Contactless Payment on GWR services to Reading

[whole diary]

[stuving]

There are now leaflets available at Reading explaining contactless - though in reality they are about contactless PAYG^▸ (Pay as you go), and do not take care to distinguish the two as TfL^» (Transport for London - about) do. Of course they can say that from Reading the two are the same thing as Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) isn't usable, but there are aspects of PAYG they just don't mention. And I'm sure some of what they say is only true to/from Paddington, such as the evening peak times. And no - it's not just my scanner; the paper does have a blue cast the the green isn't GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) green.

[stuving]

That leaflet (more of a card, really) directs you to tfl.gov.uk/modes/tfl-rail, but you need to poke about somewhat to find the relevant extra details. One thing I found there is this page, which explains capping for trips in the Reading-Iver zoneless zone:National Rail fares, caps and Travelcards beyond Zone 9.

You can use contactless (card or device) or an Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) card to pay as you go for travel to and from:

    Broxbourne, Rye House, St. Margarets, Ware and Hertford East,
    Gatwick Airport, Merstham, Redhill, Earlswood, Salfords and Horley
    Ockendon, Chafford Hundred, Purfleet and Grays
    Epsom
    Cuffley, Bayford and Hertford North
    Radlett and Potters Bar

You can only use contactless (card or device) to pay as you go for travel to and from:

    Brookmans Park, Welham Green, Hatfield and Welwyn Garden City
    St Albans City, Harpenden and Luton Airport Parkway
    Iver, Langley, Slough, Burnham, Taplow, Maidenhead, Twyford and Reading

Journeys to or from these stations aren't included in caps.

That says (I think) that the caps applying to the rest of the network still operate, but journeys into the elsewhere zone are not counted in them. However, there is something so like capping that everyone - except TfL^» (Transport for London - about) - is going to call it that:

If you use contactless (card or device) to travel to or from Reading or Iver and you travel in Zones 1-6, we'll automatically refund the difference if a Day Travelcard was cheaper. Refunds may take up to 14 days.

Station	Anytime Day Travelcard	Off-peak Day Travelcard
Iver	£21.00	£14.00
Langley Berks	£23.50	£14.90
Slough	£24.30	£15.50
Burnham Bucks	£26.80	£16.20
Taplow	£29.40	£17.30
Maidenhead	£30.70	£17.90
Twyford	£36.10	£21.40
Reading	£55.90	£26.00

Obviously that should read Reading to Iver inclusive.

Presumably it's not called capping because many of the things they say about capping don't apply to it. However, I think it will need a name of some kind, needed even to talk about that kind of distinction.

[Surrey 455]

You can use contactless (card or device) or an Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) card to pay as you go for travel to and from:...
    Epsom

But you can't use an SWR^» (South Western Railway - about) touch card even though their trains call there.

Well, you can but you have to show it to the gateline staff who know that the barriers do not work properly.

[BBM]

Geoff Marshall's latest video demonstrates how contactless split ticketing can save money by breaking a PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains)-RDG^‡(resolve) journey on TfL^» (Transport for London - about) Rail at SLO:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljN3xRWAkCE

[grahame]

Geoff Marshall's latest video demonstrates how contactless split ticketing can save money by breaking a PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains)-RDG^‡(resolve) journey on TfL^» (Transport for London - about) Rail at SLO:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljN3xRWAkCE

Interesting; really "just" splitting coming to TfL.   But if you split contactless you can't (in practise) stay on the same train as you have to swipe out and back in again.  Single peak fare, though, drops from £24.40 to £14.30.  If you split same journey, same way on paper tickets (no need to swipe out and back in, but much be on a train that calls) peak fare drops from a paper £25.90 to a paper £20.20. 

[eightf48544]

if you swipe in and Padd in the evening peak and get off and swipe out at Slough, Maidenhead, Twyford or Reading whta fare are you charged?

Looking at National Rail and doing a day retrun from Maidenhead to Padd leaving after 10:00 and returning after16:00 it gives me any out but it gives the 16:56 Padd Maidenehad at off Peak price, this train is shown as peak from Padd in the timetable!

Evne odder if you do similar timing for a return from Bourne End you get no services between15:56 and 18:49 from Padd. However, if you add via Taplow you get the Off Peak return fare for TFL^▸ (Transport for London) trains in the evening peak!

I'm baffled!

 

[stuving]

if you swipe in and Padd in the evening peak and get off and swipe out at Slough, Maidenhead, Twyford or Reading whta fare are you charged?

Looking at National Rail and doing a day retrun from Maidenhead to Padd leaving after 10:00 and returning after16:00 it gives me any out but it gives the 16:56 Padd Maidenehad at off Peak price, this train is shown as peak from Padd in the timetable!

Evne odder if you do similar timing for a return from Bourne End you get no services between15:56 and 18:49 from Padd. However, if you add via Taplow you get the Off Peak return fare for TFL^▸ (Transport for London) trains in the evening peak!

I'm baffled!

Or confused? I don't think the National Rail OJP^▸ (Online Journey Planner) knows anything about PAYG^▸ (Pay as you go) (including contactless); it will only tell you about "paper" tickets (covered by RSP rules). So you should pay the fares TfL^» (Transport for London - about)'s single fare finder shows (also given in BRFares with CPAY in the ticket name): for Slough that's £8.70.

As to the next bit ... that does seem odd; it's not a contradiction between GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)'s different versions as they all say the 18:56 is not allowed.

[stuving]

As to the next bit ... that does seem odd; it's not a contradiction between GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)'s different versions as they all say the 18:56 is not allowed.

I should modify that. Somebody has been tinkering! But one result is a new (I think) contradiction. Of course this isn't about contactless at all ... so the reply is here.

[johoare]

I paid by contactless the other day (Mai to Pad) when there was a ticket check and there was no way for them to check that I had paid it seems.. Though they did believe me and reminded me to touch out at Paddington

[autotank]

Just seen that capping has now been activated (and backdated) for contactless fares out west. A table has been put up on the excellent Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) Rail website:

https://www.oyster-rail.org.uk/2020/05/capping-to-reading-luton-airport-etc/

They don't seem particularly surprising and don't seem to offer any major savings over paper tickets - unless anyone can see anything I haven't (have to admit I have mainly looked at Twyford as that is where I will be commuting from soon).

[Oxonhutch]

Are there contactless readers on the platforms at Reading, or does one have to go over to the gateline to tap out? I will be transferring from an Elizabeth Line service there onto a Thames Valley local with only a few minutes to spare.

[Ralph Ayres]

I paid by contactless the other day (Mai to Pad) when there was a ticket check and there was no way for them to check that I had paid it seems.. Though they did believe me and reminded me to touch out at Paddington

The portable card reader keeps an encrypted record of your contactless card/device and the check is done later by the "back office" system; all the inspector has to do is allow the reader to read the card and doesn't need to believe you or not. If you hadn't touched in, your card would go on a naughty list later in the day and if you keep doing it then you'll find the card isn't accepted for travel at all, won't work gates or validators and may be flagged by the portable reader on a future journey at which point you will be treated as intentionally travelling ticketless so potentially up for prosecution rather than just a penalty fare.  Much like not buying a paper ticket, you might get away with not paying if you're lucky but the more you do it, the more likely you are to get caught.
 
The reminder to touch out is probably aimed at people who think that having been checked on the train there's no need to do anything at the end of the journey if your train happened to come into an ungated platform at Paddington.  As for an unchecked journey, if you don't touch out you'll generally be charged more than the correct fare to discourage attempts to play the system.