the actual fare dodging is happening. On London's buses it's often very visible even to other passengers and is really annoying)

Mark

Mark

[ChrisB]

For all we know, the driver asked the passenger to take her  ticket, and she chose not to. Maybe her hands were full. Nut the T&Cs (which she accepted by paying for travel) require her to be in possession of a ticket while travelling. Not the companys fault if the passenger refuses to read the T&cs. she chose to get on the bus.

[Surrey 455]

For all we know, the driver asked the passenger to take her  ticket, and she chose not to. Maybe her hands were full. Nut the T&Cs (which she accepted by paying for travel) require her to be in possession of a ticket while travelling. Not the companys fault if the passenger refuses to read the T&cs. she chose to get on the bus.

Boarding would be very slow if you had to read and agree T&Cs when buying on the bus. Were they on display?

[Surrey 455]

There's a lot of variation in the circumstances in which a ticket will be issued though - between bus companies and even on the same bus.

*Diamondcard passes, nope.
*Touchcard, nope.
*Ticket on phone, nope.
*Cash, yup.
*Payment via a rfid transaction and a phone, perhaps.
*Payment using a debit card, can't recall.

This doesn't sound to be as wild as... certain car park arrangements (and we don't know if this story had two sides) but this is sounding like a customer service fail - the passenge had paid and could produce evidence that she had paid - also, possibly, a problematic relationship between them and the member of staff driving the bus and taking the fares (which is one of the more underrated jobs and if both are experienced they'll know where the actual fare dodging is happening. On London's buses it's often very visible even to other passengers and is really annoying)

Mark

Mark

*Payment using a debit card
TfL^» (Transport for London - about), More bus, Brighton & Hove - NO
Falcon Bus (Surrey) - YES

From memory in recent months, First bus in Bristol I think was also a no. Stagecoach in Hastings I can't remember.
Perhaps if you have to tell the driver where you are getting off, you get a ticket?

[bobm]

My point was more that if you are issued with a ticket it would make sense to retain it.

[didcotdean]

First bus do offer tap on / off arrangements in some areas which don't involve paper tickets.

The report though is unclear as to what happened to the paper ticket, ie was it lost, never picked up, even never properly issued etc.

[Chris from Nailsea]

For all we know, the driver asked the passenger to take her ticket, and she chose not to. Maybe her hands were full. Nut the T&Cs (which she accepted by paying for travel) require her to be in possession of a ticket while travelling. Not the companys fault if the passenger refuses to read the T&cs. she chose to get on the bus.

... as David Redgewell tried to do, in his wheelchair, at Bath.  But perhaps I'm being contentious here. 

CfN. 

[grahame]

I keep being reminded of

* that report we looked at elsewhere that put non-payment of public transport fares into four categories ranging from complete accident and didn't know the rules through opportunistic avoidance to systematic evasion

* the differences that there are from one method of payment to another and from one operator to another, making it very hard to know what the rules actually are

* the answering of a different question to the one asked when public transport operators are challenged. In this case, I see a defence of the principle of having revenue protection officers and not an answer to why they seem to have taken enforcement action on an accidental failure to pick up a paper ticket.  And I am reminded of asking a certain TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) what they are going to do to improve train reliability, but what I hear is an admission that they have a problem and and explanation of how it came about.

[rogerpatenall]

If RPOs accept either a ticket or a time validated transaction on the phone, you are surely opening the door for two people to travel for the one payment (If they were so inclined).