Network Rail industrial action 2015.

[whole diary]

[IndustryInsider]

Quite possibly.    How about the other example industries I gave?

[ellendune]

the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.

Are you saying that you believe London is the only place of any importance ?

or

That the English UK^▸ (United Kingdom) Government and Parliament seem to believe this, so there's not a lot we can do about it? 

I think a lot of people in the UK are getting pretty sick of this Londonist view of the UK and you might discover that out here in "the provinces" real people might think a bit differently to their national politicians. 

[ChrisB]

Quite possibly.    How about the other example industries I gave?

I'll leave the OP^▸ (Original Poster / topic starter) to answer your point in full.

[TaplowGreen]

the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.

Are you saying that you believe London is the only place of any importance ?

or

That the English UK^▸ (United Kingdom) Government and Parliament seem to believe this, so there's not a lot we can do about it? 

I think a lot of people in the UK are getting pretty sick of this Londonist view of the UK and you might discover that out here in "the provinces" real people might think a bit differently to their national politicians. 

No, I am saying that the rail unions have the ability to bring London to a halt, by preventing  over 1 million people getting to work by their usual means......I don't underestimate the effect it has elsewhere too, and as someone who is from "the provinces" I don't underestimate the effect a daily 3rd rate rail system has elsewhere either......it's simply that it has more cost,effect and profile in London than anywhere else, unless you'd like to tell me about another major UK city where 80% of the workforce use surface rail and/or the Underground daily?

[IndustryInsider]

Quite possibly.    How about the other example industries I gave?

I'll leave the OP^▸ (Original Poster / topic starter) to answer your point in full.

Fair enough.  Let's hope he does, because whilst the union movement's ability to cause the havoc it did in the 70s/80s has no doubt been diminished (and I have a fair amount of sympathy for the views he expressed on that period), I'm not at all sure that the railway industry is the only 'meat eating' dinosaur that's left.

Anyway, the strike has been called off with a reasonable amount of notice so let's hope the long period since the last national rail strike continues for many more years.  In fact the amount of strike action on the national rail network that had any significant impact in recent times in very small.  It's really only the London Unserground that has caused any real strife since the turn of the century.

[broadgage]

the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.

How about teachers, firefighters, ambulance crews, pilots, air traffic controllers?  Are you saying they have no 'power' anymore?

Teachers seem to strike fairly regularly, and apart from parents having to make other child care arrangements, no one much cares.
Firefighters have struck several times recently, with surprisingly little effect.
Ambulance crews striking could be serious.
Airline pilots strike from time to time, but the dispute usually only affects one airline, so customers simply use another.
Air traffic controllers famously struck in the USA some years ago, and were sacked. permanently !

[IndustryInsider]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Broadgage.  Pretty reasonable ones they are too.  A shame that the OP^▸ (Original Poster / topic starter) doesn't appear to want to bother to add his.

[TaplowGreen]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Broadgage.  Pretty reasonable ones they are too.  A shame that the OP^▸ (Original Poster / topic starter) doesn't appear to want to bother to add his.

If you mean me (feel free to use my name if you do!), I agree with Broadgage's analysis, he puts it far more succinctly than I could!

[Chris from Nailsea]

My thanks to all who have posted here, and in such polite terms, even where their personal opinions clearly differ. 

[TaplowGreen]

My thanks to all who have posted here, and in such polite terms, even where their personal opinions clearly differ. 

Hear Hear! (or should that be "Hell, Yeah"?) 

[Chris from Nailsea]

Thanks, TaplowGreen 

May I ask, in what particular service industry are you involved, where summary dismissal is an option?

I only ask because, in my own previous employment area (financial services), it can apparently occur: See http://www.itv.com/news/update/2015-01-07/man-sacked-from-stockbrokers-over-i-hit-a-cyclist-tweet/

Chris from Nailsea. 

[Cynthia]

Looking more and more likely an agreement will be reached with RMT^▸ (National Union of Rail, Maritime & Transport Workers)/UNITE as the TSSA^» (Transport Salaried Staffs' Association - about) have now reached agreement.

Good.  I am generally to the left politically, but I have no time for UNITE and their leader Len Mccluskey. It is to a large extent UNITE's fault that we have 5 more years of Tory government because it was UNITE that foisted the unelected Ed Milliband onto the Labour Party.   

Moving away from the thread subject somewhat, but, Tim, I'm rather confused by your comment about Ed Miliband being foisted onto the Labour Party.  If you're generally 'left', that shouldn't have worried you too much?  Who would you have chosen as leader then?  And perhaps more to the point now, who should be chosen to replace him?

[TaplowGreen]

Thanks, TaplowGreen 

May I ask, in what particular service industry are you involved, where summary dismissal is an option?

I only ask because, in my own previous employment area (financial services), it can apparently occur: See http://www.itv.com/news/update/2015-01-07/man-sacked-from-stockbrokers-over-i-hit-a-cyclist-tweet/

Chris from Nailsea. 

Chris - I have worked in a number of service industries/sectors, both private and public sector mainly in the R & M area.....in each of these, I have known a number of cases of gross misconduct (which I would argue is the category in the case under discussion constitutes) resulting in dismissal - obviously lower down the scale there are oral/written/final written warnings.

Poor behaviour is generally tolerated far more in the public/quasi public sector in my experience.

I note that this incident made it onto the front page of the Sunday Telegraph yesterday along with an apology from FGW^▸ (First Great Western).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-32857408

[ellendune]

... I have known a number of cases of gross misconduct (which I would argue is the category in the case under discussion constitutes) resulting in dismissal

Gross misconduct is usually only for things like intoxication (whether from drink or drugs), fighting or other physical abuse, indecent behaviour, theft, dishonesty, sabotage, serious breaches of health and safety rules, discrimination, harassment and gross insubordination. 

[grahame]

... I have known a number of cases of gross misconduct (which I would argue is the category in the case under discussion constitutes) resulting in dismissal

Gross misconduct is usually only for things like intoxication (whether from drink or drugs), fighting or other physical abuse, indecent behaviour, theft, dishonesty, sabotage, serious breaches of health and safety rules, discrimination, harassment and gross insubordination. 

I have - once - had to follow the "Gross Misconduct" line with an (became-ex) employee which involved four of the things you list. Thoroughly unpleasant for all concerned, and even then it was done with the thought "was this just an exceptional circumstance that's unlikely to happen again".   In the same circumstance, I would do the same again - but I would still ask myself the same question, and take a more measured approach if I felt there was any prospect of that being practical.

Coming back later to clarify my comment ... - I was answering Ellendune's comment on gross misconduct, and I have seen nothing what so ever to indicate any of those grounds in the matter under discussion.   I suppose my point was to suggest that the story as reported doesn't indicate to me anything along these lines, and to illustrate the stark difference between what's reported and such a case.