Quiet Carriage / Coach: restrictions and issues - ongoing discussion, merged topic

[whole diary]

[Westernchallenger]

That's what I meant to say! But NX should be commended for offering the choice of accommodation inc airline/table, face/back, near toilets/not and of course quiet coach! What I would like to know is how the Trainline booking engine, which I believe is behind pretty well all of the various TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) fronts, allocates seats? In particular, now that NX ask if you want to select the quiet coach, are reservations only made in coach B on NXEC^▸ (National Express East Coast) when this is the case?

One particular problem on GW^▸ (Great Western) is where people travelling on advance purchase tickets are allocated reservations in coach A when they didn't ask for it.   

[Andy]

I smoke. I hate mobile phones.

As a smoker who has had to adapt to 5 hour journeys between Paddington & Cornwall sans cigarette, I frequently have the fantasy of lighting up and blowing smoke right in the faces of anyone using a mobile phone inconsiderately on the train. Two wrongs don't make a right, I know, but I'd takel a perverse pleasure in the fact that that I was pissing them off with my smoke pollution as much as they were me with their noise pollution.

Imo ALL coaches should be mobile-free. If people want to use them, they should go between the coaches and be grateful; smokers don't even have that option.

While in griping mode, the arrogance of people who litter public spaces, such as trains, without any thought for fellow users or those who have to clean up after them, drives me ballistic, too.



 

[devon_metro]

Mobile Phones don't cause cancer though do they (not according to the official research at least)

Sitting in a smokey carriage would be awful whereas somebody on the mobile isn't really affecting everybody and causing them health problems.

Personally I think smoking should be banned totally as it is perhaps the most selfish thing you can do, how many non smokers want to 'enjoy' () other peoples smoke fumes in public!

[Btline]

I smoke. I hate mobile phones.

As a smoker who has had to adapt to 5 hour journeys between Paddington & Cornwall sans cigarette, I frequently have the fantasy of lighting up and blowing smoke right in the faces of anyone using a mobile phone inconsiderately on the train. Two wrongs don't make a right, I know, but I'd takel a perverse pleasure in the fact that that I was pissing them off with my smoke pollution as much as they were me with their noise pollution.

Imo ALL coaches should be mobile-free. If people want to use them, they should go between the coaches and be grateful; smokers don't even have that option.

While in griping mode, the arrogance of people who litter public spaces, such as trains, without any thought for fellow users or those who have to clean up after them, drives me ballistic, too.



 

Ok, I agree that moblies should be banned from passenger saloons, but banning smoking in trains is good!

Why not try and give up, using the 5hr journey to help you.

Or of course, you could do a Charles Kennedy and smoke out of the window at 125mph!

[Andy]

The jury's still out on whether or not there's a link between mobiles and cancer but that debate (and the one about banning smoking totally) is not the point here: even back when smoking was allowed, it was only allowed in a designated smoking carriage. I accept the ban on smoking in trains and that's all that matters here.
 
My point was that in a confined public space, mobile use is selfish and annoying. It's not just the damn mobiles going off and disturbing people from working or sleeping but the often lengthy high-volume conversations people have too.

 

[Shazz]

The new National Express East Coast website allows you to make a number of choices when booking a seat including quiet coach. NX also don't charge a booking fee unlike the Trainline.

thetrainline doesn't charge a booknig fee. It charges a transaction fee on credit cards. use a debit card and it's free

OK maybe they do now, I'll just book with virgin instead

[jane s]

Just seen this on the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) website! Looks like they are paying attention.....

"What plans does FGW have to improve the signage and announcements in quiet coaches to make it easier for the train manager, and other passengers, to ask customers using mobile telephones, listening to audible personal stereos etc or generally making a lot of noise to desist, cease or otherwise stop their anti-social activities.
There used to be distinctive anti-macassars (now removed), posters at ends of coaches (also removed) and fairly prominent window labels (now  smaller).....   A large sign at the coach entrance might also help too."

"We carried out some robust customer research on this during January, the aim being to get some definitive feedback from customers to help us redefine the policy. The policy as it stands is very outdated and does not really address the main concerns, i.e. noise and distraction. There has been more emphasis on what technological equipment can't be used, but technology has changed (ipods, pdas, blackberries, laptops - none of which is addressed in the policy), and unlike people chatting, the use of some of it does not necessarily make noise (i.e. texting to say you may be late). Once we really understand the core concerns, then we can understand what the policy should/not allow and what needs to be communicated.   We expect the policy will make more emphasis on noise volumes. In the mean time we're looking at improving the labelling and posters in the carriages.
Lisa Sampson, Leisure Segment Manager - Marketing"

[miniman]

Would also be nice if they turned down the volume on the PA^▸ (Public Address) announcements in the quiet coaches!

[devon_metro]

Probably not feasable due to safety/fact some people are hard of hearing anyway.

[willc]

but technology has changed (ipods, pdas, blackberries, laptops - none of which is addressed in the policy

Maybe FGW^▸ (First Great Western) should try reading their own website, the following extract from which appears to cover all electronic devices perfectly well.

We ask that people who sit in the Quiet Carriage respect other passengers and:
Use their mobile phones in the vestibule and not in the carriage and keep them on silent throughout the journey.
Do not listen to personal stereos or other electronic equipment such as portable DVD players.
Keep all other electronic equipment such as laptops and portable games consoles on silent.
Talk quietly when talking to other passengers. 
This way those that wish to have a peaceful, relaxing journey may do so.

Given that a person with a personal stereo usually doesn't know, nor care, what it sounds like to anyone around them, I find the idea of any switch to an "emphasis on noise volumes" worrying. These things should just be banned outright in quiet carriages, full stop.

The present policy, outlined above, seems perfectly adequate, if only FGW could be bothered to provide clearly visible signs and special antimacassars again - as well as some of those little stickers below the windows which most Adelantes also had in coach A - and get train crews to: a. Consistently announce the policy on the PA^▸ (Public Address); b. Actively police it when they are in coaches A and G - too many staff simply ignore phones going off, nor do they often deal with Jane's original bugbear, the group of people who just won't shut up, and who, like personal stereo users, don't care about the volume or those sitting around them.

And why did it take until January to look at this properly? I gave them feedback about the lack of adequate notices after my first trip on a refurbished 125 many months ago, and can't imagine I was alone. Nor can I imagine I was the only one who was, frankly, fobbed off with a load of waffle.

[Phil]

They could at least install overhead indicators at the end of the carriages (as many suburban trains have) showing the routine safety announcements and next and subsequent stops. The PA^▸ (Public Address) could be used for apologies about being stuck behind slow running trains and requests to remove baggage from seats. That would at least cut down the number of intrusive announcements that are made throughout the journey.

[Mookiemoo]

but technology has changed (ipods, pdas, blackberries, laptops - none of which is addressed in the policy

Maybe FGW^▸ (First Great Western) should try reading their own website, the following extract from which appears to cover all electronic devices perfectly well.

We ask that people who sit in the Quiet Carriage respect other passengers and:
Use their mobile phones in the vestibule and not in the carriage and keep them on silent throughout the journey.
Do not listen to personal stereos or other electronic equipment such as portable DVD players.
Keep all other electronic equipment such as laptops and portable games consoles on silent.
Talk quietly when talking to other passengers. 
This way those that wish to have a peaceful, relaxing journey may do so.

I have headphones for my personal stereo designed not to emit noise other than to me - they werent cheap mind

But - I would object if I were told to stop using it because iPods were not allowed.

No one can heat mine (not that I use it often like)
Given that a person with a personal stereo usually doesn't know, nor care, what it sounds like to anyone around them, I find the idea of any switch to an "emphasis on noise volumes" worrying. These things should just be banned outright in quiet carriages, full stop.

The present policy, outlined above, seems perfectly adequate, if only FGW could be bothered to provide clearly visible signs and special antimacassars again - as well as some of those little stickers below the windows which most Adelantes also had in coach A - and get train crews to: a. Consistently announce the policy on the PA^▸ (Public Address); b. Actively police it when they are in coaches A and G - too many staff simply ignore phones going off, nor do they often deal with Jane's original bugbear, the group of people who just won't shut up, and who, like personal stereo users, don't care about the volume or those sitting around them.

And why did it take until January to look at this properly? I gave them feedback about the lack of adequate notices after my first trip on a refurbished 125 many months ago, and can't imagine I was alone. Nor can I imagine I was the only one who was, frankly, fobbed off with a load of waffle.

[swlines]

When I'm on my iPod touch in a quiet coach, I generally ensure I'm sat out of the way and that I can hear the train easily over the music. I normally find this a good measure as to whether others can hear my music.

[Chris from Nailsea]

Would also be nice if they turned down the volume on the PA^▸ (Public Address) announcements in the quiet coaches!

Actually, I agree with that. While the PA announcements have to compete with all the other background noise in other carriages, there's much less noise in the quiet carriages, so surely there's no need for the announcements to be quite so loud?

 

[willc]

Okay Mookiemoo and Tom, there are some considerate travellers out there, the point is, there are many who aren't and couldn't give a damn about anyone else, and they are the ones who cause the problems.

Once you try to introduce shades of grey into the concept of the quiet coach, you might as well not bother, which I find a pretty depressing thought, since these people already have run of the rest of the train.