National Railcard discounts - ongoing discussion, no longer date specific

[whole diary]

[ellendune]

I expect there are fraud prevention measures.

Obviously the Rail Delivery Group won't be telling us what they are. 

I am almost into my third year of holding a Senior Git Railcard (I know, I don't look it), and I have been asked to produce it just once.

I have only had one for 5 months and have been asked for it every time I have been asked for my ticket on the train (which is probably only twice out of the about 10 times I have used it) but every time I buy a ticket the old fashioned way I am asked for it.  I am surprised I am not asked for the number when I buy online.

[TonyK]

I have only had one for 5 months and have been asked for it every time I have been asked for my ticket on the train (which is probably only twice out of the about 10 times I have used it) but every time I buy a ticket the old fashioned way I am asked for it.  I am surprised I am not asked for the number when I buy online.

I buy online almost every time. It surprises me that I don't have to enter the number, although there are probably many people who buy tickets for other people. Maybe it would not be possible to insist on the card reference unless tickets are going to be made personal. On the few occasions I have bought a ticket on the train, I produced the card without being asked.

[PhilWakely]

Currently, if a railcard is eyeballed at every available opportunity, there is still no foolproof mechanism to verify the authenticity of the railcard.

There is no central database for railcards bought at ticket offices; not all railcards require photographs and whilst guidelines exist as to what name is printed on a railcard, the cardholders name is a free-format entry field. I've seen cards issued in the name of (eg) 'J Bloggs', when the holders name is actually Mrs Joan Bloggs.

I doubt the level of fraud is particularly high, but the potential is there.

[TonyK]

I suppose that there is also the fact that even if the card is bogus or not the holder's, a ticket has still been purchased, making it less of an issue than downright fare evasion for the hard pressed Train Manager (TM^‡(resolve)).

Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronym

[Tim]

I buy online almost every time. It surprises me that I don't have to enter the number, although there are probably many people who buy tickets for other people.

As I understand it you need a valid rail card to use the appropriate discounted ticket, not to buy it.  I bought some tickets at the weekend for my family to travel in February with a Friends and Family (F&F) railcard discount.  I wasn't planning on buying a Friends & Family (F&F) rail card until shortly before the travel date.  I assume that is all legal. 

Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Abbreviation

[old original]

I buy online almost every time. It surprises me that I don't have to enter the number, although there are probably many people who buy tickets for other people.

As I understand it you need a valid rail card to use the appropriate discounted ticket, not to buy it.  I bought some tickets at the weekend for my family to travel in February with a F&F railcard discount.  I wasn't planning on buying a F&F rail card until shortly before the travel date.  I assume that is all legal. 

Current T's & C's from the F&F railcard website...

"Tickets for your journey should be purchased before boarding the train and when buying tickets you must show the Railcard. This does not apply if there was no ticket office at the station at which you began your journey or if the ticket office was closed and there was no ticket machine from which you could buy discounted tickets."

However I know that this is not always rigidly enforced..

[TonyK]

Current T's & C's from the F&F railcard website...

"Tickets for your journey should be purchased before boarding the train and when buying tickets you must show the Railcard. This does not apply if there was no ticket office at the station at which you began your journey or if the ticket office was closed and there was no ticket machine from which you could buy discounted tickets."

However I know that this is not always rigidly enforced..

I have never waved my card at the computer. So far, I have got away with it.

Being serious, I helped a niece to save a pile of cash with split tickets to Edinburgh. I advocated buying a "Two together" card  as the saving exceeded the cost. We got the tickets two months in advance, the card the day before travel. I guess it's legal because there was no ticket office at my laptop.

[Brucey]

New TVMs^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) installed at some Great Northern stations have a QR^▸ (QR Code - Quick Response code) code scanner above the touchscreen.  As I can see, this serves no purpose at the moment.  I understand that the new app based railcards include a QR code.  I could see this possibly being used as an authentication measure at some point in the future.

Also, on-train QR code checking will become more common (tickets issued on rolls of paper, and some tickets from ticket machines already include a QR code), so I would think checking of the app railcard's barcode could become part of this process.

[JayMac]

I bought my first digital Railcard yesterday. I'm eligible for the Disabled Persons Railcard, but hadn't bothered renewing in 2020 for two reasons - had a car, and lockdown. However, following my renewal of a qualifying state benefit, and in hope that we will see the easing of restrictions as planned, I decided it was time to get my Railcard again. Also in hope that I'll be released from NHS house arrest on 1st April.

The online application and buying process was simple and straightforward. I just had to upload a scan/photo of my qualifying benefit award letter (or proof of age document for aged related Railcards), and a digital passport style photo. The latter was a phone selfie taken against a plain background. I did this yesterday afternoon. I then awaited a download code email. That email arrived at 7am this morning. Much quicker than the old postal method. DSB Railcards have never been available to purchase at stations.

With that download code it's just a matter of installing the Android/iOS Railcard app to one's smartphone, then entering said code when prompted. Et voila, one Railcard stored on my phone.

The security seems pretty good. There's a QR^▸ (QR Code - Quick Response code) code. And out of curiosity I tried every method I could think of to screenshot the Railcard, but all attempts are either blocked or black screened. Even connecting my phone to my Windows laptop and trying 'Print Screen' failed. Top marks to the Rail Delivery Group for the excellent fraud prevention measures.

Now, I just have to hope I get the chance to use it for leisure journeys before too long...

[onthecushions]

....but if your 'phone battery goes flat and the RP inspector can't see evidence of railcard or ticket are you technically not in possession of the required travel documents and therefore committing an offence?

Card is king,

OTC

[MVR S&T]

On train charging point, dont forget your USB lead though...

[JayMac]

....but if your 'phone battery goes flat and the RP inspector can't see evidence of railcard or ticket are you technically not in possession of the required travel documents and therefore committing an offence?

Card is king,

OTC

Phone battery going dead is no more likely than losing or forgetting the card. And the Rail Delivery Group and TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) recognise these things can happen and offer leeway on first 'offence' by allowing you to provide proof after the fact. You can claim back any additional expense (excess/penalty fare) on that first 'offence'. Lose your card a second time, or allow your battery to go flat twice, then that's you're own fault.

Battery anxiety is a thing - I suffer from it. But I always try to ensure I go out fully charged, and if it's a longer trip I'll have a charger on me. Most long distance and regional trains have power sockets these day.

[Clan Line]

I always try to ensure I go out fully charged, and if it's a longer trip I'll have a charger on me. Most long distance and regional trains have power sockets these day.

It's well worth buying a 'phone charging battery pack. You don't have to worry about finding a (working) USB socket - also they will charge your 'phone a lot quicker than a socket. I got an excellent one from Aldi, an assortment of sockets on it and is appreciably smaller than my 'phone.
I stuck a Velcro patch onto it so that I can also mount it on plate which fits the flash socket on my Digital Single-Lens Reflex camera (DSLR) to recharge my camera battery as well.


Edit:VickiS - Clarifying Abbreviation

[JayMac]

also they will charge your 'phone a lot quicker than a socket.

That depends on the charger, and the phone's battery capacity and condition. My current phone charger pushes 10V at 5A for 50 watts when plugged in at home. 0-40% in ten minutes. Full charge in under 40 minutes. I don't know of any compact power banks (ie. smaller than the phone) that'll push 50 watts. I'd be wary of any power bank from Aldi that claims a high wattage!

Does anyone know what amperage on train sockets typically push?