Gove floats scrapping HS2

[whole diary]

[grahame]

From Conservative Home

Gove floats scrapping HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) because he believes it to be a policy with a growing appeal

Amid all the whispering and jostling for position ahead of the expected leadership election – whenever it might come – it’s fascinating to see which particular topics are apparently being raised, and by which candidates. Brexit, of course, is the backdrop to just about everything at the moment, but one detail caught my eye in the weekend’s newspapers.

The eminently well-informed Tim Shipman recounted a visitation bestowed by Michael Gove upon a group of MPs^▸ (Member of Parliament) recently. As they dined, ‘The environment secretary sat down and began asking them leading questions about the future of the party. “He was blatantly fishing,” one said. “He asked, ‘How would you feel if we just dropped HS2 and spent the money on local transport links in the Midlands and the north?’’

[TaplowGreen]

From Conservative Home

Gove floats scrapping HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) because he believes it to be a policy with a growing appeal

Amid all the whispering and jostling for position ahead of the expected leadership election – whenever it might come – it’s fascinating to see which particular topics are apparently being raised, and by which candidates. Brexit, of course, is the backdrop to just about everything at the moment, but one detail caught my eye in the weekend’s newspapers.

The eminently well-informed Tim Shipman recounted a visitation bestowed by Michael Gove upon a group of MPs^▸ (Member of Parliament) recently. As they dined, ‘The environment secretary sat down and began asking them leading questions about the future of the party. “He was blatantly fishing,” one said. “He asked, ‘How would you feel if we just dropped HS2 and spent the money on local transport links in the Midlands and the north?’’

Good idea.

[Kernow Otter]

Hmmm. 'Local transport links in the Midlands and the North'.  When will any politician realise that there are equally large pockets of under investment in the South West. 

[grahame]

Hmmm. 'Local transport links in the Midlands and the North'.  When will any politician realise that there are equally large pockets of under investment in the South West. 

What is the proportion of marginal constituencies in each of the areas though?  Much of the South West remains as Tory heartland, and it has been suggested that the only question asked by the faithful down here when asked to jump to support a party policy is "how high".  Looking to capture more influence and votes to return to an overall Tory majority ... the Midlands and the North are likely to be the most productive areas, as the South West is already in the bag apart from isolated pockets.

[ChrisB]

And the WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line) is full, while the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) is not.

[Red Squirrel]

The GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line), as the name implies, is not a local transport link. Meanwhile Bristol has a public transport infrastructure that would make a banana republic blush; and vast swathes of Somerset, Devon and Cornwall are still in a post-Beeching state of shock fifty-five years on. Yes there is some investment in this area, and it is welcome, but even that has been cut back; and at Portishead the simplest reopening with a watertight business case makes glacial progress.

Trouble is, given that it's Gove we're talking about, I suspect what he really has in mind is to scrap HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) and not spent the money on anything at all..!

[ellendune]

The GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line), as the name implies, is not a local transport link. Meanwhile Bristol has a public transport infrastructure that would make a banana republic blush; and vast swathes of Somerset, Devon and Cornwall are still in a post-Beeching state of shock fifty-five years on. Yes there is some investment in this area, and it is welcome, but even that has been cut back; and at Portishead the simplest reopening with a watertight business case makes glacial progress.

Trouble is, given that it's Gove we're talking about, I suspect what he really has in mind is to scrap HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) and not spent the money on anything at all..!

Swindon is marginal perhaps we should push for Swindon to Didcot 4 track now!

[ChrisB]

The point being is that a strategic link to the north is worth far more in GDP than any local transport links are in total, for the same expenditure

[Red Squirrel]

The point being is that a strategic link to the north is worth far more in GDP than any local transport links are in total, for the same expenditure

The only way we'll know that for sure is to build it and find out; until then that's an opinion, not a fact.

Another opinion is that HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) will only serve to accelerate the process of hoovering up all the talent from The North, and that by investing in local links in the regions you could actually grow them to the point where they can make their own decisions and spend their own money, without the need to go careening down to London with a begging bowl every time they need five bob to mend a pothole.

[grahame]

And the WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line) is full, while the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) is not.

So the lack of capacity to stop any services at Royal Wootton Bassett to the east of the junction that we've been told about, and the lack of paths from Swindon to Foxhall, are porkies we have been fed to help kick ideas into the long grass are they?   No capacity issues even when Crossrail is fully up and running between Paddington and Reading?

[ChrisB]

We're talking long distance here. I don't think HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) will be stopping locally?....

[Red Squirrel]

Yes, we're talking about the merits of a non-stop line to the North versus local links, be they in the North or elsewhere. You say:

And the WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line) is full, while the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) is not.

...which seems to imply that you think adding capacity to the WCML is a higher priority than adding capacity to the GWML - but we are blurring distinctions here because HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) is supposed to free capacity on the WCML for more local traffic. In the end, and perhaps inevitably, we're just heading towards the same old debate about whether HS2's billions could be better spent elsewhere...

[ChrisB]

Yes, I think that's where others are trying to take this, agreed.

And I haven't yet seen any argument that tops the GDP argument...which this amount of monetary spend must involve, if only to stand a chance of recouping the investment.

|A similar argument to Plymouth's demand for a sub-3 hour journey time - to attract London0-ites to do business in the SW really, for those in the north overall, not just a small town in one county as mentioned above. THat amount of money has to be spent strategically, not on (n)imby projects.

[Bmblbzzz]

I guess Gove's trying to appeal not only to marginals in the North and Midlands but to rural constituencies along the path who fear $house price cancer.

[ChrisB]

Personally, I feel that Gove knows that his idea of Brexit is going top lose the country so many £billions that he's trying to recoup some of these £billions and actually, when it comes down to the local investment(s), it/they won't actually happen.....