GWR Overcrowding

[whole diary]

[Oberon]

I tried to catch the 0843 from Bath to Paddington today. It arrived as a 5 instead of 10 car IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) and was packed to the roof. So I patiently  waited half an hour and when the next service arrived, lo and behold it too was also a 5 car, but not quite so rammed. At the end of my day for the return journey I turned up at Paddington to catch the 1900hrs to Bristol. And guess what? It was yet another five car set filled choc a block  with passengers, many having to stand. And once it had started the train crept westward and took an age to get to Reading.

I feel truly sorry for the staff, the customer interface, who have to work for this dreadful GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) franchise. So much so that after over 60 years of travelling by train I am seriously thinking of walking away from the Great Western. I hope somebody can explain how a franchise can get as bad as this one obviously has. No doubt Chris Grayling and his sidekick Jo Johnson think this is an acceptable state of affairs, but I have a feeling those who have to endure these journeys day in, day out, are of a differing opinion. I certainly am

[CJB666]

For crowding you should try the early morning Hayes trains to Pad. Like the HConns from Pad. to Hayes in the evening. But TfL^» (Transport for London - about) will soon sort those out - its purple trains are built for standing room only like the cattle trains they are.

One guy who does suffer over-crowding is John McDonnell MP^▸ (Member of Parliament) (Lab) for Hayes & Harlington. He's no fan of GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway). In the past he's asked questions in the House for me when GWR or NR^» (Network Rail - home page) have screwed up. He's at: John MCDONNELL <john.mcdonnell.mp@parliament.uk>, Helen LOWDER <lowderh@parliament.uk>

[broadgage]

Welcome to the joys of 5 car DMUs^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) on what used to be an intercity route.

Longer trains are a future aspiration, and I have no doubt that in the future that some services will be full length. But don't count on it just yet.
Depends on how many units are out of passenger use for driver training.
Depends on how many units are delivered and on how many HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) are withdrawn.
And on the future reliability and availability of the new units.

[martyjon]

For crowding you should try the early morning Hayes trains to Pad. Like the HConns from Pad. to Hayes in the evening. But TfL^» (Transport for London - about) will soon sort those out - its purple trains are built for standing room only like the cattle trains they are.

One guy who does suffer over-crowding is John McDonnell MP^▸ (Member of Parliament) (Lab) for Hayes & Harlington. He's no fan of GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway). In the past he's asked questions in the House for me when GWR or NR^» (Network Rail - home page) have screwed up. He's at: John MCDONNELL <john.mcdonnell.mp@parliament.uk>, Helen LOWDER <lowderh@parliament.uk>

Asking questions is one thing but what has he done about the Statsi Security Policing of Station Parade at Hayes, ZILCH.

[martyjon]

A while ago I posted on this forum of an occasion when a 5 car IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) (800 004) arrived into platform 4 at Bristol Parkway on test from North Pole depot. What I could only assume were regulars by the way they were talking to the platform staff, referring to him in christian name terms as he responded to the passengers likewise. Remarks were made by a female passenger about, "Is this the sign of things to come", "yes", replied the members of staff pointing out the length of the train as only 5 coaches, "Well how is it that we are promised more capacity with these new trains if they are only 5 coaches long". "Ah well that's the rub" replied the member of station staff, "we will have 4 services to London hourly when these are in passenger service which is 20 coaches as against 16 on the current 2 services per hour at present".

I've tried to look up that post without success to show that this situation was predicted by a station staff member at Bristol Parkway back when ?

[Timmer]

As I’ve said on another thread this short forming, for whatever reason, has negated the benefits of these new trains in the eyes of many passengers. Trains that have cost an absolute fortune.

Bet the people of South West England can’t wait to see IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train) replace their HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train).

[simonw]

Who in there right mind decided that all deliveries of the IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) trains would initially be 5-car units and not 9-car units?

The whole system is desperate  for extra capacity, and to reduce capacity for 12-18 months is less than sensible..

[grahame]

Who in there right mind decided that all deliveries of the IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) trains would initially be 5-car units and not 9-car units?

The whole system is desperate  for extra capacity, and to reduce capacity for 12-18 months is less than sensible..

No-one decided.   I think this is what happened ...

9 car units were to be first - electric trains ... but then when electrification fell behind and indeed has been curtailed, the order for them had to be modified to include diesel engines to make them bimode, which puts them behind the 5 car units in delivery as they were always going to be bimode ...

[TaplowGreen]

Who in there right mind decided that all deliveries of the IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) trains would initially be 5-car units and not 9-car units?

The whole system is desperate  for extra capacity, and to reduce capacity for 12-18 months is less than sensible..

No-one decided.   I think this is what happened ...

9 car units were to be first - electric trains ... but then when electrification fell behind and indeed has been curtailed, the order for them had to be modified to include diesel engines to make them bimode, which puts them behind the 5 car units in delivery as they were always going to be bimode ...

................so if this was the case, why were we promised all the wonders of additional capacity by GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)? I do not recall any of the Famous Five advertisements or other declarations from on high being tempered with the type of caveats to which you allude (and which I don't doubt are accurate!)

[stuving]

Who in there right mind decided that all deliveries of the IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train) trains would initially be 5-car units and not 9-car units?

The whole system is desperate  for extra capacity, and to reduce capacity for 12-18 months is less than sensible..

No-one decided.   I think this is what happened ...

9 car units were to be first - electric trains ... but then when electrification fell behind and indeed has been curtailed, the order for them had to be modified to include diesel engines to make them bimode, which puts them behind the 5 car units in delivery as they were always going to be bimode ...

Not so. The franchise agreement set out the delivery timetable (copied from the MARA^▸ (Master Availability and Reliability Agreement)):
5-car trains   25 May 2017 to 8 Feb 2018
9-car trains   15 Feb 2017 to 6 Jul 2018.

The HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) had a variety of lease end dates, which DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) promised would be adjusted to match the deliveries (but they didn't even hint how). The HSTs were not then going on to another ToC, so no doubt it was easy to say that. Mind you, I'm not sure DfT have a legal right say that:  we know they have droit de signataire over new leases, but can they dictate whether stock is removed from lease altogether?

At that stage (March 2015) the OLE^▸ (Overhead Line Equipment, more often "OHLE") was going be largely complete for the Dec 2017 timetable, with only Swansea to follow. So there would be plenty of time on the first sections for all testing, and it made sense to leave the trains that would run to Swansea until last.

Of course, after that various things did get changed, with GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) having to countersign some of them. How much free choice they had in that I have no idea; nor (for example) when the HST withdrawal schedule was fixed, what were the IET delivery dates and OLE extent being promised at the same time?

[NickB]

[/quote]

................so if this was the case, why were we promised all the wonders of additional capacity by GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)? I do not recall any of the Famous Five advertisements or other declarations from on high being tempered with the type of caveats to which you allude (and which I don't doubt are accurate!)
[/quote]

Eureka!!  I’ve finally worked it out!!  I could never understand the link between GwR and The Famous Five campaign, but now it’s obvious - it’s the five car short formed services.  😉

[Timmer]

I’ve noticed the Famous Five have appeared to have gone to ground on the website and social media. Either because the campaign is over or it’s been parked in the sidings owing to the embarrassment of its fantasy portrayal of travelling GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway).

Every time they ran an add on Facebook the amount of ridicule they use to receive.

Does the ad still appear on TV? I very rarely watch anything on ITV.

[81F]

GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) sponsors the Meridian weather forecast on the ITV so the Famous Five get an airing at least twice at peak time between 1800 and 1900.

[grahame]

I’ve noticed the Famous Five have appeared to have gone to ground on the website and social media. ...

They are revising for and sitting their GCSEs ...

[NickB]

GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) sponsors the Meridian weather forecast on the ITV so the Famous Five get an airing at least twice at peak time between 1800 and 1900.

Its the only thing of GWR's that runs to schedule in peak.