Thinking outside the box on Covid 19 vaccinations

[whole diary]

[chuffed]

Nigel Harris in the same edition of RAIL as the  'Losing GRIP^▸ (Guide to Railway Investment Projects)' article, asks why local stations with all their unused rooms ( think Temple Meads!) could not be used as vaccination centres, and also why couldn't the mothballed IC125's be repurposed as utilised as mobile vaccination centres ( take out the seats, put up some screens.....). Just the sort of imaginative thinking we need in these insecure times.

[TaplowGreen]

Nigel Harris in the same edition of RAIL as the  'Losing GRIP^▸ (Guide to Railway Investment Projects)' article, asks why local stations with all their unused rooms ( think Temple Meads!) could not be used as vaccination centres, and also why couldn't the mothballed IC125's be repurposed as utilised as mobile vaccination centres ( take out the seats, put up some screens.....). Just the sort of imaginative thinking we need in these insecure times.

Because there are other, far more suitable facilities which don't need to be totally adapted first?

[froome]

Also, isn't there a limited number of people who can give people a vaccine? I thought there was a current shortage of nurses, and I'm not sure this is something you can just recruit people to do, though happy to be corrected on that.

[ChrisB]

Also, isn't there a limited number of people who can give people a vaccine? I thought there was a current shortage of nurses, and I'm not sure this is something you can just recruit people to do, though happy to be corrected on that.

It ha been reported that the St John Ambulance are going to train up people to administer vaccinations

[TaplowGreen]

Also, isn't there a limited number of people who can give people a vaccine? I thought there was a current shortage of nurses, and I'm not sure this is something you can just recruit people to do, though happy to be corrected on that.

It ha been reported that the St John Ambulance are going to train up people to administer vaccinations

WI too.......they're practising with knitting needles 😫

[Western Pathfinder]

Never Never underestimate the power of the WI...

[stuving]

Also, isn't there a limited number of people who can give people a vaccine? I thought there was a current shortage of nurses, and I'm not sure this is something you can just recruit people to do, though happy to be corrected on that.

It ha been reported that the St John Ambulance are going to train up people to administer vaccinations

I'm sure most GP surgeries use healthcare assistants for most of their routine injections, though for a big campaign like seasonal flu it's a matter of all (qualified) hands turning out. My flu jab was done by an HCA this year, by appointment, as I was due a dose of shingles as well.

There are arguments going on about whether HCAs get enough supervision when doing this, since it's a job with no requirements for entry and qualifications are all modular. They are trained in the physical skill of injections, but not un reading and understanding medical documents. For a mass injection campaign, that wouldn't be an issue. I can't find anything to say how many there are with the qualification, or what the capacity is to train a lot of people in a rush.

[broadgage]

As has already been said, an existing building is arguably more suited to use as a vaccination center than a train.
A train might be worth considering for remote areas, staff and supplies could remain on board as the train visits numerous stations.
A shortened HST^▸ (High Speed Train) would be ideal, perhaps three first class vehicles and a buffet for staff refreshments.

The vaccine that only needs refrigeration could be stored in one of the existing fridges.
If the vaccine that needs storage at minus 70 degrees is to be used, this would need to be stored in a dedicated vehicle with the windows removed or broken, or the doors removed.

A train with all the required supplies, welfare facilities, and staff on board is almost certainly easier to arrange than transporting everything required to numerous isolated locations.

For an urban area, a large existing public building is almost certainly the answer.

[grahame]

As has already been said, an existing building is arguably more suited to use as a vaccination center than a train.
A train might be worth considering for remote areas, staff and supplies could remain on board as the train visits numerous stations.

I'm not sure if even in remote areas there are enough sidings left to park the thing out of the way of operational services and accessible to the stream of people coming in for their jabs. UK^▸ (United Kingdom) comment - may work elsewhere in the world.

But having written that ... 3 days each at Thurso (bustitute the line), Lairg, Invergordon, Achnasheen (timetable changes to avoid crossing at these places), Kyle of Lochalsh, Mallaig, Glenfinnan, Oban ...

A shortened HST^▸ (High Speed Train) would be ideal, perhaps three first class vehicles and a buffet for staff refreshments.

Or a trolley to allow for social distancing? 

[TaplowGreen]

As has already been said, an existing building is arguably more suited to use as a vaccination center than a train.
A train might be worth considering for remote areas, staff and supplies could remain on board as the train visits numerous stations.
A shortened HST^▸ (High Speed Train) would be ideal, perhaps three first class vehicles and a buffet for staff refreshments.

The vaccine that only needs refrigeration could be stored in one of the existing fridges.
If the vaccine that needs storage at minus 70 degrees is to be used, this would need to be stored in a dedicated vehicle with the windows removed or broken, or the doors removed.

A train with all the required supplies, welfare facilities, and staff on board is almost certainly easier to arrange than transporting everything required to numerous isolated locations.

For an urban area, a large existing public building is almost certainly the answer.

Blimey you even managed to get a buffet into this subject!

How about a Vaccination special Pullman.....the nurse could creep up behind diners and slip the needle into the buttock during the main course (rump steak?) You wouldn't feel a thing! 😂

[broadgage]

transporting everything required to numerous isolated locations.


Blimey you even managed to get a buffet into this subject!

How about a Vaccination special Pullman.....the nurse could creep up behind diners and slip the needle into the buttock during the main course (rump steak?) You wouldn't feel a thing! 😂

Yes but the buffet would be only for the medical and support staff, to enable provision of light meals, chilled soft drinks, and hot drinks.
Not available to the public, so does not count as a "broadgage approved Buffet"

[IndustryInsider]

Nothing wrong with a bit of thinking outside of the box of course, but this thread sounds like a solution looking for a problem.

[stuving]

Nothing wrong with a bit of thinking outside of the box of course, but this thread sounds like a solution looking for a problem.

Indeed. Talking of boxes, why does everyone think that the low temperature storage is such an issue? For one thing a day's supply can be kept in a fridge, since it lasts a few days like that. Distributing what are hardly bulky new supplies won't be a big issue either. Storage for more than a couple of days comes down to supplies of dry ice. We've got enough of that, haven't we?

Not only do Pfizer have small insulated boxes that can maintain the required temperature of -70^oC for as long as ten days, but I've got one that could do three days. It was made ages ago, to store freezer contents for a couple of hours during defrosting. Filled with 30 kg of dry ice, it should last for 72 hours before that all sublimes. And that was cobbled together from a removers' box, a smaller inner box, some expanded polystyrene sheets and glue, and loft insulation to fill the gap between inner and outer box!


Mind you, there is a big question still unanswered about that low temperature  - why?

[MVR S&T]

The low temprature, possibly indicates, there is some form of living, er virus in it, which has to be stoped from replicating, until in the body?

[broadgage]

The very low temperatures needed to preserve one of the vaccines can be maintained by use of liquid nitrogen, or just about by dry ice.
Both are readily available.
Neither dry ice nor liquid nitrogen should be conveyed in any type of enclosed vehicle, including railway vehicles.
Suitable road vehicles include open pick up trucks, or other trucks with the cab completely separated from the load area, clear air space required between cab and load area. Small amounts may be conveyed by motorcycle.

Suitable rail vehicles include open wagons, very well ventilated livestock wagons, or passenger vehicles with the doors removed, or secured open if still in gauge thus.
Decades ago I observed large liquid nitrogen containers being moved in an otherwise empty passenger train. In the luggage van with the inward opening doors secured open.
Guard to ride in rear cab.

Neither material should be taken into an enclosed lift with any person in the lift. Can be sent in an otherwise empty lift.