Avocet Line - Exeter to Exmouth - incidents and events; services, stock and related improvements

[whole diary]

[Chris from Nailsea]

A true Scout, relex109! 

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

A true Scout, relex109! 

haha 

[lympstone_commuter]

Thanks all for the prompt and interesting replies.

Pacers are rubbish but taking the *national* view I can see why we have them. (There's a stock shortage so somebody has to. Exmouth to Exeter is sufficiently short for their rubbishness not to be too much of an issue - provided they run in multiple in the peak. Barnstaple is a different story of course.)

Electrification would be wonderful - but even as a relative youngster I'm not holding my breath...

Incidentally - wouldn't it make sense for virtually all future electrification to be 25kV AC (except perhaps pockets of Southern infill)? Dual voltage units seem fairly common these days and presumably are of greater value to leaseco's on account of flexibility. So it could be under the wires to Basingstoke and then 3rd rail to Waterloo! 

 

[eightf48544]

Electrification would be wonderful - but even as a relative youngster I'm not holding my breath...

Incidentally - wouldn't it make sense for virtually all future electrification to be 25kV AC (except perhaps pockets of Southern infill)? Dual voltage units seem fairly common these days and presumably are of greater value to leaseco's on account of flexibility. So it could be under the wires to Basingstoke and then 3rd rail to Waterloo! 

 

Yes electrifcation is good. I would suggest Salisbury as the end of third rail as this gives one changeover point. The lines from Southampton/Eastleigh and Basingstoke third rail and lines to Exeter and Westbury overhead. If the wires go to Basingstoke then either Salisbury or both Southampton and Easleigh become changeover points.

However, that still leaves Reading  Basingtoke which could be third rail but that would mean conductor rails through Reading staion, not a good idea. So Basingstoke will be a changeover point in any case.

The choice for Southampton/Eastleigh  Salisbury thus reamains open.  Do you have three interchanges or two?

[Btline]

I would consider the WOEML as Southern Infill.

Why bother having trains switch half way - it's not like the Thameslink route?

I would have thought the people living along the line would prefer not having wires. I would not like wires, as it would ruin the consistency. (but that's just me!)

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

I would consider the WOEML as Southern Infill.

Why bother having trains switch half way - it's not like the Thameslink route?

I would have thought the people living along the line would prefer not having wires. I would not like wires, as it would ruin the consistency. (but that's just me!)

third rail looks much better

[gaf71]

im really sorry i misread your post, thats basically the same thing as im saying, but if fgw didnt have to worry about the tarka line the exmouth to paignton route could become alot more frequent

it would also offer another station direct services to london, paignton already has this

Do you really think SWT^▸ (South West Trains) will run to Barnstaple, when they have already decided to stop services past Exeter from December?

[John R]

Why bother having trains switch half way - it's not like the Thameslink route?

Hardly a bother to change at Salisbury. Think of all the changes that North London services used to have (although interestingly overhead is gradually replacing third rail on that route, with another section about to switch.) 

Third rail is not allowed except for limited infill due to 'Elf 'n Safety, which has been the case for many years. I doubt whether Salisbury-Exeter would count as infill, particularly given dual units are now commonplace. 

[paul7575]

im really sorry i misread your post, thats basically the same thing as im saying, but if fgw didnt have to worry about the tarka line the exmouth to paignton route could become alot more frequent

it would also offer another station direct services to london, paignton already has this

Do you really think SWT^▸ (South West Trains) will run to Barnstaple, when they have already decided to stop services past Exeter from December?

It was the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) that decided SWT would not run beyond Exeter, it was clearly stated in the 2007 franchise invitation to tender that the service would cease in December 2010. IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly) the reasoning is partly to increase FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s revenue on the route, as well as allegedly provide more stock for the east of Exeter service. 

I'm sure SWT would run wherever the DfT required them to (Barnstaple for example) if the price was right...

Paul

[The Grecian]

The new Network RUS^▸ (Route Utilisation Strategy) from NR^» (Network Rail - home page) has a cost benefit ratio for Basingstoke-Exeter electrification of 3:1 and surprisingly it's one of the higher placed schemes (though still behind the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) and MML^» (Midland Main Line. - about) obviously). Of course it's just a wishlist so most of these schemes will still be waiting to happen when Exeter City take their rightful place in the Premier League...

Regarding the through trains beyond Exeter, I don't think they're really needed. Exeter-Yeovil trains are always busy if 3 car and busy in the peak at 6 car, though not usually full. Yeovil eastwards is nearly always busy with 6 cars. In comparison, my experience is that west of Exeter SWT^▸ (South West Trains) are rarely more than 1/3 full outside the summer holidays (apart from the 1749 from Exeter) and certainly less full than the other operators. The units would be much better used east of Exeter. The biggest loser will be Ivybridge, although I'm sure the Riviera would like a few extra fast services to compensate.

[vacman]

The new Network RUS^▸ (Route Utilisation Strategy) from NR^» (Network Rail - home page) has a cost benefit ratio for Basingstoke-Exeter electrification of 3:1 and surprisingly it's one of the higher placed schemes (though still behind the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) and MML^» (Midland Main Line. - about) obviously). Of course it's just a wishlist so most of these schemes will still be waiting to happen when Exeter City take their rightful place in the Premier League...

The RUS is suggesting 25kv overhead for Basingstoke to Exeter, like your joke about Exeter City getting into the Premier league, you should be a comedien!!!

[gaf71]

im really sorry i misread your post, thats basically the same thing as im saying, but if fgw didnt have to worry about the tarka line the exmouth to paignton route could become alot more frequent

it would also offer another station direct services to london, paignton already has this

Do you really think SWT^▸ (South West Trains) will run to Barnstaple, when they have already decided to stop services past Exeter from December?

It was the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) that decided SWT would not run beyond Exeter, it was clearly stated in the 2007 franchise invitation to tender that the service would cease in December 2010. IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly) the reasoning is partly to increase FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s revenue on the route, as well as allegedly provide more stock for the east of Exeter service. 

I'm sure SWT would run wherever the DfT required them to (Barnstaple for example) if the price was right...

Paul

And there is no way the DFT^▸ (Department for Transport) will ask them to run to Barnstaple before the end of the current FGW franchise, which I believe is 2013 at the earliest, but more likely 2016. So basically, it ain't going to happen any time soon!

[Chris from Nailsea]

From the Exmouth Journal:

The misery of rail passengers on the Exmouth to Exeter line Avocet^▸ (Branch line from Exeter to Exmouth) who have had to endure 18 months of travelling on creaky rolling stock - originally mothballed when Margaret Thatcher was still in power - could be at an end.

A dozen 142 trains without air-conditioning, known as "pacers", had been transferred to Exeter from Manchester in 2007 to replace a smaller number of more comfortable, air-conditioned trains, which were required by new franchises in the midlands and north, writes David Beasley.

However, these pacers, which were forced on First Great Western by the Department of Transport, could be phased out again next year, once other companies get new rolling stock.

A spokesperson for First Great Western said: "The lease on some of the fleet we currently use on the Avocet branch line ends in June next year. We are in discussions with the Department for Transport and the owners of the rolling stock over replacement trains. These talks are not yet complete and, if we do get replacement trains, it is likely they will come in from other parts of our network. This would not see any changes to service levels on the Avocet line, just slight gains in seating capacity."

Lympstone's Tony Day, the chairman of the Avocet Line Rail Users Group said: "We hope to get replacement trains next year. Hopefully, the 142s would go back up north and we will finally get rid of this old rolling stock. And, when some of the lines in London and the Midlands get new rolling stock, we will get their older trains. Although they won't be new, it's hard to see what they would be giving us would be any worse. Unless, of course, we end up getting cattle trucks and goods wagons."

[devon_metro]

142s are far better than a 158 with duff aircon! The 143s are still going to be down there anyway

[JayMac]

....when Exeter City take their rightful place in the Premier League...

Is that the Premier Division of the Southern Football League to which you refer?