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Author Topic: Collision between two trains at Llanbrynmair, in Powys, Wales - 21 October 2024  (Read 8307 times)
Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #15 on: October 22, 2024, 14:06:10 »

I've moved and merged a couple of topics here, simply in the interests of clarity and continuity.

CfN.  Smiley
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William Huskisson MP (Member of Parliament) was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830.  Many more have died in the same way since then.  Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.

"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner."  Discuss.
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« Reply #16 on: October 22, 2024, 14:32:34 »

That rail line will likely be carrying more people than usual from the end of the month as the A470 will close until just before Christmas to repair its issue with the retaining wall, and will not fully open until February, more below from the highway authority.

Mark

https://traffic.wales/current-projects/a470-talerddig-retaining-wall-works
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« Reply #17 on: October 22, 2024, 18:06:18 »



I should not start reading anything into Network Rail "inspecting" rather than "repairing" the track should I ...



Routine practice for the area to be inspected by senior engineers who will highlight any areas of concern to RAIB (Rail Accident Investigation Branch), repairs will not commence until after RAIB have completed their site investigation
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« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2024, 23:31:22 »

The RAIB (Rail Accident Investigation Branch) have put out an initial notice of their investigation. As well as the usual procedural stuff, it contains:
Quote
At around 19:26 on the evening of 21 October 2024, the 18:31 Transport for Wales passenger service from Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth collided with another train on Network Rail’s Cambrian line, approximately 800 metres west of the passing loop located at Talerddig, Powys. Initial evidence suggests that collision occurred at a speed of approximately 24 km/h (15 mph). The second train involved was the 19:09 Machynlleth to Shrewsbury passenger service, also operated by Transport for Wales.

One passenger tragically died and four other people were seriously injured. Eleven more people sustained injuries which required hospital treatment.
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RAIB’s initial inspection of the track on approach to the point of collision found evidence that wheel/rail adhesion was relatively low, suggesting that the train may have entered into wheel slide when braking. This will be an area of ongoing investigation.
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anthony215
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« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2024, 23:44:53 »

Tfw shut the heart of wales line for most of today due to railhead conditions.  One service which did partially run took an hour or more to travel a section of track timed to take 8 minutes.

Tfw got 158838 at Barton hill in Bristol think they'll be happy to get that's back into service
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infoman
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« Reply #20 on: October 23, 2024, 06:56:30 »

I presume that when the time comes to lift the coach's off the rails,

it will be done with heavy lift road cranes.

Having said that,they may be moved away to the sidings area to await further removable.

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Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #21 on: October 23, 2024, 16:26:46 »

From the BBC» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page):

Quote
Passenger who died in mid Wales train crash named

A man who died after the train he was travelling on collided with another train in mid Wales has been named locally as Tudor Evans.

He was in his 60s and from the Aberystwyth area of Ceredigion.

Four other people were seriously injured in the crash near Llanbrynmair, Powys, on Monday evening, and a further 11 required hospital treatment, according to the Rail Accident Investigations Branch (RAIB (Rail Accident Investigation Branch)).

British Transport Police said it did not currently believe his death was as a result of injuries sustained in the crash.

Mr Evans had been travelling on the 18:31 westbound service from Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth on Monday evening when it hit a stationary train heading from Machynlleth to Shrewsbury.

On initial inspection, the RAIB found that the train may have entered into wheel slide when braking.

It said initial evidence suggested the collision occurred at a speed of approximately 24km/h (15mph).

Transport for Wales (TfW) chief operating officer Jan Chaudhry van der Velde said a full report would take several months to be processed.

Politicians sent their thoughts to train crash victims during prime minister's questions on Wednesday.

Speaking in the House of Commons, Deputy Prime Minister Angela Rayner sent her "condolences to those affected by the train crash in Powys".

Deputy leader of the opposition Oliver Dowden echoed her comments about the crash.
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William Huskisson MP (Member of Parliament) was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830.  Many more have died in the same way since then.  Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.

"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner."  Discuss.
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« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2024, 18:37:32 »

The crumpled state of one cab is clear. I wonder why one cab suffered such damage whilst the other cab looks almost undamaged.

It doesn't look that bad to me.  It looks like the left hand drivers side cab panel (as we look at it) has partly broken off and is hanging loose, along with the roof section but the damage is largely superficial and in keeping with what you'd expect from a 15 mph impact speed.  There may also be damage to the underframe of course, which we can't see. 

Visible damage is a good thing of course as it means that energy that has been absorbed and not transferred through the whole train.  The driver is in the most vulnerable position of course, but the front cab of that unit doesn't appear to have been pushed back too far by the impact. 

We can't see the other side of the other unit to see if that suffered similar damage on the opposite side, but a difference in the extent of the damage might be explained by the fact that one unit was moving and the other stationary during the collision.
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« Reply #23 on: October 23, 2024, 19:47:33 »

According to some sources the driver of the unit that was sliding left his cab before impact and warned passengers of the impending collision.
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Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #24 on: October 26, 2024, 02:27:47 »

I'm quoting this, in full, from the BBC» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page), without comment:

Quote
On board the 18:31 to Aberystwyth as it smashed into another train



On Monday evening, Jonah Evans was relaxing on a train, watching a Netflix drama and completely unaware he was about to be involved in a fatal train crash.

"The driver comes running through the doors and shouts ‘brace yourselves, brace yourselves, we're going to hit another train’," says the 25-year-old.

He had just seconds to get into position before impact.  "I was thinking… ‘it’s been a good ride, it's been a good life’."

One passenger died, four were seriously injured and a further 11 people required hospital treatment following the crash.

The artist and graphic designer had just spent a weekend celebrating his birthday with friends in Bristol and was heading home to Borth, Ceredigion, when the crash happened at about 19:30 BST.

He says that after his train hit a stationary one, everything felt like it was in slow motion.

Passengers on the 18:31 westbound service from Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth, were thrown from their seats. Mr Evans was uninjured, apart from whiplash.

"Seeing all those people upset was horrible.... it kind of feels like a fever dream," he says.

"This one girl was really crying out, she was at a table seat and it proper hit her in the middle of her body and she started throwing up," he says.  "She started crying quite a lot... it was pretty horrendous."

He recalled seeing people around him with rib injuries, one person with a dislocated or broken arm and another person who had lost some teeth.

Another passenger Bethan Evans, who was knocked unconscious on the same train as Mr Evans, recalled seeing waking up to find passengers "flown out of their seats".

"The last thing I remember is reading one of my books and looking at the time," she says.  "I saw a few people with broken bones and hearing emergency CPR being called and a lot of staff running down."

Anthony Hurford, who was on the other train - the 19:09 train from Machynlleth to Shrewsbury - found himself on the floor "wondering what the hell had happened".

"The word that keeps coming to my head is just brutal really," he told BBC Breakfast.  "Somehow my body bent the leg of a table and ripped it off its bolts attached to the wall.  Suddenly I was on the floor with my laptop strewn ahead of me."

Tudor Evans, 66, from Capel Dewi in Aberystwyth, Ceredigion, who was in the second carriage, died following the crash - which happened near the village of Llanbrynmair in Powys.

On Thursday, his friend Iestyn Leyshon told the Newyddion S4C app that he and his wife had "just begun to travel after years of work and then this tragedy happens".

The couple were returning from a holiday in Italy at the time of the crash.  His family have thanked people for "kind messages and support", and asked for privacy.

How did the trains crash?



The crash happened on the Cambrian Line on a single track, close to a passing loop where opposite travelling trains can pass each other.

The Rail Accident Investigation Branch (RAIB (Rail Accident Investigation Branch)) said initial evidence suggested the crash occurred at a speed of approximately 24 km/h (15 mph).

It said it had deployed a team of inspectors to the site and on initial inspection found evidence that wheel to rail adhesion was relatively low, suggesting the train may have entered into wheel slide when braking.  It said low adhesion would be an area of ongoing investigation.  But what is low adhesion?

"That’s the jargony way of saying that the trains’ wheels are not gripping the top of the rail properly so you’re getting a sliding situation," says rail engineer and rail and transport writer Gareth Dennis.  "So if the breaks are being applied the train is just sliding along on top of the rail."

He says it could be caused by fallen leaves "or sometimes you get very strange combinations of mist and rain that can end up creating a bit of an oily surface on top of the rail head and that’s extremely slippery.  What will be interesting is understanding why we got to a situation where the rail was so slippery as a train hit another train," he says.  "We have systems in place to prevent that from happening and those haven’t worked so we ned to understand why and that might require some introspection from the industry."

How common are train crashes in the UK (United Kingdom)?


A full report into the crash is expected to take several months

“The reason rail incidents become big news like this is because they’re extremely rare events and that’s a good thing," says Mr Dennis.

The National Rail website states that train travel "remains one of the safest modes of transport in Great Britain".

One of the UK's most high-profile train accidents of last year was in September 2023, when the Flying Scotsman collided with stationary carriages at Aviemore Station in the Scottish Highlands, injuring two people.

The last train crash in Wales happened in 1991 inside the Severn Tunnel, which allows travel between south-west England and south Wales.  On 7 December, 1991, the 08:30 from London Paddington to Cardiff Central was stopped at a signal at the tunnel’s entrance.  The train’s driver was advised of a signal failure and told to proceed with caution, but about three miles into the tunnel, it was rear-ended by a class 155 Sprinter travelling from Portsmouth to Cardiff.  A total of 185 people were injured in the collision, five of whom were seriously hurt.

It is not yet clear when we will find out exactly what happened on Monday.

Network Rail's route director, Nick Millington, says the investigation is going to be "complex".

TfW chief operating officer Jan Chaudhry-van der Velde says a full report would take several months to be processed.

Mr Dennis says it is imperative the public were given clear answers.

"To reassure the public the industry needs to be honest, not hide behind 'well the regulator said this, the regulator said that' and be honest with the public about how this has happened," he says.

He says after the RAIB gives its final report the industry should "respond constructively and in a way that shows some contrition that something has gone wrong".

"Because something has gone wrong here," he says.  "For there to be two trains crashing into one another and resulting people being injured and worse, something has gone wrong."


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William Huskisson MP (Member of Parliament) was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830.  Many more have died in the same way since then.  Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.

"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner."  Discuss.
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« Reply #25 on: October 26, 2024, 18:39:04 »

From Railnews

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Trains are expected to start running again on the Cambrian line between Machynlleth and Shrewsbury on Monday.

Buses have been replacing trains since last Monday, when two Transport for Wales trains collided head-on near Talerddig passing loop.

One man died and fifteen other passengers were injured, four of them seriously, when a westbound train overran the loop and collided with an eastbound train. It has been reported that the man who lost his life had suffered a heart attack.

Article continues including more details of re-opening steps
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« Reply #26 on: October 26, 2024, 22:58:37 »

I presume they have had to repair a pair of busted points that the sliding train busted through on its way out of the loop, in which it was scheduled to stop; unless they are trailable by design
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« Reply #27 on: October 27, 2024, 16:26:22 »

So why don't these trains have an electromagnetic brake?
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infoman
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« Reply #28 on: October 27, 2024, 17:40:05 »

Not seen anything saying if the coach's were removed by rail or road.
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stuving
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« Reply #29 on: October 27, 2024, 18:13:42 »

So why don't these trains have an electromagnetic brake?

For a short answer, from an operator that uses them:
Quote
NS, the Dutch rail operator, identify the advantages as:
- roughening / cleaning of the rail (also for following trains);
- improved performance of the normal brakes;
- improved train detection.
They identify the disadvantages as:
- uncomfortable brake force when activated;
- wear of railhead;
- a speed dependent brake force;
- safety acceptance (variant / geography dependent);
- high maintenance costs.
[From Managing Low Adhesion, the AWG Manual, Sixth Edition, DRG January 2018]

In other words, they have advantages and disadvantages. And, not being established practice here, they have an acceptability (or inertia) hump to get over. 
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