New trains from old?

[whole diary]

[grahame]

And it seems that the Association of British Commuters don't want them on Southern ... to be fair, this is a member post on the Facebook page, but it does show an unfortunate negative vote.

So imagine: (ok so it circumstantial however...) a 12 car train being run without an OBS as Southern say they would do this in "Exceptional Circumstances" and the terrifying prospect of this happening ...This is another example of things being done on the cheap....A Private Company purchasing old LU rolling stock in the hope of selling/leasing them on

[IndustryInsider]

Rather ironically it looks like it was the first train to stop at Kenilworth's new station!

Hopefully just a set back rather than the end of the project.

[Chris from Nailsea]

This was published on the WNXX^▸ (Stored Unserviceable, Mainline Locos HQ All Classes) Forum (as a copy of a news release from Vivarail):

... A thorough investigation will take place in conjunction with the Railway Accident Investigation Bureau ...

It's the Rail Accident Investigation Branch - if they can't even get that bit right, it doesn't exactly inspire confidence ... 

[ChrisB]

Rather ironically it looks like it was the first train to stop at Kenilworth's new station!

Hopefully just a set back rather than the end of the project.

Hmm, nice thought, but the station hasn't yet been built!

[IndustryInsider]

No, but looks like it stopped right in the middle of the building site for where it is going to be!

[John R]

Would the RAIB^▸ (Rail Accident Investigation Branch) really be that interested?  Nobody was hurt, and the unit was on trial.  I'd have thought at most they would have asked to be kept informed as to what was the cause and what modifications are proposed to address the failure.  As far as being a setback for Vivarail, it certainly is, and I worry that time is running out for them, with apparently several engine failures in the limited amount of testing done so far. With the East Anglian franchise releasing a fair number of dmus in a couple of years, their window of opportunity appears limited.

[eightf48544]

I would have thought that a fire in the engine module would be of interest to the RAIB^▸ (Rail Accident Investigation Branch). After all the engine module is one of the main innovative features of the 230.

Have just received an email from Vivarail saying:

"Vivarail regrets that this means the planned trial on the Coventry to Nuneaton line will be postponed."

[TonyK]

A train is on fire this afternoon - with three carriages already destroyed in the blaze

Serious - but hardly destroyed!

A lick of paint should suffice.

[SandTEngineer]

A train is on fire this afternoon - with three carriages already destroyed in the blaze

Serious - but hardly destroyed!

A lick of paint should suffice.

...or a new layer of sticky back plastic....

[grahame]

Oh dear ... another train fire.

From The Standard

Rail passengers stranded in London after East Midlands Train catches fire

Rail passengers were left stranded on a train in north London after it caught fire soon after leaving St Pancras.

Travellers on an East Midlands Trains service from London to Nottingham were stuck as the train broke down in Cricklewood soon after it departed at around 12.15pm on Saturday.

The blaze broke out a under one of the train's power cars following a "technical issue" which has caused significant delays for passengers.

Those on the train told how they were left stranded for more than an hour before they left the train.

Katie Calderwood told the Standard: “The train stopped mid-track in Cricklewood and we are waiting for an engineer to come from London.

[snip]

A spokeswoman for East Midlands Trains said: "The 12.15pm St Pancras to Nottingham service was delayed due to a technical issue which occurred near Cricklewood and resulted in a small fire underneath one of the train's power cars.

"The power cars do not hold any passengers and, as the fire was extinguished very quickly by the driver, there was no immediate safety risk to customers on the train.

Picture is a class 222 which (however) has passenger accommodation in the power cars; I suspect an HST^▸ (High Speed Train) incident.   Posting here as a confirmation the train fires are not unique to any type of train.

[Timmer]

Yes the xx.15 STP-NOT services are HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train).

[stuving]

Would the RAIB^▸ (Rail Accident Investigation Branch) really be that interested?  Nobody was hurt, and the unit was on trial.  I'd have thought at most they would have asked to be kept informed as to what was the cause and what modifications are proposed to address the failure.  ...

I did wonder whether there might be some required fire protection system not fitted to these trains as prototypes. That might interest RAIB, along with the rules/principle for allowing prototype or test stock on the network. However, the only thing required on all diesels on trains is fire detection. Fire suppression is required by the TSI only on goods locomotives.

There are other requirements for barriers against fire spread, and for the safe siting and other protective measures for fuel tanks. The other main area of regulations is about minimum distance to run after the fire is detected, which is usually 4 or 15 minutes linked to the length of tunnels on the route. I'm not quite sure how that works for electric trains where the fire is in the working transformer, though. Essential control cables need to follow protected routes, of course.

(See Railway Group Standard GM/RT2130 and the TSI, Reg 1302/2014 - which are similar.)

[stuving]

The obvious source of a problem like this fire is that the companies responsible are operating outside their area of experience. Vivarail was set up specifically for the D-train project, and Revolve Technologies who are making the engine raft (really the whole motor-generator set) have never done one of those let alone one for a train. They were originally racing engine tuners, who have spread into other areas of road vehicle engineering such as military and emission control. There's always a danger in extrapolating too far from what you know - "I can see how to do that" rates as famous last words in that case.

[grahame]

Rather ironically it looks like it was the first train to stop at Kenilworth's new station!

A year early ...

The opening of Kenilworth’s railway station has been delayed until December 2017

... according to the Warwick Courier[/quote]

[stuving]

I did wonder whether there might be some required fire protection system not fitted to these trains as prototypes. That might interest RAIB^▸ (Rail Accident Investigation Branch), along with the rules/principle for allowing prototype or test stock on the network. However, the only thing required on all diesels on trains is fire detection. Fire suppression is required by the TSI only on goods locomotives.

While fire suppression may not be formally required, Hitachi included one in the IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) design:

In addition to the GU, other components installed under the floor of drive cars include the traction converter, fuel tank, fire protection system, and brake system. An automatic fire-fighting system is installed to deal with fires in the top part of the engine. This system is designed to quickly extinguish any fire by using high-pressure nitrogen gas to spray it with water.

(From Hitachi Review Vol. 63 (2014), No. 10, p. 43)