Devon and Cornwall resignalling

[whole diary]

[TonyK]

I still find it hard to understand the logic of a mixture of old mechanical signalling with that of a modern network all controlled from one ROC^▸ (Rail Operating Centre - a centralised location for railway signalling and train control operations for a specific route or region). It seems a "pig's ear" of a scheme to me and probably fraught with difficulties.

You need a £100 million computer system, lots of LED lights, a GSM radio system with capability for transmission of telemetry data at high speed, a whistle, a flag and some large bangy things to stick on the rails when it's foggy, so the driver of the £50 million train knows that there's a broken down steam engine ahead.

[broadgage]

And so that the driver of a steam engine knows that there is a broken down £50  million new train ahead !

[paul7575]

This has developed into a thread with two halves hasn’t it? Until sometime in January it was about a future resignalling project due to complete in 2023.  Has work actually started on that?

Then from post 17 onwards it was suddenly all about day to day faults, theft or vandalism.

Are the two subjects actually related at all? 

Paul

[GBM]

Guilty as charged.
I didn't spot the REsignalling at the time of my first post.

So Mods, please split this into two if possible, perhaps with a title of Cornwall signalling problems? as the thefts have been in Cornwall.

[bobm]

Took a while to respond - but topics now split!

[DaveHarries]

I note that the list of engineering works due later this year on GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)'s website includes:
- 5th, 6th & 13th November: St. Austell to Penzance
- 19th & 20th November: Lostwithiel to St. Austell
- 05th - 08th December: Truro to Penzance, incl. St. Erth - St. Ives
- 27th - 30th January: Par to Newquay

I presume, without knowing for sure, that the works of November and December will be related to the resignalling in terms of installation of the replacement signals - - but I am not sure when the new setup is due to be commissioned. As for Par to Newquay this could also be for work on the same project to make a few alterations.

Dave

[GBM]

I saw a notice at Truro station a few days ago saying something about resignalling taking place between September 2022 and ? January 2023 to improve the service.

https://www.railengineer.co.uk/a-modular-approach-to-signalling-in-cornwall/
(Rather off topic, but interesting to read article https://www.lococarriage.org.uk/plykerno.html)

[DaveHarries]

I saw a notice at Truro station a few days ago saying something about resignalling taking place between September 2022 and ? January 2023 to improve the service.

https://www.railengineer.co.uk/a-modular-approach-to-signalling-in-cornwall/
(Rather off topic, but interesting to read article https://www.lococarriage.org.uk/plykerno.html)

Hence the closure dates in the post above yours. I have been told on another forum that the commissioning of the new system will not take place until November 2023 though which should give me time for a final photo trip at some point. The boxes at Lostwithiel, Par and Truro will be abolished but St. Blazey will remain and Goonbarrow Junction will have its mechanical workings replaced with a new panel. I have also heard that Newquay station will go back to having two platforms as well.

Dave

[TonyK]

I have also heard that Newquay station will go back to having two platforms as well.

Dave

Interesting - that would take a huge amount of work in addition to the signalling, wouldn't it?

[REVUpminster]

They want an hourly service to Newquay as part of a cross Cornwall metro to Falmouth.

[old original]

There's definitely a lot planned according to the Rail Engineer article (linked posted by GMB above or below whichever way you have your posts aligned!)
I hope the new passing loop planned on the Goss Moor on the Newquay branch is long enough for an IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train)!!

[DaveHarries]

Interesting - that would take a huge amount of work in addition to the signalling, wouldn't it?

I don't know. This photo from the Wikipedia site - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newquay_railway_station#/media/File:GWR_150234_at_Newquay.jpg - shows the redundant platform on the right, minus track, and I am quite sure that is still there. The requirement would be for new signals as well as track. There are a few closures coming up on the line (19th, 20th & 27th November 2022 + 27th - 30th January 2023) so some work might be done then but who knows. They may even leave it until the middle of next year: I have heard on another forum that the commissioning work for this resignalling scheme will start 1st November 2023 and not finish until the end of the month so I hope to take my camera down there before then.

Dave

[DaveHarries]

Evening all,

Thought I would bump this topic with a bit of an update. Anyone who uses the trains in Cornwall regularly will probably be aware that the semaphore system remains in place although work has been taking place of late with signs of new cables and signals going in. Earlier this year I heard that the changeover to the new system had been delayed again and was expected for sometime around March 2024.

GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)'s website now lists that engineering works in relation to the scheme are now scheduled for the following dates with bus replacement services as given.

- Sunday 10th September:
Plymouth to Penzance / Par to Newquay / Truro to Falmouth Docks
Trains to run on Gunnislake, St. Ives and Looe lines and also Penzance to St. Erth.

This one is listed as being for "rail improvement work" so maybe some general maintenance also but I suspect some work on the signalling will also be done.

- Tuesday 31st October to Sunday 05th November:
St. Austell and St. Erth; also between Truro and Falmouth Docks.

- Monday 06th November to Sunday 12th November:
06/11 to 10/11: Liskeard to St. Erth; also Newquay and Falmouth Docks lines.
11/11 to 12/11: Plymouth to St. Erth; also Looe, Newquay and Falmouth Docks lines

Those are given as being for the signalling work. The scheme will see the abolition of the signalboxes and semaphores at Lostwithiel, Par and Truro (a shame) but I had heard that the Liskeard signalbox and semaphores were safe. I wonder if the works on the Looe line relate to plans for the Lodge Farm and Terras crossings that would see them converted from open crossings to ABCL^▸ (Automatic Barrier Crossing Locally monitored).

Dave

[GBM]

Thank you Dave for that update.
Don't want to 'like' your post, as that implies I like the removal of semaphore signals (which I don't!).
Shame they are going, along with the characters who staffed the soon to be closed boxes.

That's progress I believe.
We look forward to 'signalling problems' similar to those in the Thames Valley 

[DaveHarries]

Thank you Dave for that update.
Don't want to 'like' your post, as that implies I like the removal of semaphore signals (which I don't!).
Shame they are going, along with the characters who staffed the soon to be closed boxes.

I am not keen on the removal of the semaphores either: even though mechanical signalling can act up a bit in hot weather (as I found out when a trainee signalman for a heritage railway) at least you don't get people pinching the cables! As for the boxes the ones at St. Blazey and Goonbarrow Junction will remain - someone told me on a Facebook group that Goonbarrow Jcn to Newquay will be worked by a panel but the area around Goonbarrow Junction and the line to St. Blazey will remain mechanical. I don't know the truth of that.

I have photos, externally, of the boxes at Par, Truro and Lostwithiel and will be down in Cornwall in a couple of weeks when I hope - without trespassing - to get a photo or two at Goonbarrow Junction. St. Blazey is impossible to snap though.

We look forward to 'signalling problems' similar to those in the Thames Valley 

TVSC^» (Thames Valley Signalling Centre - about) won't have a hand in things here. I have heard it suggested, more than once, that Thames Valley SCC^‡(resolve) will not be working anything south of the M5 overbridge at Bridgwater (near J24). Control for Lostwithiel to Truro will pass to a computerised workstation and will be located at Exeter.

Meanwhile I have also seen it mentioned on another forum that the eastern section of Plymouth PSB^▸ (Power Signal Box) - Totnes (excl.) to Hemerdon - is due to be resignalled in 2024 and that will be controlled from a new workstation to be housed at Plymouth PSB rather than from the Plymouth panel: among the alterations in connection with the Totnes - Hemerdon work will be the abolition of the loop on the Up Main at Hemerdon. The closest I get to signalling nowadays is playing a certain computer game.

Dave