no trains between Ebbsfleet and St Pancras

[whole diary]

[infoman]

due to flooding in the tunnel/s at Ebbsfleet,Simon Calder is at St Pancras reporting LIVE for BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) breakfast news.

[stuving]

Southeastern put a video out on (e)X(Twitter) yesterday that shows it's a leaking pipe. I guess that's their way of saying "look, it's not our fault!".

[JayMac]

Highlights the folly of having international stations no longer taking international passengers.

Eurostar services could have run to and from Ashford International, where passengers could've transferred to classic lines services to continue their journey.

[bradshaw]

From Sky News

  Thames Water explains cause of flooded tunnel
Thames Water has issued a statement explaining the cause of the flooded railway tunnel that has caused major disruption to Eurostar and Southeastern services today.
The flooding happened at a tunnel near Ebbsfleet International station in Kent.
  A Thames Water spokesperson said it believed the incident was related to "a fire control system and not a Thames Water pipe/asset, however we have a technician on the way to offer support to control the flow of water".

"We will continue to monitor the situation and offer support where needed," the spokesperson added.

[grahame]

Reminded me of this ... from https://thebrunelmuseum.com/1828-tunnel-flood/ - the first Thames Tunnel that became a part of the East London line between Shadwell and Wapping

On this [12th January] day in 1828, the Thames Tunnel flooded for the second time, badly injuring and nearly killing young Isambard Kingdom Brunel, and bringing an end to the lives of six other men working on the project.

The workers Isambard had been assisting with shoring, Collins and Ball, did not make it out alive. They were later found crushed under the bricklaying platform. Isambard managed to get free, but the tunnel was rapidly filling with water. He called out to make for the shaft, nearly 600ft of tunnel away, as he struggled in that direction through the watery darkness.

Thank Goodness that the leak in the new Thames Tunnel seems nothing like this ...

[Oxonhutch]

Highlights the folly of having international stations no longer taking international passengers.

Eurostar services could have run to and from Ashford International, where passengers could've transferred to classic lines services to continue their journey.

Even if Ashford/Ebbsfleet cannot handle outgoing passengers, all of those currently stuck in Paris could be brought home.

[Mark A]

Reminded me of this ... from https://thebrunelmuseum.com/1828-tunnel-flood/ - the first Thames Tunnel that became a part of the East London line between Shadwell and Wapping

On this [12th January] day in 1828, the Thames Tunnel flooded for the second time, badly injuring and nearly killing young Isambard Kingdom Brunel, and bringing an end to the lives of six other men working on the project.

...

Thank Goodness that the leak in the new Thames Tunnel seems nothing like this ...

It's amazing that Marc Brunel's Thames Tunnel carries trains and didn't rapidly fall to bits within the first weeks. Presumably it's that the lining's in compression and the ground through which it runs doesn't have too many nasties, but even so.

It put me in mind of Big Big Train's "The First Rebreather", their account, in song of all things, of Alexander Lambert's one-man mission to rescue the Severn Tunnel's workings.

Thank Goodness that the leak in the new Thames Tunnel seems nothing like that either!

Mark

https://www.bigbigtrain.com/about-the-new-songs-the-first-rebreather/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDDDQD5yHdk

[Mark A]

Highlights the folly of having international stations no longer taking international passengers.

Eurostar services could have run to and from Ashford International, where passengers could've transferred to classic lines services to continue their journey.

Wondering if that was a Eurostar contingency plan that was actionable before all the turbulence prompted the decision to close both.

I'm also wondering how frequently a comparatively recently built high speed line suffers disruption related to the way it's built - and also, for the HS1^▸ (High Speed line 1 - St Pancras to Channel Tunnel) Thames Tunnel, the provision of a sump and the scale of its capacity, perhaps the provision was on the assumption that they structure stayed essentially dry save for things like condensation.

Mark

[1st fan]

Before High Speed 1 (HS1^▸ (High Speed line 1 - St Pancras to Channel Tunnel)) and the move to St Pancras, the alternative/emergency station for international arrivals was Kensington Olympia. Drivers would use Factory Junction to reach the West London Line that way. The station had immigration facilities in the form of buildings in the Motorail car park. Don’t think with the move they can use that now. Also I think the immigration buildings are also now used for another purpose, car rental offices springs to mind.

[ChrisB]

And what would the cost have been to keep the International side fully operational but on standby? Having Border Force staff on permanent stand-by but doing nothing? How many days would the station have been used since it was mothballed?

Whatever additional costs would have to have gone on higher fares & would likely have E* folded completely.

[Electric train]

From Sky News

  Thames Water explains cause of flooded tunnel
Thames Water has issued a statement explaining the cause of the flooded railway tunnel that has caused major disruption to Eurostar and Southeastern services today.
The flooding happened at a tunnel near Ebbsfleet International station in Kent.
  A Thames Water spokesperson said it believed the incident was related to "a fire control system and not a Thames Water pipe/asset, however we have a technician on the way to offer support to control the flow of water".

"We will continue to monitor the situation and offer support where needed," the spokesperson added.

Fire mains in railway tunnels are kept "wet" and under pressure usually by a header tank and pump system located in the tunnels' Head House, this is where the Water Company main supply is to top up the tank.

This will be embarrassing for NRHS Maintainenance Ltd, they should know how to shut the fire main off.

[Electric train]

Before High Speed 1 (HS1^▸ (High Speed line 1 - St Pancras to Channel Tunnel)) and the move to St Pancras, the alternative/emergency station for international arrivals was Kensington Olympia. Drivers would use Factory Junction to reach the West London Line that way. The station had immigration facilities in the form of buildings in the Motorail car park. Don’t think with the move they can use that now. Also I think the immigration buildings are also now used for another purpose, car rental offices springs to mind.

The class 374 (Eurostar e320) are built to European loading gauge so cannot run on normal UK^▸ (United Kingdom) lines, also they do not have shoe gear for third rail and have never been fitted with the UK signalling systems (AWS^▸ (Automatic Warning System), TPWS^▸ (Train Protection and Warning System)).  Even the class 373 (the original Eurostar trains) no longer have shoe gear or the UK signalling systems (AWS, TPWS).

The link from just South of Ebbsfleet to the SR^‡(resolve) has been mothballed by HS1 and is not functional.

And what would the cost have been to keep the International side fully operational but on standby? Having Border Force staff on permanent stand-by but doing nothing? How many days would the station have been used since it was mothballed?

Whatever additional costs would have to have gone on higher fares & would likely have E* folded completely.

Its not just Border Force staff its Eurostar staff, security systems and general maintainenance of the station facilities  to keep it safe for use.

Passangers have been inconvenienced but are safe, delays similar to this happen all the time with airlines

[JayMac]

And what would the cost have been to keep the International side fully operational but on standby? Having Border Force staff on permanent stand-by but doing nothing? How many days would the station have been used since it was mothballed?

Whatever additional costs would have to have gone on higher fares & would likely have E* folded completely.

In this particular instance the border control staff need only be redeployed from St Pancras to temporarily reopen the mothballed facilities at Ashford.

[ChrisB]

I think the unions may have something to say about that - and maybe the Home Office too.

[ellendune]

Think of the cost for a once in ? use?  Would have to be added to ticket prices.