Problems with IET trains from April 2021

[whole diary]

[a-driver]

From the National Rail website re: GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)

"Disruption is likely to continue into next week, and details of the timetable are currently being finalised. Please keep checking this page for updates".

I can see it going on a lot longer than that, I reckon months.

I’m guessing each train will need jacking up, stripping down to access crack, welding, reassembled and then certification (if the work requires substantial changes).
That’s got to be the best part of a week to do and 93 sets to complete. You don’t know if there’s a risk more issues aren’t discovered once the sets are stripped down either.

They’ve got to go all out on it. Getting everything back for the Summer is crucial.

[TaplowGreen]

From the National Rail website re: GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)

"Disruption is likely to continue into next week, and details of the timetable are currently being finalised. Please keep checking this page for updates".

I can see it going on a lot longer than that, I reckon months.

I’m guessing each train will need jacking up, stripping down to access crack, welding, reassembled and then certification (if the work requires substantial changes).
That’s got to be the best part of a week to do and 93 sets to complete. You don’t know if there’s a risk more issues aren’t discovered once the sets are stripped down either.

They’ve got to go all out on it. Getting everything back for the Summer is crucial.

That seems a fair assessment from someone "in the know", and the sooner that GWR are honest/realistic about it in order that people can make other plans, the better.

If it's "months" given that we're already halfway through May, it'll be a pretty ropey summer for the railways at best.

Let's hope the roads hold up.

[a-driver]

That seems a fair assessment from someone "in the know", and the sooner that GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) are honest/realistic about it in order that people can make other plans, the better.

If it's "months" given that we're already halfway through May, it'll be a pretty ropey summer for the railways at best.

Let's hope the roads hold up.

I imagine once they get a unit stripped down to discover the extent of the problem, get specialists in, get a scope of the works required together and get approval all round then I don’t think any accurate timescales can be given.
Each set could be different and require varying levels of work, some could be returned to traffic quite quickly. I’m guessing there’s a lot parties involved.... Hitachi, GWR, DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) etc etc.

Personally I don’t think you tell passengers it’ll be months then, after a through inspection, it’s deemed a large number of sets are safe and quickly returned to traffic. Passengers might ask questions as to how safe the trains are, won’t inspire confidence.

[Clan Line]

 "No cracks in here - we're all ready to go"



Today's Telelgraph

[grahame]

Remaining EMR^» (East Midlands Railway, also known as EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about) (East Midlands Trains) - about) High Speed Train's (HST^▸ (High Speed Train))s withdrawn this weekend.  Might we see them in the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) area from next week?

Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronym

[broadgage]

Remaining East Midlands Railway (EMR^» (East Midlands Railway, also known as EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about) (East Midlands Trains) - about)) High Speed Train's (HST^▸ (High Speed Train))s withdrawn this weekend.  Might we see them in the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) area from next week?

Hopefully, but with what are East Midlands Railway (EMR) replacing them ? if the replacements are IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train) or similar then East Midlands Railway (EMR) might want to hang onto the High Speed Train's (HST)s.

How many High Speed Train's (HST)s involved ?

Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronyms

[grahame]

Remaining EMR^» (East Midlands Railway, also known as EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about) (East Midlands Trains) - about) HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) withdrawn this weekend.  Might we see them in the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) area from next week?

Hopefully, but with what are EMR replacing them ?

Class 170 and 360 ... with previously diesel trains London - Corby running using 21 electric units.   There are plans for 810s (800 variants) but not yet.   They ARE getting there - down to just 2 sets this week, however they would need DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) derogation as they are drop window, slam door and I suspect dump-on-track trains.

[PhilWakely]

Remaining EMR^» (East Midlands Railway, also known as EMT^» (East Midlands Trains - about) (East Midlands Trains) - about) HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) withdrawn this weekend.  Might we see them in the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) area from next week?

It would be the logical choice, but I doubt they could be put to use straightaway. I am no expert on driver/guard qualifications, but I doubt that there are any GWR HSS^▸ (High Speed Services) drivers/guards who still sign full-length High Speed Train's (HST)s with slam doors. The East Midlands Railway (EMR) power cars are also subtly different, having MTU^▸ (Motor Traction Unit) engines I believe. GWR may obtain emergency derogation to use the slam door stock as part of their Castle fleet.

Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronyms

[TonyK]

Class 170 and 360 ... with previously diesel trains London - Corby running using 21 electric units.   There are plans for 810s (800 variants) but not yet.   They ARE getting there - down to just 2 sets this week, however they would need DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) derogation as they are drop window, slam door and I suspect dump-on-track trains.

DfT's concern with derogation would be that the trains would be a magnet for that small subset of rail enthusiast whose idea of heaven is to stick his head out of a train carriage at 125 mph, knowing that they will always miss any external object.

[a-driver]

DfT^» (Department for Transport - about)'s concern with derogation would be that the trains would be a magnet for that small subset of rail enthusiast whose idea of heaven is to stick his head out of a train carriage at 125 mph, knowing that they will always miss any external object.

Put simply. There is nothing else that can be put into service.  Potentially there could be more TM^‡(resolve)’s available which could mean that services could be at least double manned to mitigate against enthusiasts with a death wish.

I think all drivers and guards will still sign High Speed Train's (HST^▸ (High Speed Train))s irrespective of length. Training on slam door will potentially be the only thing TMs need. There obviously may be some new TMs who have never worked slam door stock.

Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronym

[PhilWakely]

From the National Rail website re: GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)

"Disruption is likely to continue into next week, and details of the timetable are currently being finalised. Please keep checking this page for updates".

I can see it going on a lot longer than that, I reckon months.

I’m guessing each train will need jacking up, stripping down to access crack, welding, reassembled and then certification (if the work requires substantial changes).
That’s got to be the best part of a week to do and 93 sets to complete. You don’t know if there’s a risk more issues aren’t discovered once the sets are stripped down either.

They’ve got to go all out on it. Getting everything back for the Summer is crucial.

That seems a fair assessment from someone "in the know", and the sooner that GWR are honest/realistic about it in order that people can make other plans, the better.

If it's "months" given that we're already halfway through May, it'll be a pretty ropey summer for the railways at best.

Let's hope the roads hold up.

With the Spring Bank Holiday and associated Summer Half Term break fast approaching; the Covid straightjacket now loose enough to permit staycation breaks, it will be interesting to see how many pax will still want to head to the South West on the train. It wouldn't surprise me if we will still see overcrowding on whatever services will be available.

[broadgage]

Agree, that is why obtaining extra stock, even if not compliant with every rule, is in my view urgent.
If Tornado is allowed to the West country on a charter, then why not daily ?
If a heritage diesel is allowed on a charter, then why not daily ?
Could not preserved DMUs^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) be used on West country branches ?

Time to start planning NOW rather than wait until the last minute and then "it might have been a possibility, but there was not time for all the paperwork/training/derogations/appeasing the RMT^▸ (National Union of Rail, Maritime & Transport Workers)."

[bobm]

Spent an hour at Swindon this morning at the tail end of the "rush hour".   I haven't been there at a similar time since the virus so hard to put things into perspective.

Around 30 got off an incoming Cross Country shuttle from Bristol Temple Meads.  A similar number caught a rare IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) to Reading and probably 40 or more for a 12 car 387 to Didcot Parkway, Reading and London Paddington.

[TonyK]

12-car EMU^▸ (Electric Multiple Unit) at Swindon - that could yet be the new normal, but it shows flexibilty.

[IndustryInsider]

There’s quite a bit of training and retraining taking place on Turbos and 387s, for TM^‡(resolve)’s especially, and plenty of hard work behind the scenes to secure any sensible* available additional stock from other operators.  All trains I have seen have been very quiet, though I expect there are a few busy ones running around, and people will return in their droves when summer and further loosening of restrictions take place.

In terms of returning to a normal service, I see no point wildly guessing until Hitachi have done the research to fully appreciate the issue, and can design and implement a fix.

* I doubt very much you’ll see Tornado, which even with Broadgage’s flights of fancy is somewhat of a stretch.  If you have a set of coaches then there are lots of far more sensible options to pull them!